Originally Posted By: TommeyReed
Unlike you, I have tested output vs input of energy...
It just show me you are clueless.
I will bet you that I can create output of energy, yet you just can see it because you have no understanding of real physics as you claim to know.
Let me give you some basic course in mechanical work:
33000 rise one foot in one minute =1 hp
1 pound rise 33000 ft in one minute = 1 hp
Now lets look at simple math
If you have a total of 20lb of thrust using the jets on the drum.
The diameter, say 24" will give you a constant 20ft/lb,under a load of 1000 rpms *20/5252 = 3.8hp
If you wonder where I got the 5252 from:
24"*pi/12*5252....
To say you won't get anything out is just being a clown, and making statments that question your understanding of mechanical work!
Ah...the ad hominem criticism - "let's not debate the merits of your argument, let's just call you names to diminish your argument"...how did I know this was coming?
Never mind. I answer your question for two reasons: 1. as I said, you have my brother's name, that's endeared you to me, despite your personal attacks and 2. some other BITOGers might actually learn something...hopefully, some did during this thread, in which I tired to explain physics once before: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2218018&page=1
Here's where you're making a mistake this time: "... you a constant 20ft/lb,under a load of 1000 rpms *20/5252 = 3.8hp"...
There is no constant 20 ft/lb on your spinning drum...your drum is at a constant RPM. At a constant RPM, the torque from the oil jets will equal the torque from drag (bearings, etc) on the drum...
That torque is quite small. The NET torque is zero...so the NET horsepower is zero.
Let's talk physics for a second. Recall Newton's first law: a body in motion will stay in motion unless acted on by an outside force.
Tommy - that's your drum. Your drum has an angular velocity. When the pump first accelerates it, it's being acted upon by a net torque (the torque from the jets is greater than the opposite direction torque caused by drag). Once it's in motion, it is no longer accelerating (recall that angular acceleration is a change in rate of angular velocity).
So, there is no net torque, or the drum would continue to increase in RPM...the forces of torque from the jets and from drag have equaled out...and it continues to spin. Remove the fluid pressure (your pump) and the only force left will be the drag...the drag of accelerating the fluid to the outside of the drum, the drag of bearings, even aerodynamic drag, all of which will slow down the drum and bring it to a stop.
Q.E.D
Until you either hook the drum up to a load that can measure output, or remove the pump, you have no output...you have only a steady state, spinning drum that has energy applied to it, which it dissapates through creation of friction, turbulence, and heat.
Here is one other point: the crux of the fallacy of this engine - is that it actually TAKES energy to accelerate the fluid to the outside of the drum, energy that you put into the fluid with the pump, energy that will be drawn out of the drum if the pump is removed. You don't get "free" thrust from the "centrifugal force"...moving that fluid outward takes energy...
I am trying to stick to the topic of how this engine that you've built actually operates...but since you've called me several names, you should be aware that I had some basic courses in mechanical work in high school...(we called it physics) along with calculus.
Later, I got my college degree in Astrophysics...that's the derivation of my BITOG pseudonym...
But that's not going to make any difference to you, is it...
Unlike you, I have tested output vs input of energy...
It just show me you are clueless.
I will bet you that I can create output of energy, yet you just can see it because you have no understanding of real physics as you claim to know.
Let me give you some basic course in mechanical work:
33000 rise one foot in one minute =1 hp
1 pound rise 33000 ft in one minute = 1 hp
Now lets look at simple math
If you have a total of 20lb of thrust using the jets on the drum.
The diameter, say 24" will give you a constant 20ft/lb,under a load of 1000 rpms *20/5252 = 3.8hp
If you wonder where I got the 5252 from:
24"*pi/12*5252....
To say you won't get anything out is just being a clown, and making statments that question your understanding of mechanical work!
Ah...the ad hominem criticism - "let's not debate the merits of your argument, let's just call you names to diminish your argument"...how did I know this was coming?
Never mind. I answer your question for two reasons: 1. as I said, you have my brother's name, that's endeared you to me, despite your personal attacks and 2. some other BITOGers might actually learn something...hopefully, some did during this thread, in which I tired to explain physics once before: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2218018&page=1
Here's where you're making a mistake this time: "... you a constant 20ft/lb,under a load of 1000 rpms *20/5252 = 3.8hp"...
There is no constant 20 ft/lb on your spinning drum...your drum is at a constant RPM. At a constant RPM, the torque from the oil jets will equal the torque from drag (bearings, etc) on the drum...
That torque is quite small. The NET torque is zero...so the NET horsepower is zero.
Let's talk physics for a second. Recall Newton's first law: a body in motion will stay in motion unless acted on by an outside force.
Tommy - that's your drum. Your drum has an angular velocity. When the pump first accelerates it, it's being acted upon by a net torque (the torque from the jets is greater than the opposite direction torque caused by drag). Once it's in motion, it is no longer accelerating (recall that angular acceleration is a change in rate of angular velocity).
So, there is no net torque, or the drum would continue to increase in RPM...the forces of torque from the jets and from drag have equaled out...and it continues to spin. Remove the fluid pressure (your pump) and the only force left will be the drag...the drag of accelerating the fluid to the outside of the drum, the drag of bearings, even aerodynamic drag, all of which will slow down the drum and bring it to a stop.
Q.E.D
Until you either hook the drum up to a load that can measure output, or remove the pump, you have no output...you have only a steady state, spinning drum that has energy applied to it, which it dissapates through creation of friction, turbulence, and heat.
Here is one other point: the crux of the fallacy of this engine - is that it actually TAKES energy to accelerate the fluid to the outside of the drum, energy that you put into the fluid with the pump, energy that will be drawn out of the drum if the pump is removed. You don't get "free" thrust from the "centrifugal force"...moving that fluid outward takes energy...
I am trying to stick to the topic of how this engine that you've built actually operates...but since you've called me several names, you should be aware that I had some basic courses in mechanical work in high school...(we called it physics) along with calculus.
Later, I got my college degree in Astrophysics...that's the derivation of my BITOG pseudonym...
But that's not going to make any difference to you, is it...
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