HPL Oil Concerns

[TomYoung]

If you are questioning the "are" I am not so sure this was improperly stated: batch--a quantity or consignment of goods produced at one time.

Subject verb agreement is the concern. In this case the subject is "batch," which is singular without question and the verb should be "is." There are some circumstances that allow collective, but singular nouns to use plural verbs, but not here. Sometime the British will use plural when referring to specific groups: e.g. Barclays are the best bank in England. There is no ambiguity here. I would note that I mistakenly attributed this grammar error to HPL, which actually has a pretty creditable website.

P.S. I'm not worthy to get replies from MolaKule!

 

[4WD]

Subject verb agreement is the concern. In this case the subject is "batch," which is singular without question and the verb should be "is." There are some circumstances that allow collective, but singular nouns to use plural verbs, but not here. Sometime the British will use plural when referring to specific groups: e.g. Barclays are the best bank in England. There is no ambiguity here. I would note that I mistakenly attributed this grammar error to HPL, which actually has a pretty creditable website.

P.S. I'm not worthy to get replies from MolaKule!

Can we start with then and than ? It’s bad here, huh ?

 

[TomYoung]

Actually we do have a lot of engine tear down experience with our presence throughout the racing world. We have seen engine life double and in some cases triple over prior products. Is it fair to say you would see the same thing in passenger car engines? No. Racing engines especially very professional ones will run at much greater speeds at a much greater BMEP. From a durability stand point your performance in a high BMEP engine is pretty valuable. Especially if we then apply what we learn in racing to street applications.

What you won’t be seeing in racing engines will be the cleanliness of the oil. However it is common knowledge within the industry which oils clean and those that do not. We do have the luxury of having a super scientist-molecule builder on staff. The materials we use are available to any blender. There is no “magic”. The materials we use are expensive. Very few people would put what we do in the oil and sell it for what we do. I will never die rich by virtue of the profit we make on engine oil. It may appear that way but until you build it and cost it you would not know.

We use our lab to identify synergistic properties between various chemistries, validate them via our professional race teams and then apply what to validated in our finished products.

I would appreciate someone sharing any errors on hplubricants.com and we will fix them. We don’t have a marketing department. We chose a path that has been accurately described in this thread.

I too would like to have a custom bottle. The molds and bottle runs are pretty costly and we really don’t sell the volume to justify multiple semi loads of bottles.

We are very happy to have the relationships we do with team in NASCAR, NHRA, World of Outlaws, Street outlaws etc. Our advertising budget equals our marketing budget. Therefore it is important to note that we don’t write check one to these teams. We have our relationships only because what we we deliver in performance to these teams. It was nice to have someone from Richard Petty’s team speak at our first open house and the Miss Geico people. And this year we were able to meet the people at Elite Motorsports (Erica Enders). Those people who attended were able to hear directly from these people the advantages they have seen.

When chances come up where we can improve packing at an affordable cost I would do it. I don’t see that happening soon.

Our market share will probably never be beyond a needle in a haystack in our field. Our products are definitely not for everyone. But for people that are looking for a top level product…. they will likely become friends. I can tell you directly we appreciate every one of them.

David

PS it is 11:35 at night. I’m at a race track, I did not check this message for spelling.

Kudos to HPL for providing this thoughtful response well after hours on a Saturday Evening. It's another exhibit in the evidence file of folks who care about what they are doing and who are not asleep at the switch.

 

[TomYoung]

Can we start with then and than ? It’s bad here, huh ?

Some presidential candidate needs to make that a plank! Failing that, there is no hope.

 

[mr_boring]

No company needs any certs or even approvals to make a great product. They need quality materials and engineers and formulators to make great products that meet or exceed the expectations/demands of the customers. Joe Amachineman with the right tools and the right steel could build replacement rotors that meet or exceed towing needs for an F350. Without any ISO or any other cert.

I worked for a company that I imagine is similar to HPL. I didn't work there long, but I learned a ton. We made brake pads (primarily) and calipers and rotors. It really makes me appreciate what HPL does. Am I an HPL fan? Not by any stretch of the imagination. For the needs of Bob and Betty Driver in a 2018 Kia driving a couple of hundred miles a week and plan on following the OLM - it's simply more than likely not going to make enough of a difference to make a difference. In cases like this, unless you just want the best and don't care about the cost, even if the 'best' is negligible, oil is oil. Sopus or Mobil or Supertech will all get you a ton of miles in said Kia.

The company I worked for also got a ton of data from both the racing world and the heavy industrial world. And that data was extremely beneficial when we were making brakes for say, F150's or Benz GLA45 AMG pads.

We even had one of those Wizard Tribologists, except she was a Witch Pad Material Wizardess.

 

[zfasts03]

I want to run HPL just for bragging rights among my car friends.

The reality is my cars will rust out before they wear out regardless of what oil I use.

 

[spasm3]

after reading 119 replies to this post... I will stick to Mobil 1....NO reason to change and has been using it since 1975....

Mobil 1, it's great oil, I use it in the mazda for winter. I don't think anyone here is trying to convince others to use HPL. I have only suggested it to someone once, in a specific circumstance.

 

[cammyfive79]

Dang….. now I’m convinced (again) that I should do my first OCI with Euro No VII.

I jest, but because I’m just interested in learning, experimenting, and doing business with genuine folks I’m sure I’ll use HPL at some point just for kicks….and probably the same with Amsoil SS. I realize/expect there will be no real world discernible difference considering my planned 5k OCIs. But….some people spend their free time and money betting on sports, collecting memorabilia, buying designer clothing, etc…..my only really money pits that I expect no real world objective ROI is auto detailing and now oil/miantenance/etc.

 

[bbhero]

Guy, let's back this up a bit here, you keep missing the point by a country mile.

He's making these observations about a site THAT IS NOT THEIR SITE.

Here is the OP, in case you don't want to go back and re-read it:


Literally, one of the foundational criticisms of the OP, used to justify what appears to be an allusion to insufficient/inadequate R&D ("I wonder if they have missed any key elements") is based on a site that isn't that of the company in question. The natural inference from this statement is that perhaps they are sloppy in their operations because they are sloppy with their website. But it's not their website.

The site he was reading is this one:
HPL Oil - Superior Lubricants Made in the USA, located in Hebron, IN

Which belongs to the guy that owns Precision Turbo.

The site for the site sponsor, which I've linked twice now, but nobody seemed inclined to make the effort to validate the claims except me, is this one:
High Performance Lubricants | When Results Matter (hplubricants.com)

Which is owned by Dave, who you've seen interact with people on here, including this very thread. Dave also blends the oils for the other company, under contract, which makes it somewhat confusing, given the similarity in names, but that has been discussed on here many times and it would be hard to have missed that in the many threads that have covered it.

Hold on… I just want to make sure…

That was not their site ???



I seriously busted out laughing reading that last night.. For real.

 

[2015Corolla]

Guy, let's back this up a bit here, you keep missing the point by a country mile.

He's making these observations about a site THAT IS NOT THEIR SITE.

Here is the OP, in case you don't want to go back and re-read it:


Literally, one of the foundational criticisms of the OP, used to justify what appears to be an allusion to insufficient/inadequate R&D ("I wonder if they have missed any key elements") is based on a site that isn't that of the company in question. The natural inference from this statement is that perhaps they are sloppy in their operations because they are sloppy with their website. But it's not their website.

The site he was reading is this one:
HPL Oil - Superior Lubricants Made in the USA, located in Hebron, IN

Which belongs to the guy that owns Precision Turbo.

The site for the site sponsor, which I've linked twice now, but nobody seemed inclined to make the effort to validate the claims except me, is this one:
High Performance Lubricants | When Results Matter (hplubricants.com)

Which is owned by Dave, who you've seen interact with people on here, including this very thread. Dave also blends the oils for the other company, under contract, which makes it somewhat confusing, given the similarity in names, but that has been discussed on here many times and it would be hard to have missed that in the many threads that have covered it.

A hipster would nip this in the bud. Or a lawyer.

 

[TiGeo]

Imho, if you don't have certifications on oil that people are looking for and can rely on, perhaps you can run the tests and advise whether they were passed? Don't need to apply for certs if they are too expensive. If it's an option.
E.g. if oil passed API SP test, just say test required for certification was passed.

Because the people you mention are a fraction of a fraction of who they are selling to....why bother? They cater to a different crowd.

 

[MSCH]

Because the people you mention are a fraction of a fraction of who they are selling to....why bother? They cater to a different crowd.

that sums it up. it's a similar thing to dealing with the Amsoil crowd, just a smaller subset.
Yeah, I would say since I know I am just going to be throwing the stuff away in 6 months
it makes no sense to me to pay for something 3 times as expensive but there is that one subset
out there who don't mind..

 

[TiGeo]

(Edited) Great points, and I like the bathroom analogy, if only they were all true. However, the truth is:

The packaging is great*. It’s one of the things I like about HPL.

The misspelling is from a different website!

So, you’re basing your response on errors in other posts, not on any first hand examination.

*Which you would know had you actually bought anything from them.

It's *ok*...the packaging. The shipping boxes are GREAT! The gallon jugs I use are nowhere close to the Liquimoly 5L bottles. No sight window strip on side for partial use, no pull out spout for easy pouring. No ribbed grip areas to hold. The tops weep for paritally used bottled. I couldn't care less BTW but it's also OK to say these aren't the best compared to others....which diminishes IMHO many folks' here credibility in these discussions and leads to some of the 'fanboi/shill" comments here....HPL is good stuff....customer service is excellent....they don't spend money on the soft bits because they don't need to. I do like the 1 gal size better than the 5 qt bottles...smaller to take along.

Here's my latest order complete with stickers (thank you Mary J!).

In use this past weekend laughing at 270 oil temps.

 

[Astro14]

Yes. I stand corrected. The shipping boxes are great.

 

[TiGeo]

Yes. I stand corrected. The shipping boxes are great.

Plus....I use them to ship all my stuff back to FCP Euro for that fat refund!

 

[ka9mnx]

As other have said, HPL blends superior products for a niche market, regardless of approvals. Their approvals come from very demanding racing teams. Also as stated, their products are probably overkill for everyday vehicles. Heck, I consider QSUD Euro 5w-40 overkill for my vehicles. But it is affordable.

 

[TomYoung]

No company needs any certs or even approvals to make a great product. They need quality materials and engineers and formulators to make great products that meet or exceed the expectations/demands of the customers. Joe Amachineman with the right tools and the right steel could build replacement rotors that meet or exceed towing needs for an F350. Without any ISO or any other cert.

I worked for a company that I imagine is similar to HPL. I didn't work there long, but I learned a ton. We made brake pads (primarily) and calipers and rotors. It really makes me appreciate what HPL does. Am I an HPL fan? Not by any stretch of the imagination. For the needs of Bob and Betty Driver in a 2018 Kia driving a couple of hundred miles a week and plan on following the OLM - it's simply more than likely not going to make enough of a difference to make a difference. In cases like this, unless you just want the best and don't care about the cost, even if the 'best' is negligible, oil is oil. Sopus or Mobil or Supertech will all get you a ton of miles in said Kia.

The company I worked for also got a ton of data from both the racing world and the heavy industrial world. And that data was extremely beneficial when we were making brakes for say, F150's or Benz GLA45 AMG pads.

We even had one of those Wizard Tribologists, except she was a Witch Pad Material Wizardess.

I think your opinion on oil is correct, but your thoughts on quality systems are simply not consistent with quality management theory and practice. Documented standards undergird consistency. Procedures must be consistent among employees. Auditing and inspection are crucial. If you don't have a process for improvement, there is no way that you will ever maintain beneficial changes. That one person can produce items that meet requirements without ISO or other certifications does not negate the need for all employees to conform to procedures.

 

[Bullwinkle007]

(Edited) Great points, and I like the bathroom analogy, if only they were all true. However, the truth is:

The packaging is great*. It’s one of the things I like about HPL.

The misspelling is from a different website!

So, you’re basing your response on errors in other posts, not on any first hand examination.

*Which you would know had you actually bought anything from them.

I was basing off someone else. I’ve never used there products especially having Redline readily available and living a couple hour drive away from their mfg facility

 

[Astro14]

I was basing off someone else. I’ve never used there products especially having Redline readily available and living a couple hour drive away from their mfg facility

Look, I think your oil choice works for you. Makes sense to me. No argument there.

But you based much of your previous criticism on spelling, making the “clean bathroom” analogy. I like the analogy. We used to call it “attention to detail” in Naval Aviation.

It turned out that the clean bathroom/spelling criticism was inapplicable to this case, because those who claimed a bunch of spelling errors were on the wrong website. You just dogpiled on what others said.

Now, ironically, you post a reply with a spelling error?

There is an old saying about those who live in glass houses.

 

[Astro14]

I think your opinion on oil is correct, but your thoughts on quality systems are simply not consistent with quality management theory and practice. Documented standards undergird consistency. Procedures must be consistent among employees. Auditing and inspection are crucial. If you don't have a process for improvement, there is no way that you will ever maintain beneficial changes. That one person can produce items that meet requirements without ISO or other certifications does not negate the need for all employees to conform to procedures.

Don’t make presumptions about testing based on externalities like certifications when you don’t know enough about how the company operates in conducting their own testing.

You presume that because they don’t seek certifications by external agencies, that somehow they’re not doing testing. If you had seen their lab, you would understand that they’re testing with greater rigor, using different methods, than required for those certifications, for example, using TGA vs. NOACK.

TGA is considered by many to be the superior method of determining volatility.

It is discussed here:
Post in thread '2012 Mustang V6 - HPL BAS 0W-20 - 16,918 Miles'
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/t...pl-bas-0w-20-16-918-miles.356695/post-6162708