Anyone add an oil filter to a predator 459cc

[oil pan 4]

Alright I think I have my test protocol figured out.
I'm a fill the predator 459cc powered wood chipper with oil all the way to the mouth of the dipstick hole. I'll add a sample line and sample valve to the oil system. Run it for upto an hour, as that's the size of the next pile of bush to wood chip. Pull a sample at idle after I chip the pile of bursh, while it's still hot AF, dump it back in the crank case 2x, pull a 3rd sample inspect it in the sunlight for metal dust in the oil set it aslide for testing later. Next mod it for the oil filter. The sample line becomes an oil line and the sample valve becomes a sample valve at the inlet to oil filter. Install a type 111 super nubby oil filter do not add any oil unless absolutely necessary. Hopefully the first oil sample and super nub oil filter only uses about 6 ounces of oil and the oil level is still on the dipstick, if the oil level isn't on the dipstick after a quick little run to fill the oil filter add oil pulled from my 459cc powered stump grinder. The stump grinders oil is definitely dirtier and older than what's in the wood chipper right now.
Run it for several more hours with the oil filter filtering and pull another sample, juat like the first one, after chipping a pile of wood running for about the same amount of time at least 45 minutes to an hour, while it's still hot at idle.

 

[oil pan 4]

Alright I put a line on my oil pressure tap, put a valve and pressure gauge on the end. I wanted to see how much I could open the valve before the pressure dropped. I had hot oil spraying out of the sample port rather furiously before I noticed any loss in pressure at idle (for me idle is 1,800 to 2,000rpm) my 4an to oil drain adapter is for a turbo. It's restricted down to 2mm.
I'm just going to run it like that.
First sample was the line and valve purge, I let fly about 10oz, stopped the engine, dumped it back in, fired it up and took the sample.
I let the oil settle and bubble off for a half hour in a jar. I can easily see dozens and dozens maybe even hundreds of bits of metal dust reflecting the sunlight at any given moment in my 200cc oil sample.
For 4ish hours of run time the oil has a black translucent almost muddy appearance.
I have no doubt whatsoever adding a filter will improve the oil.
Collecting 30 samples in this case would be nonsense.

 

[dnewton3]

30 samples isn't "nonsense". It's the method of establishing statistically defined variation with a high degree of accuracy.

Visual samples of oil, through a clear vessel, are anecdotal and not data driven.

I would agree that adding a filter is a good idea; can't hurt.

 

[oil pan 4]

I got the smallest, gooder quality, non relief valve oil filter that I could find at O'Reillys. A mobile1 m1-107a.
After the test I'll put on a normal size, non-relief valve oil filter.
So far I have had to buy, an oil filter, a 1/2 to 1/8 npt bushing and a 12x1.5mm to 4an turbo oil line adaptor.

 

[oil pan 4]

30 samples isn't "nonsense". It's the method of establishing statistically defined variation with a high degree of accuracy.

Visual samples of oil, through a clear vessel, are anecdotal and not data driven.

I would agree that adding a filter is a good idea; can't hurt.

I'm not trying to split hairs over which high end oil filter is better. I fully expect going from no oil filter to having an oil filter is going to produce a drastic improvement in oil quality.
Plus doing 30 oil samples would cost twice as much as the engine and use like 2 or 3 oil changes worth of oil.
Its at a minimum ridiculous and completely defeats the purpose of the no oil filter to oil filter test on the same oil.

 

[meep]

Alright I put a line on my oil pressure tap, put a valve and pressure gauge on the end. I wanted to see how much I could open the valve before the pressure dropped. I had hot oil spraying out of the sample port rather furiously before I noticed any loss in pressure at idle (for me idle is 1,800 to 2,000rpm) my 4an to oil drain adapter is for a turbo. It's restricted down to 2mm.
I'm just going to run it like that.
First sample was the line and valve purge, I let fly about 10oz, stopped the engine, dumped it back in, fired it up and took the sample.
I let the oil settle and bubble off for a half hour in a jar. I can easily see dozens and dozens maybe even hundreds of bits of metal dust reflecting the sunlight at any given moment in my 200cc oil sample.
For 4ish hours of run time the oil has a black translucent almost muddy appearance.
I have no doubt whatsoever adding a filter will improve the oil.
Collecting 30 samples in this case would be nonsense.

I want pictures. As a big fan of diy experimentation, this is worthy of pictures.

 

[oil pan 4]

I want pictures. As a big fan of diy experimentation, this is worthy of pictures.

This is about as drity as it gets. I made this from my destroyed 6.5hp direct drive DR chipper shredder. The oil system is mostly made out of salvaged stuff.

 

[oil pan 4]

 

[oil pan 4]

 

[meep]

This is awesome. It is more love than a predator engine should receive. You could also use an off board sump to increase the oil capacity and even add a cooler.

 

[oil pan 4]

Ran it for a half hour. It was making 30psi cold and about 24psi hot at idle with the 0.088 restricter fitting. Looks like I will need to further restrict that oil flow. I already have a plan. I'll restrict it down to probably about 1mm.
Pulled a sample after about 30 minutes. Looked about the same. I'll pour that back and check the level.
I took the original unfiltered sample gave it a shake and put it in a blackstone labs sample and poured the rest back in the engine. There's a lot of metal dust in the original sample, it has stratified into layers over the last 24hr.
Had to buy a brass 1/4npt cross. The green cap is where the samples come from.

 

[oil pan 4]

This is awesome. It is more love than a predator engine should receive. You could also use an off board sump to increase the oil capacity and even add a cooler.

Yes I installed an oil temperature sender just need to hook up the gauge. And see what the temp looks like under actual running conditions.

 

[oil pan 4]

Sent the 3hr unfiltered run time sample off today. I did not change the oil.
Now the plan is to install the restrictor fitting, get the oil pressure back above 40psi and run it 3 to 4 hours full speed, chipping wood, not add any new oil, pull another sample.

 

[oil pan 4]

I think my full size oil filter will be a Baldwin bt259 hydraulic filter.
It's 99% is at 12micron.
Bypasses at 20psid.
The mobile 1 filter is 99% at 30 micron, which beats the heck out of nothing.
it only has to flow like a gallon per minute or less. A quart per minute would be fine.

 

[Owen Lucas]

Yes, the magical 30 samples. So many who do not understand meaningful statistics don’t comprehend the weight of veracity this gives to the data. You’re no longer guessing.

It won’t matter to the average consumer on amazon. If someone makes an oil filter kit for this machine people will buy it and the meme power of putting a filter on your predator will sell like crazy.

Have the project farm guy back it up and you’ll have an item fly off the shelves.

Your educated BITOG will know better but if someone wants to make an unscrupulous buck this would be a great idea. Problem is someone from China will clone the kit and sell it for %50 less.

 

[oil pan 4]

I never intended to sell anything and still don't intend to.
There's no reason to make a kit, it's just a filter head and some plumbing, the only thing that's not a really super common part is the 12x1.5mm drain plug adapter.
Otherwise just get a filter and make it fit.

 

[oil pan 4]

Wear metals were high, 20 iron and 13 aluminum. SUS and cSt were low for a 20w-50 oil.
Fuel 2%, my fault I accidentally ran it for several minutes with the choke on.
They recommend running 10 to 15 more hours.

 

[oil pan 4]

I went with a valve that way I can open it up a little bit and give up 3 to 5 psi for oil filtration.

 

[oil pan 4]

Think I'll use a bt259 which has a 12 micron rating and 20mu absolute.
Or a bt344-s that has a 9.8mu rating.
For after the first round of testing.

 

[oil pan 4]

I got a bt-344 filter and put it on. I saved oil out of the smaller m-107a filter. I turned it upside down for an hour and drained as much oil out of it as I could get.
I fired up the engine for a few seconds and shut it off and checked oil level, it was no longer on the dip stick so I added some Pennzoil platinum 10w-30 to get the level back on the dip stick.
The bt-344 has about 3x more volume than the m-107a.
Also added an oil temperature gauge to see if it really needs an oil cooler since I'm planning on keeping the oil in there for 100 to 200 hours instead of 20.