Best Torque Sticks?
- Thread starter The Critic
- Start date
- Status
I'm probably butchering this description, but maybe try and visualize it as a clock spring[1]. Let's say the clock springs has a strength of 65lb-ft. As long as you don't turn it "past" that, the spring doesn't compress, but once the force of whatever you're turning is more than 65lb-ft, it starts to coil, absorbing the excess force. That's why they work with an impact but wouldn't work if you used them as an extension to a breaker bar or something.
robert
[1] http://cmpinc.us/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/clock-spring11.jpg
robert
[1] http://cmpinc.us/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/clock-spring11.jpg
Torque sticks are junk. Any place that uses them anymore is behind the times. They are not accurate. Using a torque-limited impact gun (or setting the power lower) and then torquing to proper specs with a torque wrench is the correct procedure these days.
Originally Posted By: robertcope
I'm probably butchering this description, but maybe try and visualize it as a clock spring[1]. Let's say the clock springs has a strength of 65lb-ft. As long as you don't turn it "past" that, the spring doesn't compress, but once the force of whatever you're turning is more than 65lb-ft, it starts to coil, absorbing the excess force. That's why they work with an impact but wouldn't work if you used them as an extension to a breaker bar or something.
robert
[1] http://cmpinc.us/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/clock-spring11.jpg
So fastener side remains stationary and the wrench side continues to turn. I assume you can't keep impacting on them for long else they'll break apart?
I'm probably butchering this description, but maybe try and visualize it as a clock spring[1]. Let's say the clock springs has a strength of 65lb-ft. As long as you don't turn it "past" that, the spring doesn't compress, but once the force of whatever you're turning is more than 65lb-ft, it starts to coil, absorbing the excess force. That's why they work with an impact but wouldn't work if you used them as an extension to a breaker bar or something.
robert
[1] http://cmpinc.us/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/clock-spring11.jpg
So fastener side remains stationary and the wrench side continues to turn. I assume you can't keep impacting on them for long else they'll break apart?
Originally Posted By: Johnny248
Torque sticks are junk. Any place that uses them anymore is behind the times. They are not accurate. Using a torque-limited impact gun (or setting the power lower) and then torquing to proper specs with a torque wrench is the correct procedure these days.
Ford and Hyundai approve of them. OEM approval and endorsement is about as strong of an approval as you can get. Of course, you cannot control user error.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
How do you plan to test them?
Not sure yet. I suppose that I will install the lug nuts at 80, and try to torque them to 90 with my Snappy torque wrench. If the lug nuts still turn, then obviously the stick was still doing its job.
Torque sticks are junk. Any place that uses them anymore is behind the times. They are not accurate. Using a torque-limited impact gun (or setting the power lower) and then torquing to proper specs with a torque wrench is the correct procedure these days.
Ford and Hyundai approve of them. OEM approval and endorsement is about as strong of an approval as you can get. Of course, you cannot control user error.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
How do you plan to test them?
Not sure yet. I suppose that I will install the lug nuts at 80, and try to torque them to 90 with my Snappy torque wrench. If the lug nuts still turn, then obviously the stick was still doing its job.
Perfect! Actually, what you want to do is use the Snappy at 75 to make sure it clicks without turning and then set the Snappy at 85 to make sure it just turns before clicking.
Now if your $10 HF TW passes the same test, you probably will NOT be too happy
Now if your $10 HF TW passes the same test, you probably will NOT be too happy
I took a HF torque wrench out of a trash can after someone put it there after blaming it for snapping some lugs. Eventually I got around to having it checked for calibration. If was found to be within 0.5% at the bottom 10% of it's range; up to 1% at the top 10% of it's range; and within 0.2% in the middle 80% overtorquing in all cases. No adjustment was made and it was tagged. I now use it when I'm going to be working away from the shop.
Yes, I still place more trust my Snap On wrenches when it counts, but there's no need to call the HF units junk.
Yes, I still place more trust my Snap On wrenches when it counts, but there's no need to call the HF units junk.
Originally Posted By: yonyon
All but one of my torque wrenches do wear a a tag certifying their calibration and are calibrated every two years. None have ever been more than 1.5% off at the extremes of their range.
Once a year I compare the breakaway torque (higher than tightening torque) of a lug tightened with a stick to the breakaway torque of a lug tightened with a torque wrench.
The sticks still work after decades of occasional use. I don't run them counter-clockwise.
You're one of the few. Good for you!
Originally Posted By: robertcope
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
You're imposing extra work on yourself for no good reason.
Oh, I have a reason. I like to be thorough and I don't like mistakes that could hurt or kill me or other people on the track, or could cause me to miss track time. I haven't had a mechanical issue that has prevented running my car in years.
robert
You're condemning sticks without any real, factual basis. As others on this board have said, they're just fine IF used properly. IF you use a stick within it's confines, THEN your wheel won't fall off and you're gaining nothing by checking with a torque wrench. Shops all over the US use them with no issues every day. If there were a liability associated with using sticks, then you know they'd be more regulated or even outlawed.
All but one of my torque wrenches do wear a a tag certifying their calibration and are calibrated every two years. None have ever been more than 1.5% off at the extremes of their range.
Once a year I compare the breakaway torque (higher than tightening torque) of a lug tightened with a stick to the breakaway torque of a lug tightened with a torque wrench.
The sticks still work after decades of occasional use. I don't run them counter-clockwise.
You're one of the few. Good for you!
Originally Posted By: robertcope
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
You're imposing extra work on yourself for no good reason.
Oh, I have a reason. I like to be thorough and I don't like mistakes that could hurt or kill me or other people on the track, or could cause me to miss track time. I haven't had a mechanical issue that has prevented running my car in years.
robert
You're condemning sticks without any real, factual basis. As others on this board have said, they're just fine IF used properly. IF you use a stick within it's confines, THEN your wheel won't fall off and you're gaining nothing by checking with a torque wrench. Shops all over the US use them with no issues every day. If there were a liability associated with using sticks, then you know they'd be more regulated or even outlawed.
Originally Posted By: The_Eric
You're condemning sticks without any real, factual basis.
My exact words were, "I bought a set from Harbor Freight. They seem to work consistently, at least the 70ft-lb stick does." That hardly sounds like a condemnation.
I believe I am gaining something by applying the final torque by hand. Piece of mind, for example. Also, you aren't going to feel wheel studs stretching or any other issues through your impact wrench. You can disagree and that's okay.
robert
You're condemning sticks without any real, factual basis.
My exact words were, "I bought a set from Harbor Freight. They seem to work consistently, at least the 70ft-lb stick does." That hardly sounds like a condemnation.
I believe I am gaining something by applying the final torque by hand. Piece of mind, for example. Also, you aren't going to feel wheel studs stretching or any other issues through your impact wrench. You can disagree and that's okay.
robert
Last edited:
So I gave the 21mm/80 ft-lb stick a try last night.
The rear two wheels were tightened using my new IR gun that was on one bar of battery left (have not recharged since the first time I charged it). The front two were tightened with my friend's Snap-On CT4850HO, which had a strong battery charge.
After running them on with the torque stick I checked the lug nuts with a snap-on digital techwrench. The rear lug nuts seemed to move once I hit 85-90 ft lbs, whereas the fronts began to move at 80-83 ft lbs.
So I guess for all practical purposes, they are adequately accurate. But I will do a bit more testing once I recharge the gun, not sure if that will make a difference though.
The rear two wheels were tightened using my new IR gun that was on one bar of battery left (have not recharged since the first time I charged it). The front two were tightened with my friend's Snap-On CT4850HO, which had a strong battery charge.
After running them on with the torque stick I checked the lug nuts with a snap-on digital techwrench. The rear lug nuts seemed to move once I hit 85-90 ft lbs, whereas the fronts began to move at 80-83 ft lbs.
So I guess for all practical purposes, they are adequately accurate. But I will do a bit more testing once I recharge the gun, not sure if that will make a difference though.
I have a set of cheap sticks I use for initial torque.
its alot easier to tighten lugnuts to 65# or so then final tighten with a TW
So it goes something like this
put on lugnuts by hand a couple turns. tighten down with 75# stick with my electric ingersoll rand impact. Its rated for 290# but it hasnt failed me yet for anything I work on.
The sticks are consistantly under with this impact. so the lugnuts are aprox 65#
I then put the tire on the ground and tighten with TW to final torque.. check/tighten after a few days or 50-100miles.
I use the sticks because its a pain to loosen and tighten if you get any too tight on the initial torque.. it also messes up the star pattern I use.
Its a fast process and accurate.
before the sticks I would either have to loosen or have to go 3/4 a turn with the torque wrench.. now its always fast and consistent.
its alot easier to tighten lugnuts to 65# or so then final tighten with a TW
So it goes something like this
put on lugnuts by hand a couple turns. tighten down with 75# stick with my electric ingersoll rand impact. Its rated for 290# but it hasnt failed me yet for anything I work on.
The sticks are consistantly under with this impact. so the lugnuts are aprox 65#
I then put the tire on the ground and tighten with TW to final torque.. check/tighten after a few days or 50-100miles.
I use the sticks because its a pain to loosen and tighten if you get any too tight on the initial torque.. it also messes up the star pattern I use.
Its a fast process and accurate.
before the sticks I would either have to loosen or have to go 3/4 a turn with the torque wrench.. now its always fast and consistent.
Last edited:
You could also get an idea as to how much your gun puts on at its first impact. For example, if you are careful and immediately let go of the trigger on the second bang, you might get a consistent 50 or 60 ft-lb of tightening without having to use the torque stick. Just an idea.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
You could also get an idea as to how much your gun puts on at its first impact. For example, if you are careful and immediately let go of the trigger on the second bang, you might get a consistent 50 or 60 ft-lb of tightening without having to use the torque stick. Just an idea.
Perfect application for my Milwaukee M12 3/8" impact ... good for up to 83 lb-ft.
You could also get an idea as to how much your gun puts on at its first impact. For example, if you are careful and immediately let go of the trigger on the second bang, you might get a consistent 50 or 60 ft-lb of tightening without having to use the torque stick. Just an idea.
Perfect application for my Milwaukee M12 3/8" impact ... good for up to 83 lb-ft.
Has anyone considered bringing in your own torque stick to the place that rotates tires? Assuming they used it, you would know its a good one, is the right one, and was not beat/abused?
Originally Posted By: Vikas
You could also get an idea as to how much your gun puts on at its first impact. For example, if you are careful and immediately let go of the trigger on the second bang, you might get a consistent 50 or 60 ft-lb of tightening without having to use the torque stick. Just an idea.
I was using this strategy before, but on the first or second "bang," I would often be at above 80.
You could also get an idea as to how much your gun puts on at its first impact. For example, if you are careful and immediately let go of the trigger on the second bang, you might get a consistent 50 or 60 ft-lb of tightening without having to use the torque stick. Just an idea.
I was using this strategy before, but on the first or second "bang," I would often be at above 80.
Originally Posted By: Donald
Has anyone considered bringing in your own torque stick to the place that rotates tires? Assuming they used it, you would know its a good one, is the right one, and was not beat/abused?
Not a bad idea, but why let someone potentially damage your fragile tool?
Has anyone considered bringing in your own torque stick to the place that rotates tires? Assuming they used it, you would know its a good one, is the right one, and was not beat/abused?
Not a bad idea, but why let someone potentially damage your fragile tool?
Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: Donald
Has anyone considered bringing in your own torque stick to the place that rotates tires? Assuming they used it, you would know its a good one, is the right one, and was not beat/abused?
Not a bad idea, but why let someone potentially damage your fragile tool?
If they have a gorilla with a 1" pneumatic wrench and he uses a torque stick incorrectly he may damage the rotor no matter who's torque stick it is. But if a knowledgeable tire guy uses your properly, you know he is using the right one and its not been abused in the past. Just better odds.
Originally Posted By: Donald
Has anyone considered bringing in your own torque stick to the place that rotates tires? Assuming they used it, you would know its a good one, is the right one, and was not beat/abused?
Not a bad idea, but why let someone potentially damage your fragile tool?
If they have a gorilla with a 1" pneumatic wrench and he uses a torque stick incorrectly he may damage the rotor no matter who's torque stick it is. But if a knowledgeable tire guy uses your properly, you know he is using the right one and its not been abused in the past. Just better odds.
- Status
