Does timing belt vs chain influence your used car decisions?

[wemay]

Yes, it does influence my decision.

 

[notharry]

I don’t know… I have a 42 year old OM616, a 41 year old OM617, a 38 year old OM601, and three different 22 year old OM602 and 603 engines… so apparently it can be done if done properly. Our Toyota got totalled due to a hurricane dropping a tree on it, with only 238k and 15 years…

But your point is valid. Chains require maintenance. And, IMO, getting everything back into proper mechanical time every decade or so isn’t the worst thing to happen.

Yes the MB engines are built well, especially the diesels for the most part. In watching Mercedes Source on you tube. He recommends replacing the timing chain every so often. I think he said north of 150,000 miles. He measured the length of the old chain on one vehicle and it was almost an inch longer than the new one. It goes without saying. but it throws the fuel injection, and the valve timing off making it noisy (er) smoke (ier) hard (er) to start and low (er) on power as well as modify combustion temperature and pressures events that can disrupt everything, coke rings, Soot the oil AKA run dirty (er) and waste fuel etc.. depending. Luv the old OM603 and 602 era iron especially the 300TD. a Geared timing set is the best. Most large diesels designed to run over a million miles use them as someone may have mentioned. However they whine some as they mesh. Some engines have them but not sure which ones. See this article https://www.tomorrowstechnician.com/engine-timing-chains/

 

[notharry]

Yes the MB engines are built well, especially the diesels for the most part. In watching Mercedes Source on you tube. He recommends replacing the timing chain every so often. I think he said north of 150,000 miles. He measured the length of the old chain on one vehicle and it was almost an inch longer than the new one. It goes without saying. but it throws the fuel injection, and the valve timing off making it noisy (er) smoke (ier) hard (er) to start and low (er) on power as well as modify combustion temperature and pressures events that can disrupt everything, coke rings, Soot the oil AKA run dirty (er) and waste fuel etc.. depending. Luv the old OM603 and 602 era iron especially the 300TD. a Geared timing set is the best. Most large diesels designed to run over a million miles use them as someone may have mentioned. However they whine some as they mesh. Some engines have them but not sure which ones. See this article https://www.tomorrowstechnician.com/engine-timing-chains/

Oh F1 engines dont have a cam shaft for timing. Solenoid's actuate the valves. This is here See https://www.freevalve.com/

 

[Pelican]

Are you less inclined to buy an older car with an engine that has a timing belt instead of a chain, knowing that a belt replacement will add hundreds to the actual cost of the vehicle? Do you try to avoid cars with timing belts altogether, or do you not care?

I’m looking at a V6 Lexus with 166k miles. I’m planning on having the timing belt and water pump replaced if I buy it, which will add hundreds to the actual cost. Another vehicle with a chain wouldn’t have that extra cost, possibly making it a better buy even if the initial cost was a few dollars more. Do you care?

It depends, timing chain life is also dictated by how often you change the oil.
Extended OCIs will shorten its life as that oil lubricates the chain, so if there is
debris in the oil it will lodge in the links and contribute to the wear & tear.
Belt is not subject to this and much cheaper to replace. Tough to decide at times.

 

[notharry]

Are you less inclined to buy an older car with an engine that has a timing belt instead of a chain, knowing that a belt replacement will add hundreds to the actual cost of the vehicle? Do you try to avoid cars with timing belts altogether, or do you not care?

I’m looking at a V6 Lexus with 166k miles. I’m planning on having the timing belt and water pump replaced if I buy it, which will add hundreds to the actual cost. Another vehicle with a chain wouldn’t have that extra cost, possibly making it a better buy even if the initial cost was a few dollars more. Do you care?

Ask for a print-out of its history. If anything was done at the dealership, they will have it on their system. based on this, Make your best deal on the Lexus. Take it to your mechanic and have him look at the belt and ask his opinion. if your not satisfied with the answer spend the money and sleep at night. You should flush all the fluids, do filters and belts unless someone is sure its been done or it looks suspect or dirty. Better yet take it to your mechanic first.

 

[eljefino]

It's a factor but not an overriding one.

I get cars with issues. I hope the issue is exaggerated in the consciousness of the seller so I get a more-than-good price. It also helps with the "why are you selling it" question when the issue is obvious.

So I would buy a non-interference car with a snapped belt, just like I got a Saturn SL2 for $75 with a rattly timing chain. I prefer a 4 cyl SOHC with one cam sprocket over a V6 DOHC with four, but wouldn't we all?

All the "stuff" in a used car influences my decision, except possibly the paint color, LOL. I might haggle a little less aggressively for a really great color but the rest of the mechanical stuff (and body rust) is a go/ no-go.

 

[JHZR2]

Yes the MB engines are built well, especially the diesels for the most part. In watching Mercedes Source on you tube. He recommends replacing the timing chain every so often. I think he said north of 150,000 miles. He measured the length of the old chain on one vehicle and it was almost an inch longer than the new one. It goes without saying. but it throws the fuel injection, and the valve timing off making it noisy (er) smoke (ier) hard (er) to start and low (er) on power as well as modify combustion temperature and pressures events that can disrupt everything, coke rings, Soot the oil AKA run dirty (er) and waste fuel etc.. depending. Luv the old OM603 and 602 era iron especially the 300TD. a Geared timing set is the best. Most large diesels designed to run over a million miles use them as someone may have mentioned. However they whine some as they mesh. Some engines have them but not sure which ones. See this article https://www.tomorrowstechnician.com/engine-timing-chains/

Kent is a salesman. Pushing his website. Not all bad info but not the best parts.

MB has processes to measure chain wear, and sells offset woodruff keys to fix it. The IP also has a few degrees of adjustment and a pretty easy way to verify its timing… So I’m not sure 150k is necessary unless the oil wasn’t changed a lot and there is excess wear.

 

[Yuk]

A snapped timing belt ended the life of my otherwise perfect 1999 VW Passat. Every car I've bought since has had a chain.
Does a chain make them bulletproof?... No. Chains do make me feel a little better though.

 

[ls1mike]

A snapped timing belt ended the life of my otherwise perfect 1999 VW Passat. Every car I've bought since has had a chain.
Does a chain make them bulletproof?... No. Chains do make me feel a little better though.

I think they give you more notice if something is happening because they typically stretch first and you get noise, a check engine light, some sort of indication. I have had both, have had a belt go bad in a non-interference car. I like the chain better.

 

[ls1mike]

A lot of newer GM FWD stuff seems to just not be a good idea, period. Toyota seems to have drivetrains that can last roughly forever with minimal maintenance (at least in certain situations), GM ”time bombs” cost more than the plastic pile is worth…

There are few GM small mills with no timing chain issues. The 2.0 a LTG is an example.

 

[Ws6]

Are you less inclined to buy an older car with an engine that has a timing belt instead of a chain, knowing that a belt replacement will add hundreds to the actual cost of the vehicle? Do you try to avoid cars with timing belts altogether, or do you not care?

I’m looking at a V6 Lexus with 166k miles. I’m planning on having the timing belt and water pump replaced if I buy it, which will add hundreds to the actual cost. Another vehicle with a chain wouldn’t have that extra cost, possibly making it a better buy even if the initial cost was a few dollars more. Do you care?

It depends. Something like a Honda 3.5L, I'd buy, but a Chrysler? NO!

 

[dogememe]

I've always owned vehicles with timing chains, and never anything with a timing belt.

I prefer timing chains over belts as belts are guaranteed to need to be replaced, while chains most likely never need to be replaced.

 

[Exhaustgases]

I prefer no timing belts or chains.

A chain does not guarantee long life, as mentioned in this thread there is more to go wrong than just the chain it self, the over use of crap plastic guides can sometimes be a huge issue. Some complain about a belt needing to be changed at around 100K miles or so, that same can happen with a chain as well, just search around on the forums about timing chain issues. Even the supposed durable Honda can need a timing chain around the120K mile area, timing chain wear or stretch can cause enough error to throw codes.
Timing belts are way less trouble to change out. Timing chains are not easy, they run in a sealed case, and can be a battle to seal up due to space limitations, also some manufactures have added complexity to the process by requiring special alignment tools for timing, and non keyed drive sprockets that can slip if not done correctly.
More than belts and chains is the adoption of OHC, fine for motor cycles and racing applications, don't need that complication for an average car, that is when all these problems started.

 

[hrv]

Yes it does... I am on the chain gang...................

 

[Jetronic]

I’ve been driving for over 40 years now and I’ve never had a timing chain fail.

You will with the newer cars. It wasn't an issue on older cars

 

[Ws6]

Yes the MB engines are built well, especially the diesels for the most part. In watching Mercedes Source on you tube. He recommends replacing the timing chain every so often. I think he said north of 150,000 miles. He measured the length of the old chain on one vehicle and it was almost an inch longer than the new one. It goes without saying. but it throws the fuel injection, and the valve timing off making it noisy (er) smoke (ier) hard (er) to start and low (er) on power as well as modify combustion temperature and pressures events that can disrupt everything, coke rings, Soot the oil AKA run dirty (er) and waste fuel etc.. depending. Luv the old OM603 and 602 era iron especially the 300TD. a Geared timing set is the best. Most large diesels designed to run over a million miles use them as someone may have mentioned. However they whine some as they mesh. Some engines have them but not sure which ones. See this article https://www.tomorrowstechnician.com/engine-timing-chains/

My Dad put a lot of miles on Ford 302's and every now and then the chain would jump a tooth on high mile examples. He drove the hell outta them though, and the average person won't abuse an engine nearly as much, and I don't believe but one, if that, ever broke a chain. He usually got 180-200k out of them. When he went to 4.6 2V engines, he got 200-240 out of them. Both died due to drinking absurd amounts of oil.

 

[wtd]

I prefer chains but these days they can be a crap shoot. I have never owned one with a belt.

 

[zzyzzx]

An easy to change timing belt on a non-interference engine is still good.

 

[CarDoc66]

I’ll take a timing belt any day over a chain. Belts don’t typically fail like they used to, I see more timing chain issues (BMW N20, GM Ecotech, seem to be the most common I see lately) than tIming belt failures.
Typically belts are much cheaper and easier to change than chains.
I pull 100,000 mile belts out of all sorts of brands and they look like they could have gone another 50k with no issues. Belt technology has come a long way, I haven’t seen one snap since the 90’s.
I will add that most chain problems I see are usually not the actual chain, but the plastic guides or tensioners failing, falling apart.
But to answer the question: No.

 

[meep]

Sorta depends? I’ve avoided bmw V8s and wouldn’t consider an Audi V8 because of the chains. (Took willpower, the 540 with a manual is about as divine as a sedan can get. Camaro, eat this, pwned in every way). Yet if I was considering an off-roader I’d avoid a belt at all cost if I was serious about dust and deep water.

I’ve never spent more than $800 to have a dealer do a TB. That’s not bad. The chains in my f150 are starting to rattle at startup, at 65k. Chains may have been the cats meow when they are short, but now I don’t know. Honestly, I’ll probably not focus on a specific technical feature and look more at the big picture and known failure history.

I would not buy the fords with the water pump hidden in the middle of the block. Yet saying that, mine apparently did that with the oil pump and a rubber belt - but aside from a couple of screaming YouTube videos where the belt shredded, likely from oil starvation, there doesn’t seem to be an issue with ecoboost oil pumps falling out of the sky.