Do we have any pharmacists here? Why does it take so long?

[JimPghPA]

Besides filling the script they have to also check with the insurance and see how much of it is going to be covered.

They also have to maintain stock for the pharmacy and check for how old the medications are and discard any that are too old.

Some pharmacies also will provide the service of actually doing injections for certain medications.

 

[vtec260]

I can fill your prescription right away or fill right. Your pick.

I contemplated being a mechanic or be in healthcare profession while in high school. I graduated from pharmacy school 30 years ago (have both parents and older sister who were/are pharmacists...no family influence there) and have chosen to work retail for the same company for past 30 years.

My usual wait time for a new prescription is around 20-30 minutes which seems like an eternity for many, but during that time, what do we do? I have joy of dealing with numerous phone calls, faxes, electronic scripts, refill requests online/phone/drop-in, send away for compounds, injections, handle OTC questions, showing people where to find electrolytes or other OTC goods, answer where the public restroom is, what aisle toilet papers are, check corporate emails, handle drug recalls, book flu shot and/or COVID shot appointment, solve insurance problems, prescribe for minor ailments, do medication review, do final check on prescriptions, and maybe drink a gulp of water or go for a quick restroom break, and have a energy left over to take a deep breather. Plus supervise 3-4 techs working hard with you and help out at cash at times.

Do I enjoy my profession? You bet. I hate it when my patients pass away from various causes, but when I see newborns getting their first ear infection antibiotic grow up to be full grown adults and having a family of their own, I feel old yet, humbled, to be part of their lives, filling in their medication needs. Although I work for a large corporate store, I treat my patients as my neighbors and friends (except those jerks who demand for our attention with no gratitude). Haven't been robbed yet for opioids, but everyday at work can be that day.

My stress release = wrenching on cars in the garage and enjoy a good work done on brake job, oil changes, and seasonal tire change-overs. 11+ years to retirement....not that I am counting or anything.

 

[LDB]

Fast. Cheap. Correct. Pick two.

 

[bbhero]

It is, but as @PimTac correctly pointed out - it is a very different type of work and the number of available hospital positions is also miniscule compared to retail chains.

Take a browse on the r/pharmacy sub and you'll read about the issues. I have a few contacts in this field and they're all in agreement - hours, very poor staffing practices and the market is just plain saturated.

Fair, but does paying ~$300k in tuition (on top of undergrad) to earn $40-$70/hr make any sense?

PharmD Tuition and Financial Aid

pharmacy.pacific.edu

The national company that I work for....has a 12% salary differential between super-low cost of living areas (e.g. Dakotas) and high cost of living areas. Our salary structures are very well validated by both internal and external industry sources. So, the arguments about CA (and major metropolitan areas) being on their own planet (from a COL standpoint) is not exactly accurate, IMO.

Also, at the $200K income level for an individual, your take-home (with typical 401K and medical deductions), is probably around $10K/mo. A decent bit of money, but not exactly upper middle class anymore.

Anyway, as mentioned earlier, pharmacists are decently compensated, but their current market salaries do not make sense for the required educational investment. Spending $200-$300K to earn $40-$70/hr doesn't really add up. PT's are a similar situation. There's a reason why many smart folks interested in healthcare are flocking to the RN, PA, NP and RT pathways.


Might want to poke around the r/pharmacy sub a bit. This thread is an example:


I have numerous friends who recently entered the field and their comments match those. The field has simply become saturated in recent years and it is very difficult to find employment now.

My friend TC …

You live in a wombat run state… That is no where near representative of many, many areas outside of that state.

Vastly different from even my area.

Look up Williamsburg Virginia and Governor’s Land… 5,000-10,000 square foot homes … Custom built. I did electrical work in one that was near 10,000 square feet in 1999. I’d bet that home is worth 3 million dollars now and maybe more than that.

In your state in the right neighborhood… How much is that size home there worth ?
A whole, whole lot more than it is here in my area.

I’m gonna let you know a big fact though…

Some of those pharmaceutical students DO NOT have to pay anything to go to school…

Yes… That can and does happen… In fact some of them get PAID while finishing their degree program.

Granted not all that often but I know it can happen..

I know because I went to school with an exceptionally intelligent young man who went to pharmacy school and it was all paid for. He missed 1… 1 question out of 1,000 for a whole semester with me taking anatomy and physiology… He got 999 right out of 1,000 right. He actually corrected our instructor a few times and he was right every single time. He was incredibly gifted.

Like I said..

Pharmacists in my area are REALLY well paid… I know where some of them live….

And it’s in the best neighborhoods in this region.

There’s a reason for that.

Fun fact to add to this…

You want to know how much Orthodontist make ??

Yeah… That is staggering how much they make….

Teeth… HUGE money in that.

 

[John105]

It is, but as @PimTac correctly pointed out - it is a very different type of work and the number of available hospital positions is also miniscule compared to retail chains.

Take a browse on the r/pharmacy sub and you'll read about the issues. I have a few contacts in this field and they're all in agreement - hours, very poor staffing practices and the market is just plain saturated.

Fair, but does paying ~$300k in tuition (on top of undergrad) to earn $40-$70/hr make any sense?

PharmD Tuition and Financial Aid

pharmacy.pacific.edu

The national company that I work for....has a 12% salary differential between super-low cost of living areas (e.g. Dakotas) and high cost of living areas. Our salary structures are very well validated by both internal and external industry sources. So, the arguments about CA (and major metropolitan areas) being on their own planet (from a COL standpoint) is not exactly accurate, IMO.

Also, at the $200K income level for an individual, your take-home (with typical 401K and medical deductions), is probably around $10K/mo. A decent bit of money, but not exactly upper middle class anymore.

Anyway, as mentioned earlier, pharmacists are decently compensated, but their current market salaries do not make sense for the required educational investment. Spending $200-$300K to earn $40-$70/hr doesn't really add up. PT's are a similar situation. There's a reason why many smart folks interested in healthcare are flocking to the RN, PA, NP and RT pathways.


Might want to poke around the r/pharmacy sub a bit. This thread is an example:


I have numerous friends who recently entered the field and their comments match those. The field has simply become saturated in recent years and it is very difficult to find employment now.

My first fiance ran clinical trials for pharmaceuticals. She would fly to Australia first class, and back, for 3 days at a time (it wasn't her employer paying, they were billing this out). They would attend conferences that would make Bob Menendez's activities look innocent. Literally, no limit to what was spent as it was on big pharma's dime. Maybe this is what ticks off the pharmacists that we have to encounter, who knows. They sure aren't in that class nor getting a piece of the pie.

I worked at a health care at that time, and told a SVP of our pharma. He said, and I quote, "That's why prescription drugs are so **** expensive." That was around 2005, I see they haven't solved the issue 18 years later.

 

[zzyzzx]

I'm sure its easier now with dedicated software, but part of the process was verifying other prescriptions associated with that name didn't have any known adverse reactions or incompatibilities.

Doesn't the computer do that already?

 

[Astro14]

Oh the humanity!!!
How on earth can anyone expect to feed themselves on such a pittance!

When you’ve done four years of college, and then four years of pharmacy school, you should be well paid. Highly trained and specialized should equal well paid.

If that was enough earning potential for the investment in education, we would not have a shortage. The fact that there is a shortage tells you that that is too little earning potential for the education required.

If you would like the salary, feel free to put on the eight years. You’ll have to do well in school, by the way, it’s not easy to get into pharmacy school.

 

[KrisZ]

Everything needs a pill today, that’s the problem.

 

[MSCH]

I have a great one 15 minutes away. If I called one in now it would be ready when I got there. I have had others that would take many hours or days.

I think that is a matter of what you are prescribed.
I get some stuff monthly, and it is more of a specialty that is always out of stock
meaning it will be delivered tomorrow.
but the run of the mill stuff ( you know, the stuff that is basically free)
they usually have that.

 

[4WD]

My friend TC …

You live in a wombat run state… That is no where near representative of many, many areas outside of that state.

Vastly different from even my area.

Look up Williamsburg Virginia and Governor’s Land… 5,000-10,000 square foot homes … Custom built. I did electrical work in one that was near 10,000 square feet in 1999. I’d bet that home is worth 3 million dollars now and maybe more than that.

In your state in the right neighborhood… How much is that size home there worth ?
A whole, whole lot more than it is here in my area.

I’m gonna let you know a big fact though…

Some of those pharmaceutical students DO NOT have to pay anything to go to school…

Yes… That can and does happen… In fact some of them get PAID while finishing their degree program.

Granted not all that often but I know it can happen..

I know because I went to school with an exceptionally intelligent young man who went to pharmacy school and it was all paid for. He missed 1… 1 question out of 1,000 for a whole semester with me taking anatomy and physiology… He got 999 right out of 1,000 right. He actually corrected our instructor a few times and he was right every single time. He was incredibly gifted.

Like I said..

Pharmacists in my area are REALLY well paid… I know where some of them live….

And it’s in the best neighborhoods in this region.

There’s a reason for that.

Fun fact to add to this…

You want to know how much Orthodontist make ??

Yeah… That is staggering how much they make….

Teeth… HUGE money in that.

Dermo’s have big houses here … 8-5 job … (hour for lunch)

 

[Zee09]

I think that is a matter of what you are prescribed.
I get some stuff monthly, and it is more of a specialty that is always out of stock
meaning it will be delivered tomorrow.
but the run of the mill stuff ( you know, the stuff that is basically free)
they usually have that.

Yup anything new and super expensive brings up other issues.

 

[MSCH]

Yup anything new and super expensive brings up other issues.

in my case Levimir is refrigerated. so they dont keep it in the store.
per your example, I take Trulicity... and that one falls under the other issues.
it is out of stock.. sometimes takes 3 weeks to get..

 

[John105]

When you’ve done four years of college, and then four years of pharmacy school, you should be well paid. Highly trained and specialized should equal well paid.

If that was enough earning potential for the investment in education, we would not have a shortage. The fact that there is a shortage tells you that that is too little earning potential for the education required.

If you would like the salary, feel free to put on the eight years. You’ll have to do well in school, by the way, it’s not easy to get into pharmacy school.

Funny even in my time at a hmo, old senior pharmacists had 6 years education. I heard long long ago 5. They made a lot of money being administrators. The people they hired at the entry level, 7. Now it’s 8. Why not become a MD in that case.

We throw the term “doctor” around like it’s nothing. I know from past experience this is a can of worms. But to me, doctor is someone who can help me when my elbow is infected. They’ll be able to cure it long before the amputation becomes needed.

Ok I’ll give a hint. Doing an operation and asking what letter can you read on a chart, are two different things to me.

 

[Barkleymut]

Even $130K, which is roughly the median in Virginia, is a great salary for most of Virginia. I suspect the salary is higher in those places where it isn't, mostly closer to DC.

How much do pharmacists make?​

Nationally the median salary for a pharmacist in 2020 was $128,710. In the state of Virginia, pharmacists made between $120,000 and $130,000. In addition to a great salary, 70% received health insurance and 70% also had access to a retirement plan.

Pharmacist Salary | School of Pharmacy | Virginia Commonwealth University

We are the oldest pharmacy school in Virginia, tracing our roots back to 1898. Our primary teaching facilities are located on the Medical College of Virginia Campus in Richmond, the state capital. We are 1 of 18 Health Science Centers nationwide meaning that our campus has four other health...

pharmacy.vcu.edu

median household income in VA is $85k ... been there, honestly if you manage your expenses and do not make mistakes you can live a comfortable life. Was hard to put anything towards retirement tho..

 

[Vil_Riker]

There could be a few things...

. the ePrescription did not arrive on time or at all and they had to chase it. Yes, it happens more often than you think.
. there were orders in queue before your friend
. if it was an opioid, there needs to be a background check and clearance to dispense the medicine, and then submit to the national databases
. documentation takes more than half the time spent on the dispensation

 

[andrew_j]

So what is wrong with their working conditions? Exposure to the public?

My friends pharmacy was held up twice when they used to stock the heavy drugs.

Pay level is irrelevant to how fast your scripts are filled.

There are also pharmacy techs involved and how well that process goes down.

 

[Wrenchturner44]

Another thing that I will mention that may not be considered is payment method. If you walk into a non-chain / independent pharmacy with a script and tell them that you are paying at time of delivery, service will be much faster. That has been my experience.

 

[PimTac]

Funny even in my time at a hmo, old senior pharmacists had 6 years education. I heard long long ago 5. They made a lot of money being administrators. The people they hired at the entry level, 7. Now it’s 8. Why not become a MD in that case.

We throw the term “doctor” around like it’s nothing. I know from past experience this is a can of worms. But to me, doctor is someone who can help me when my elbow is infected. They’ll be able to cure it long before the amputation becomes needed.

Ok I’ll give a hint. Doing an operation and asking what letter can you read on a chart, are two different things to me.

Doctor is a general term used for someone who has attained a Doctorate degree. There are a number of such degrees and not all of them are medically related.

A patient undergoing chemotherapy should be reassured that the pharmacist writing the orders for their chemo treatment is qualified for the task. The same goes for many other tasks that used to be done by doctors.

The shortage of doctors has forced the healthcare industry to use Physician Assistants and other professionals to take over a lot of their work.

 

[John105]

Doctor is a general term used for someone who has attained a Doctorate degree. There are a number of such degrees and not all of them are medically related.

A patient undergoing chemotherapy should be reassured that the pharmacist writing the orders for their chemo treatment is qualified for the task. The same goes for many other tasks that used to be done by doctors.

The shortage of doctors has forced the healthcare industry to use Physician Assistants and other professionals to take over a lot of their work.

Sometimes a basic law degree is a doctorate, JD. Other times it’s a bachelors, LLB. Not really standardized. Especially now with online degrees.

 

[02SE]

AI and robots will solve this problem eventually, and unfortunately.

T-1000 will decide that all humans must die...