Changing brake fluid?

[S2000driver]

What is this thread still going?

Stop pontificating brake fluid changes and just do it. Why would you want dirty old brake fluid?

The most important system in your car is the braking system. Why blow it off?

There is so much intricate talk about lubrication for the engine... but brake fluid is not to be serviced? Get real!

The amount of time typing could have been used to change the fluid in the resovoir, which only requires a turkey baster.

Put down the mouse, go out into the garage, and do something good for yourself and your family.

 

[VaderSS]

quote:

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Originally posted by labman:
Proven? Not according to the study already referenced here. It seems you fluid changing fanatics ignored it. It claims there is very little problems with color or water absorption. http://www.babcox.com/editorial/bf/bf50412.htm

I am still waiting for an explanation of how changing the fluid protects the parts of the brake system most subject to failure that are not in contact with it.

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Wet boiling point? Compressibility? Loss of corrosion protection?

""As to the area past the seal, I've only seen corrosion here where brake fluid has started leaking past the pressure seal then absorbing a full load of water and corroding the bore or in cases where the dust seal has failed from heat or age. The pressure seal will live longer in fresh fluid. The dust seal should be inspected with every pad change and replaced if showing signs of deterioration.""

That linked study is open to interpetation and seems to support regular brake fluid changes as much as it discounts them. How do you know when it needs it? Well, if you don't know, change it. Better than the other way around...

[ June 14, 2004, 09:03 PM: Message edited by: VaderSS ]

 

[labman]

quote:

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Originally posted by VaderSS:
snip....

""As to the area past the seal, I've only seen corrosion here where brake fluid has started leaking past the pressure seal then absorbing a full load of water and corroding the bore or in cases where the dust seal has failed from heat or age. The pressure seal will live longer in fresh fluid. snip...

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So how many calipers have you ever disassembled? I have disassembled hundreds. Some were in fine shape, and some were disasters we should have known better than to put the work into to getting apart. Many of them were dry outside the seal, but the piston was corroded. Many of the ones that were leaking, were working fine until the corrosion on the piston was forced back past the seal to change pads. Even the worst of the dolts wouldn't put new pads in a leaking caliper. Some of them had a terrible time of it, having trouble pushing the piston back, and then it either hung up or leaked ruining the new pads. These guys would buy a set of pads and be back the next day with a leaking or hung up caliper.

If a piston doesn't pop out as soon as you hit it with the air, chances are it is corroded. Note, if you kiddies try that one at home, pad things well with rags and keep your fingers clear. If the piston doesn't push back easily, chances are, it is corroded. Just push it back far enough to slip it off the disk and go buy a rebuilt one. A kit and a piston are often more than a rebuilt caliper, allowing nothing for labor.

 

[VaderSS]

Not hundreds I admit, but at least 30-40 on many different makes, models and ages. Course, I also don't live in the salt belt and, though I once thought corrosion was a problem here, I see in other parts of the country it is much worse.

At any rate, it still comes down to a fluid that deteriorates with age due to water, salt, copper, corrosion...

It needs to be changed. How often? Well, guess you would need some test strips and fluid from the calipers to be sure, but annual sounds pretty darn good to me. I just can't see why you think that's a bad idea.

 

[labman]

If you want to change your brake fluid every year, go ahead and do it. Just don't tell anybody they are neglecting their car if they don't. Yes brake fluid does develop problems eventually, maybe 10-20 years. Lie to people about brake fluid, and pretty soon they won't believe anything. You haven't posted the least bit of data supporting frequent changes of brake fluid. Yes it absorbs water. How much, and how quickly? How soon does it lead to problems? Your stance is based on pure speculation ignoring years of experience.

 

[VaderSS]

10-20 years?
Whoa.
I am saying to err on the side of caution. I feel that you are erring the other way.

There has been plenty posted here on this forum to show that it is a good practice to regularly change the fluid. You dismiss it all.

I'm not sure if you are suggesting that I am lying to people, but if so, then I resent that. I do my best to support any statement that I make, and I feel that I, and others here, have done a good job of supporting my view that not changing the brake fluid regularly IS neglect.

I do not know what the exact interval would be, and I also KNOW that it would be different in every vehicle's case, based on climate, overall brake system integrity, type of brake fluid, driving style and type,... I err on the side of caution by saying annual.

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

VaderSS is not basing it on speculation. It is sound scientific reasoning, cause and effect, etc...
Yes, annually is very conservative. But to say it never needs to be changed is foolish. I'd rather be conservative than foolish. What's $5-10 a year on brake fluid. I'd probably actually say 2-3yrs is safe for a vehicle that isn't driven high speed or in mountanous terrain.

Go try a panic stop from 80-100mph or try keeping your speed under control going down a mountain with that 10yr old fluid. It IS degraded!

 

[S2000driver]

Manufacturers are recommending 2-3 years for a brake fluid change. I think that is a recommendation everyone can follow no matter what the make or model.

Why don't (didn't) some manufacturers recommend brake fluid changes as part of regular maintenance?

Maybe it's because pads last longer these days and brake fluid systems aren't getting the normal bleed activity that they once did. Could also be the plastic resovoirs. Or the tightened requirements of ABS systems. Or the fact it's no longer appropriate to consider certain components wear (or corrosion) items.

 

[Kestas]

quote:

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Originally posted by labman:
Proven? Not according to the study already referenced here. It seems you fluid changing fanatics ignored it. It claims there is very little problems with color or water absorption. http://www.babcox.com/editorial/bf/bf50412.htm

I am still waiting for an explanation of how changing the fluid protects the parts of the brake system most subject to failure that are not in contact with it.

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Labman, I read through the article, and it actually gives a very good reason why people should change their brake fluid on a regular basis.

[ June 20, 2004, 10:24 PM: Message edited by: Kestas ]