first oil analysis after 12K with synthetic

[todds21]

These are the results I recieved after running Amsoil 10w30 for the past 9 months and 12,000 miles. I have always been real good about changing the dino every 3K and scheduled maintinence. I switched to Amsoil for the extended drain intervals and superior protection. I live in Texas and it gets HOT. I don't know what all the numbers mean, but they said no corrective action was necessary and the oil could have stayed longer. I have changed the filters out at 3 month intervals. Anyone have any feedback on what the numbers mean? This is from my 97 Isuzu Rodeo that currently has 115K on it.

 

[todds21]

sorry.....didn't see the comment about typing the results.

iron 88
chromium 2
lead 14
copper 22
tin 0
aluminum 11
nickel 0
silver 0
silicon 25
boron 27
sodium 7
magnesium 786
calcium 2022
barium 0
phosphorous 1071
zinc 1413
molyboenum 4
titanium 0
vanadium 0
potassium 0
fuel % vol vis @ 40C N/A
vis @ 100C 14.00
water % vol 0
soot/solids N/A
glycol NEG

 

[Quattro Pete]

You went straight from 3K OCI to 12K OCI on an engine that's used dino all its life (~100K miles)? Wow! Brave soul!

Who did the analysis? Blackstone would have probably flagged the high iron. What was the TBN? I wonder how the lab determined that the oil could have stayed longer.

Interestingly, I would have expected to see more soot/solids on a first run of synthetic that would be doing some cleaning after leftover dino crud, but then again, you have been changing the oil filter every 3 months, so maybe all the dirt was trapped in there. Or maybe there was no dirt if like you said you were always doing 3K OCI with good dino.

With all the filter changes, how much top-off oil did you use during this 12K mile OCI?

Personally, I wouldn't be too happy with iron, lead, and silicon this high, but we here on BITOG tend to be pretty anal about these things. Maybe it's not terrible, but it's not all that great either.

 

[todds21]

Oil Analyzers performed the test. This motor is known to consume oil. I have read that Isuzu claims it is acceptable to add a qt every 3K. I probably add 1/2 - 3/4 a quart after the filter swap and then use a quart every 6 weeks. It seems to use more oil on long highway trips. From what I can tell I have no oil leaks. Ever since I bought this new it has used oil, no big deal since I check the oil every time I fill it with gas.

 

[Pablo]

Looks like a OAI report. They don't typically do a soot/solids on gas engines, that' why the NA

Fe and Pb a bit high on paper, but I don't know the baseline for this engine or previous background.

The oil thickened up from 11.8 to 14

Indeed, please post the TBN and also the Oxidation and Nitration numbers.

 

[Quattro Pete]

Doh! You're right Pablo. I mistakenly interpreted N/A as 0.

 

[wavinwayne]

quote:

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Originally posted by todds21:
Oil Analyzers performed the test. This motor is known to consume oil. I have read that Isuzu claims it is acceptable to add a qt every 3K. I probably add 1/2 - 3/4 a quart after the filter swap and then use a quart every 6 weeks. It seems to use more oil on long highway trips. From what I can tell I have no oil leaks. Ever since I bought this new it has used oil, no big deal since I check the oil every time I fill it with gas.

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Have you ever replaced the Isuzu's PCV valve? Many times, replacing this cheap little part can reduce oil consumption.

 

[todds21]

I have replaced the pcv valve and it had no affect on the oil consumption. I will post the TBN and also the Oxidation and Nitration numbers tonight. Thanks for all the feedback, you guys are a wealth of information.

 

[haley10]

I don't pay any attention to the commentary from the Labs. I figure I'm just paying them to produce the correct numbers. I think it is worth it to pay a real analyst to access what those numbers mean.

10-30 ATM will thicken up if you run it long enough, but with all the make-up you've added it should still be in grade. Plus the filter changes and all the make-up are probably making the wear metals look better than they really are.

I think there are some real issues here.

 

[Gary Allan]

quote:

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I think there are some real issues here.

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I think so too. Everything is somewhat elevated beyond what I would want to see over this OCI.

Probably part of it is an air filtration issue since you have just about everything elevated in the presence of elevated Si and some Na.

I haven't spent much time figuring most of these things out since I've seemed to avoid multi-dimensional issues.

Terry would be a highly recommended resource to take advantage of here, IMHO.

 

[Big John]

The oil was in use for 9 months or 36 weeks and he changed the filter every 3 months so,

add 1 quart every 6 weeks = 6 qts
add 1/2 quart every filter change = 1 1/2 qts

A total of 7 1/2 quarts have been run through after the initial fill and speculating a 4 quart sump,that's almost 2 complete changes in the stated 12k oci.I think this is not a good candidate for synthetic oil useage,unless of course I sold AMSoil,then I'd be this guys best friend. I can't read uoa's too well and will not speculate but IMHO this fella is throwing good money away..

 

[TooSlick]

Get a bottle of ARX or some LC, do a 3000 mile flush with either one and then start over....

The silicone is most likely gasket leaching, but may be a leak directly into the crankcase. The very low Cr and Ni would indicate there isn't an intake leak, causing excessive upper cylinder wear.

This profile is typical of high mileage engines using conventional lubricants. In such cases, previously worn metals are incapsulated by sludge/varnish/carbon deposits. Once these are cleaned out by the synlube and go into suspension, they show up as elevated wear rates. I'd expect all these wear metal concentrations to trend down over time.

The vis increase to 14.0 Cst is acceptable; given the suspended/dispersed sludge and elevated oxidation/nitration that results from it.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi Ted,
well I was just wondering - you said this;

"The vis increase to 14.0 Cst is acceptable; given the suspended/dispersed sludge and elevated oxidation/nitration that results from it."

Is this better than thinning (remember your constant references to "excessive shearing in M1 0w-40")?

Just look at the make up oil involved and the three new filters too! It's a worry Ted!!!!

Regards
Doug

 

[TooSlick]

Doug,

In the first extended service interval of sylube in a high mileage engine, thickening of this type is unavoidable - unless an "Auto RX" product is used before hand. At least that has been my experience over many years.

I'd expect to see a more stable EOT viscosity once pre-existing deposits are removed. Using the small # (15%-20%?) of TMP ester in the base stock blend to accomplish this can take >> 10,000 miles, however....In fact, if you try to continually run long drains in an engine like this without first effectively cleaning it, you NEVER get optimum results. Terry Dyson will second this opinion, I believe....

 

[todds21]

TBN 4.44
OXID N/A
NITR N/A

Analysis Recomendations

No corrective action required. Oil is suitable for continued use. Resample at next regular interval oxidation data is temporarily unavailable while we review test methodology.

Thanks again for all the analysis

 

[Pablo]

TBN is still OK.

Bummer they still don't have the Ox and Nit numbers going.

Yes it thickened - but Doug you need to think a bit deeper (not just how to get TS) - if the beast is consuming oil then I'll bet he has ring sealing issues (and or valve stem issues, too) - and this blowby is really hard on the oil and crankcase. Dollars to donuts there is a lot of nasties at the rings......

Bottom line for todds21 - you need at least a 2X AutoRx clean. The extended OCI did not harm your engine in any way - but brought out the fact that you could use a good cleaning.

I'll bet you a coke that after you do the double AutoRx, your oil consumption goes down.

 

[Doug Hillary]

Hi,
Pablo - I did "look deeper" I mostly do!

When an oil gets to around midpoint of the next grade (in ths case SAE40) after such oil inputs and the engine family is "known to use oil" a cost benefit comparison would certainly be where I would start!

Regards
Doug

 

[Pablo]

I agree Doug. But if the engine is in a temporary state of uncleanliness, it it difficult to assess such things. Or maybe not so hard, if one doesn't really care, and just stick with the cheapest oil!

 

[Big John]

quote:

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Originally posted by todds21:
TBN 4.44
OXID N/A
NITR N/A

Analysis Recomendations

No corrective action required. Oil is suitable for continued use. Resample at next regular interval oxidation data is temporarily unavailable while we review test methodology.

Thanks again for all the analysis

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Oil is suitable for continued use????? I would hope so,cause the original fill has been leaked/burned up long ago...Thickening up is the least of this guys worries.RX this engine or go back to dino..