Exorbitant auto repair costs!

[pacem]

If you live in a Big City... beware.

I got to get my car inspected, it passed except for the tag bulb, told me would cost $18 to replace it, $2 for the part and $16 for labor.

No thank you, I can do that myself. Maybe a good deal for a helpless grandma.

Someone else I know had a problem with a compressor or clutch making noises, took it to the same place, and was quoted $1300 to fix it. And that's on a '98 compact Mazda, worth more than the car itself. Their other prices are similar. I think that shops probably makes a million bucks per year, or close to it.

Toyota dealership charged $400 to replace the accessory belts on a 2000 camry (I did them myself in 40 minutes), then $440 to do the timing belt at only 60K miles. I told the owner that it's not necessary at 60K but it was done anyway.

Another horror story, $800 for a brake job on an old Ford truck. Not sure how much stuff was replaced, possibly master cylinder or brake booster? Don't know. Maybe brake lines. In any case, expensive stuff. I replaced the entire brake system on my old Ford pickup for the price of parts.

This explains my conviction to never take the car in for anything, unless you just absolutely have to. The last time I got screwed, I had to have exhaust put on an old Bimmer. I bought it myself ($200 was the cheapest I could find) and paid $100 to have it installed - just the labor to pull a few rusty bolts. I just didn't want to risk my life crawling under a jacked up car.

Most things they charge for are earth-shatteringly simple to do with a few sockets sets and a factory service manual. If you have to take it in, don't take it to someone on a major street who doesn't depend on repeat customers, but to a country mechanic who mainly works with repeat customers. He may take a day or 2 longer but charges much less and does a better job anyway.

Also having on old Ford pickup as a backup for your daily driver helps a lot so that your daily driver is not held hostage by the shop. Never mind the 10mpg it gets, Fix the car when you get to it.

 

[JustinH]

Saturn dealer wanted 140 dollars to put an ignition switch in my car, charging over 60 dollars for the switch. They were telling me they had to reprogram the new switch, and that was part of the labor.

I bought the exact ac delco switch on the internet for 19 dollars, and put it in the car in 30 minutes, and did the self program in my driveway.

 

[JTK]

Dealer service depts in the Buffalo NY area charge ~$500/axle for a brake job that includes rotors/drums and pads/shoes. Any other components and the price goes up from there.

Joel

 

[rjundi]

If you understand basics on what it costs a business to run, you will quickly understand why auto repair costs as much as it does. Especially at a dealer. Independents are less obviously.

You do not work for free, why expect a dealer or mechanic to?

Great you perform work yourself and have the time in life to do so though.

 

[pacem]

yeah, it is a business and in major metro areas taxes are very high, overhead is high, labor is very high, everything is high. There is that cost of living calculator. New Jersey, NYC, D.C. et cetera. Still I think these shops on major roads make a cool mil greenbacks easy.

 

[Chris142]

I do Auto AC. AC repairs can get over $1300 fast. Especially if the bearing wiped the nose of the compressor out.

 

[simple_gifts]

Quote:

---

Someone else I know had a problem with a compressor or clutch making noises, took it to the same place, and was quoted $1300 to fix it. And that's on a '98 compact Mazda, worth more than the car itself.

---

Didn't you ask for the POS discount?

 

[MrCritical]

At our dealership the training costs are $10,000. A month.
Special tool upgrades, replacing broken or worn tools-another $10,000. A month.

Garagekeepers liability insurance-$20,000. A month.

We charge $75 an hour labor turned. Cheapest in my area for dealers. Oil changes are $8 plus parts. We only use GM filters on GM vehicles. The shop absorbs come backs unless the tech made an obvious error. Techs must be up to date on their training to keep their jobs.

 

[tom slick]

Those prices don't sound that far out of line.
$16 is about 10 mins of labor and total time for even a simple job like that can be more then 10 mins.

 

[sciphi]

Yay to country mechanics. I took my car to one recommended by a friend. Mounted/balanced 8 tires, disposed of 3 old ones, and did an alignment for $100 out the door.

Buffalo dealerships are nutty in their prices. Too bad my car ate about 3 sensors over the summer that were a dealership-only part!

 

[Master ACiD]

this is why i do ALL the car work myself. even if i have to buy special tools, i usually come out hundreds ahead in the short run. thousands ahead in the long run.

just the other day i put new pads on my honda crv. i also took the 4 rotors in to be turned. each rotor tuning was 7.50. a set of guardian cheapie pads were $12 per axle. i also bled the brake fluid as specified in the honda manual.

total cost was like $60 after taxes.

i did a timing belt, tendioner, idler, waterpump, cap, rotors, plugs wires, some gaskets etc on my dodge stratus when i got it. it was less than $200 in parts. dealer charges over a grand to do the same job, not including the waterpump and ignition parts!
and thats only 2 examples.

the bottom line is that if you can work on the car youreself and do a good job at it, you can save many , many thousands of dollars over the life of the car. i would guess that i have saved enough money over the years doing this that i could go out and buy a new econobox with the savings and pay for it all at once.

however!... alot of people have no interest working on their own car. many just dont like it. some wont even check their own oil. so it really depends on the person. personally ill never own a car without a dipstick.

 

[XS650]

Masteracid, that's pretty much how I see it too. On top of that, there are lot of jobs that take less time to do yourself than the 2 to 4 trips to a dealer that it typically takes for anything more significant than an oil change.

 

[01rangerxl]

I live in an apartment complex, so what I can do here is limited. They do not allow any kind of vehicle work in the parking lot. For most maintenence, I just use my parents' garage when I visit them. They are two hours away though, so some things have to be done by shops around here. I have found the local Firestone shop to be very good and honest (every Firestone store I have been to seems to be). The local Ford dealer is pretty good too and will sometimes do free diagnostic work (amazing that any dealer would do that).

 

[pacem]

MrCritical

These figures sound a bit steep. Unless it is a very large dealership. Cannot these costs be cut by sending several people to the same class? $10,000 a month in tools? Maybe have a bulk discount from Snap-On or whatever vendor? That's like buying a new Snap-On scanner every month, with much change left over.

I do hear you however. New vehicles are difficult to service. No room in the engine bay, and all these computers, with OBDIII either right here or right around the corner. Diagnostic techniques are different from mere part swapping. If I had to work on the latest and the greatest Mazda, Toyota, Dodge, etc. -- and do it quickly, I would have to have training on it. I can and I have done timing belts but it has taken me a ridiculous amount of time.


Master ACiD,

In my experience, the trick to shade tree auto repair is having a backup vehicle while your primary is down. In addition to tools and Factory Service Manuals. (Haynes is usually mostly useless).

This means you can afford the downtime, look for necessary tools and parts, study the procedure from the Factory Service Manual. If you run into a problem - case in point, replace the timing belt but find out that you also need the timing belt tensioner, and it's Saturday night with everything closed, and even if you order it at a dealership/online it will get here in 5 days. You need a backup car. If I didn't have one, there no way I could have pulled off most of my repairs.

There is a saying that a person inexperienced in a trade will take 7 times longer to do a job than a pro. I have validated this statement time and again with auto repair. Obviously a person who has only one vehicle and neither the time nor the tools nor the DIY attitude, his best bet is to take it to a pro. That's the situation most people find themselves in.

Myself, I buy high end tools for a job if I need them, spare nothing. Snap-On breaker bars and ratchets, socket sets, et cetera. The job still costs you less than at a shop and you get to keep the tools.

I find the DIY attitude rewarding. I once had a vehicle that had issues, both mechanical and cosmetic. For other reasons, I had to sell it. I got an estimate from a dealership at $2500. I got upset, got all the tools and with a lot of patience, fixed all the issues myself over about 8 weekends, and then sold it for almost $7k. That was a sweet coin made, and to reward myself I got a piece of high end astronomy optics.

On the other hand, I've broken things badly by DIY, even though I am usually careful. It's easy to screw up, and sometimes I do. Overtorqued bolts, lost bolts and things in the engine bay, cross-threading. I get better.

 

[MrCritical]

Some tools you order. Some tools GM sends you. Every time there's a new model, a new 4wd system, a new engine/tranny/ac system you get tools. And a bill.
Some of the classes are hands on, so you have to send people. Some you get over the satellite. Every person in the dealership including porters must be certified. Some people must cross train in other departments. Sales/accounting, service, parts, finance, inventory, warranty, customer claims, must all be trained. Monthly. They change an incentive program and you're not trained on it, you could cost the dealership hundreds of thousands of dollars in a month.

Twenty grand a month seems like a lot for garagekeepers insurance. You have too many claims they cancel you. You can't operate without it.

 

[pacem]

P.S.

Having said that, it's good to establish a long term relationship with a "country" mechanic, not these QuickLube type businesses on the side of the main road whose goal is to get as many in and out quickly. Pay him decent coin to do the things you may not be able to do. He has less overhead, no driver to get people around, perhaps not many workers and no snap-on scanners. Anytime I see a place that gives people rides, I think uh-oh, the repair bill is going to be $$$.

One thing out of my reach is exhaust work, since I usually don't have access to a real hydrolic left, and no way will I get crushed to save a hundred greenbacks. That's just one example.

 

[pacem]

MrCritical

Thanks for the education, very interesting. I admit I am totally clueless about the way bigger dealerships operate. Anything you can do to shed some light on this is welcome.

 

[1sttruck]

It's fun trying to keep four cars maintained, which will be eventually five in a couple of years when the youngest starts driving. It seems worth it at todays prices, especially when you can often do better, but often not faster, than the dealer.

 

[Camu Mahubah]

Modern day man is led to believe a career as a mechanic is shameful and low dollar. There was a time when mechanics made good money and were respected. A long time ago.

 

[Shannow]

Yep, mechanics were once respected, and have become a subclass.

Teachers, nurses and engineers are rapidly joining the ranks of the subclass as industry becomes increasingly aetheric.