Middle Class was 61% in 1971
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Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
What I remember about the 70s,families could maintain a good lifestyle on one income. Companies took care of their employees. No one I knew growing up had both parents working. Several of my friends' fathers worked factory jobs where they were provided with company cars,country club memberships,excellent insurance and benefits,etc.
I remember as it went into the 80s,the moms had to enter the workforce,company cars were ended,the country club memberships were cancelled,families were no longer able to spend time together,and ALL of my friends parents ended up divorced and families broken up.
Didn't think I would ever read a post from you that I agreed 100% with, but there it is.
My mother used to talk about how when she had my older brother, she was given paid maternity leave by NYC (whom she worked for), and spent three weeks in the hospital recovering (as recommended by her doctors). 2.5 years later, when she had me, maternity leave was unpaid, and she was basically given a 48 hour vamoos notice by the hospital once I was out.
My grandfather was a skilled electrician. With only him working, he supported 5 children, his wife, cash bought his apartment, and cash bought 2 brand new Impalas every model year from 1958-1984. When he retired at 60, they wanted for nothing, and he fulfilled his dream of buying a big piece of land and starting a personal strawberry patch, pear tree orchard, and the tulip garden he died in. My grandfather was a simple man from the South. He never went to business school, engaged in investment schemes, or anything. Just worked, saved, and lived his life.
That's another thing I've noticed. I always read about regular people who had armies of children, supported a wife, and still lived comfortably. Nowadays, people ponder the idea of even having one child.
What I remember about the 70s,families could maintain a good lifestyle on one income. Companies took care of their employees. No one I knew growing up had both parents working. Several of my friends' fathers worked factory jobs where they were provided with company cars,country club memberships,excellent insurance and benefits,etc.
I remember as it went into the 80s,the moms had to enter the workforce,company cars were ended,the country club memberships were cancelled,families were no longer able to spend time together,and ALL of my friends parents ended up divorced and families broken up.
Didn't think I would ever read a post from you that I agreed 100% with, but there it is.
My mother used to talk about how when she had my older brother, she was given paid maternity leave by NYC (whom she worked for), and spent three weeks in the hospital recovering (as recommended by her doctors). 2.5 years later, when she had me, maternity leave was unpaid, and she was basically given a 48 hour vamoos notice by the hospital once I was out.
My grandfather was a skilled electrician. With only him working, he supported 5 children, his wife, cash bought his apartment, and cash bought 2 brand new Impalas every model year from 1958-1984. When he retired at 60, they wanted for nothing, and he fulfilled his dream of buying a big piece of land and starting a personal strawberry patch, pear tree orchard, and the tulip garden he died in. My grandfather was a simple man from the South. He never went to business school, engaged in investment schemes, or anything. Just worked, saved, and lived his life.
That's another thing I've noticed. I always read about regular people who had armies of children, supported a wife, and still lived comfortably. Nowadays, people ponder the idea of even having one child.
Originally Posted By: CT8
The lost Middle/lower middle class has left the U.S. and is appearing in China, Mexico, India and Brazil thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class. Bad for the U.S good for the other people.
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
The lost Middle/lower middle class has left the U.S. and is appearing in China, Mexico, India and Brazil thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class. Bad for the U.S good for the other people.
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Unlike most on here, I WISH we could go back to the late '50s-early '60s economy/U.S. manufacturing base (NO MATTER WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "FALSE" OR REAL!!), just without all of the; sexism, rascism, Mc Carthyism, and theocratic leanings of that era.
Unfortunately, in the evolution of a society/economy social and political activities shape the people. The U.S. was xenophobic before WWII and returned to somewhat of a state of xenophobia after WWII. There was a certain level of post-war patriotism that may also never exist again.
You can't go back. For better or worse, we press on.
Unlike most on here, I WISH we could go back to the late '50s-early '60s economy/U.S. manufacturing base (NO MATTER WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "FALSE" OR REAL!!), just without all of the; sexism, rascism, Mc Carthyism, and theocratic leanings of that era.
Unfortunately, in the evolution of a society/economy social and political activities shape the people. The U.S. was xenophobic before WWII and returned to somewhat of a state of xenophobia after WWII. There was a certain level of post-war patriotism that may also never exist again.
You can't go back. For better or worse, we press on.
Originally Posted By: grampi
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
Their greed leads them to provide the market what it demands; and the market demands cheaper and cheaper garbage. So the answer, it seems, is "both".
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
Their greed leads them to provide the market what it demands; and the market demands cheaper and cheaper garbage. So the answer, it seems, is "both".
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
A friend of mine has 5 kids. His wife goes to work, and almost her entire paycheck goes to the pretax deducted health insurance for the children. What she does take home goes toward daycare for the youngest child. Dunno how they do it.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
A friend of mine has 5 kids. His wife goes to work, and almost her entire paycheck goes to the pretax deducted health insurance for the children. What she does take home goes toward daycare for the youngest child. Dunno how they do it.
Originally Posted By: uc50ic4more
Originally Posted By: grampi
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
Their greed leads them to provide the market what it demands; and the market demands cheaper and cheaper garbage. So the answer, it seems, is "both".
It wouldn't bother me one bit if all of the Dollar Stores (and their likes) went away...I would rather pay a little extra for quality products...
Originally Posted By: grampi
Thanks to the purchasing habits of the U.S. middle class? You sure it isn't because of corporate greed?
Their greed leads them to provide the market what it demands; and the market demands cheaper and cheaper garbage. So the answer, it seems, is "both".
It wouldn't bother me one bit if all of the Dollar Stores (and their likes) went away...I would rather pay a little extra for quality products...
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
A friend of mine has 5 kids. His wife goes to work, and almost her entire paycheck goes to the pretax deducted health insurance for the children. What she does take home goes toward daycare for the youngest child. Dunno how they do it.
Sounds like she can't afford not to?
I guess if your "must have" list includes another $30k SUV and only the best $50+/day daycare, you can blow through lots of money on kids.
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Even with both husband and wife working full time, some families just have trouble making ends meet.
I agree that people want cheaper junk to buy at local retail store.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
A friend of mine has 5 kids. His wife goes to work, and almost her entire paycheck goes to the pretax deducted health insurance for the children. What she does take home goes toward daycare for the youngest child. Dunno how they do it.
Sounds like she can't afford not to?
I guess if your "must have" list includes another $30k SUV and only the best $50+/day daycare, you can blow through lots of money on kids.
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Sounds like she can't afford not to?
I guess if your "must have" list includes another $30k SUV and only the best $50+/day daycare, you can blow through lots of money on kids.
If someone's got it, I understand it. If they don't, I'm confused.
Sounds like she can't afford not to?
I guess if your "must have" list includes another $30k SUV and only the best $50+/day daycare, you can blow through lots of money on kids.
If someone's got it, I understand it. If they don't, I'm confused.
Some career paths make it hard to take a 5-10 year break for kids.
Sometimes you get one kids in school but the other in daycare.
Daycares, BTW, are full up around me. When the economy's in the dump, either parent being out-of-work results in the kids yanked from daycare. So the opposite is also true-- can't get a spot! When you get one, you don't want to lose it.
Sometimes you get one kids in school but the other in daycare.
Daycares, BTW, are full up around me. When the economy's in the dump, either parent being out-of-work results in the kids yanked from daycare. So the opposite is also true-- can't get a spot! When you get one, you don't want to lose it.
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Unlike most on here, I WISH we could go back to the late '50s-early '60s economy/U.S. manufacturing base (NO MATTER WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "FALSE" OR REAL!!), just without all of the; sexism, rascism, Mc Carthyism, and theocratic leanings of that era.
Unfortunately, in the evolution of a society/economy social and political activities shape the people. The U.S. was xenophobic before WWII and returned to somewhat of a state of xenophobia after WWII. There was a certain level of post-war patriotism that may also never exist again.
You can't go back. For better or worse, we press on.
True, but we had BETTER "press on" with some kind of controls/limits (as much as some of certain worldviews hate them, or think that they "don't work") to the completely one sided trade we currently have, as this CANNOT be sustained, and will be the death of U.S.
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Unlike most on here, I WISH we could go back to the late '50s-early '60s economy/U.S. manufacturing base (NO MATTER WHETHER OR NOT IT WAS "FALSE" OR REAL!!), just without all of the; sexism, rascism, Mc Carthyism, and theocratic leanings of that era.
Unfortunately, in the evolution of a society/economy social and political activities shape the people. The U.S. was xenophobic before WWII and returned to somewhat of a state of xenophobia after WWII. There was a certain level of post-war patriotism that may also never exist again.
You can't go back. For better or worse, we press on.
True, but we had BETTER "press on" with some kind of controls/limits (as much as some of certain worldviews hate them, or think that they "don't work") to the completely one sided trade we currently have, as this CANNOT be sustained, and will be the death of U.S.
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
When we started a family we realized that this was true, as my wife worked at a university. She did have a better healthcare plan, but the end sum, after all the effort of getting the kid out of the door etc, was... her job would pay for healthcare. Wasn't worth it, so she stayed home.
We lucked out. To keep her sanity she started taking a course per semester on line, got her masters, and landed a very part time teaching job, online. And works some other jobs, but is able to tapdance around kids with those. I wouldn't say we live simply but we are pretty content.
Something I can't figure out is the Wife has kids and heads back to work, paying for expensive daycare and a second SUV. By the those expenses are paid, is there anything left from her paycheck?
When we started a family we realized that this was true, as my wife worked at a university. She did have a better healthcare plan, but the end sum, after all the effort of getting the kid out of the door etc, was... her job would pay for healthcare. Wasn't worth it, so she stayed home.
We lucked out. To keep her sanity she started taking a course per semester on line, got her masters, and landed a very part time teaching job, online. And works some other jobs, but is able to tapdance around kids with those. I wouldn't say we live simply but we are pretty content.
Born into a 'middle class' family during '62. Still middle class.
Made some good career and financial decisions early on.
Got lucky in the game of life.
Lady does volunteer/philanthropic work and stays active in the community.
We're very fortunate and grateful.
Made some good career and financial decisions early on.
Got lucky in the game of life.
Lady does volunteer/philanthropic work and stays active in the community.
We're very fortunate and grateful.
The 'American Dream' is still alive.... just more difficult to obtain.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The 'American Dream' is still alive.... just more difficult to obtain.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
Better description would be that the American Dream is on life support
The 'American Dream' is still alive.... just more difficult to obtain.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
Better description would be that the American Dream is on life support
Originally Posted By: GiveMeAVowel
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The 'American Dream' is still alive.... just more difficult to obtain.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
Better description would be that the American Dream is on life support
So what is the American Dream? Space race? Done that. Invent the Internet? Done that. Conquer foreign worlds? Done that, now we just half-conquer. What's the next thing to unite behind? We're just bickering.
Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
The 'American Dream' is still alive.... just more difficult to obtain.
A few doors of opportunity opened up for me after I had to put in time and effort busting my butt. Lots of people 20-35 years old think the American Dream is dead, they are wrong.
Better description would be that the American Dream is on life support
So what is the American Dream? Space race? Done that. Invent the Internet? Done that. Conquer foreign worlds? Done that, now we just half-conquer. What's the next thing to unite behind? We're just bickering.
6 pages? 56,000 members,,,,,anyone else got an opinion ?
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