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#2286868 - 06/13/11 11:01 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
Cujet Online   content


Registered: 02/15/03
Posts: 6313
Loc: Jupiter, Florida
Oh yeah, they are plastic. And, they do wear substantially. However, the geometry is tolerant of at least 1/8 inch of wear. That's due to the very large size of the lobe.

Here is a u tube video of a EU2000i valve adjustment. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7GKE_LZWCjA

You can see the plastic single lobe and the timing belt.
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#2287028 - 06/13/11 01:52 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
edhackett Offline


Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 1877
Loc: Sequim, WA
Ah, so a GX engine is not always a GX engine. Tricky those Honda guys.

Ed
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#2287083 - 06/13/11 03:05 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
car54 Offline


Registered: 06/15/05
Posts: 242
Loc: Wdbg, VA
Although it comes from a yamaha guy pitching his product, this video highlights some of the differences.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGUCSPpp4rs

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#2292462 - 06/20/11 12:26 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
JellyBeanDriver Offline


Registered: 06/26/10
Posts: 30
Loc: So. Calif.
I've got an Yamaha EF2000is, mostly because Wisesales could not get a Calif approved Honda EU2000ia AND Amazon had a killer deal on the Yamaha.

Some facts:
- Yes, the Yamaha is conventionally built. Flywheel on one side driving the magneto/spark plug, the other side of the crank is the alternator. gear driven steel camshaft. Head comes off the cylinder, and it has a cast iron cylinder.
- The Yamaha does NOT have the surge rating the Honda has. I did a video showing that it can only drive an 1850-1900W load for ~ 20 seconds. Yamaha themselves would not tell me how long it can drive a 2KW load. Honda clearly says 30 mins with no damage.

- Yes, Honda says the EU2000 has a GX100 engine BUT it really does have a plastic single lobe camshaft driven by a cogged belt AND it does not have a cast iron cylinder. There is no removable cylinder head so the crankcase halves are wedge shaped so you can get the piston out from the crankcase side. I like the fact that Honda has the alternator on the same side as the flywheel (the crank does not extend from both sides of the crankcase). Smart design and I feel helps their airflow paths. The Yamaha has to pull air in from the flywheel side to blow over the cylinder and head, but also has to pull air in from the other side of the motor across the alternator.

-Yamaha information and dealer network is really sparse and not up to date. Many online dealers showing parts don't even have the EF2000is listed - it's not that new of a generator. Heck, the owner's manual that came with my unit which was made in late 2010 says the warranty is 2 years and not three! I called Yamaha and they said any unit bought after Jan 2010 has a 3 year warranty and was surprised they were shipping old manuals with their units.

If both generators are in stock, I would have gotten the Honda though I like the Yamaha engine build better. Same price, surge capability, fuel pump so you can easily extend the tank, parts easy to find, very good dealer network, tips me towards Honda.

There are some other 'clones' inverter gens coming out but they have not yet mastered how to handle poor power factor and high surge loads.

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#2292589 - 06/20/11 08:52 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
raffy Offline


Registered: 09/21/09
Posts: 242
Loc: AL
According to the Honda GX100 engine web link (see my post above in this thread), the GX100 does have a cast iron sleeve. Technically JellyBeanDriver is correct in that the entire cylinder is not cast iron, but the surface that the piston rings run against is made of cast iron. Most of the rest of the engine block is aluminum to save weight.

Interesting info about the Yamaha engine having a metal camshaft. I definitely like that better than Honda's plastic one, especially after my friend had his plastic one (granted, it was in an "economy" Honda engine, not the GX100) fail after only a few hours of use.

It seems that Honda and Yamaha have competing warranties. My EU-2000i (purchased from Mayberry's around May, 2010) manual states only a 2 year warranty but Honda's website says that an EU-2000i purchased Jan. 1, 2010 or after has a 3 year warranty when purchased from American Honda or authorized dealer. The smaller EU-1000i only has the 2 year warranty, though.

http://www.hondapowerequipment.com/pdf/warranty/P-PWL50623-P.PE.Dist.Ltd.Warr.pdf
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2009 Toyota Corolla, Amsoil 0W-20

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#2292726 - 06/20/11 11:48 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
meep Offline


Registered: 02/20/07
Posts: 3308
Loc: Southeast
i bought the eu2000i and went through the same debate. the local genset dealer carried both. watts per dollar, i had been leaning towards the yamaha. In the end, i bought the honda.

he said both units were reliable, but he's had a very few yamaha's come back with carb issues-- says they seem more finicky than the hondas. said he'd never had a honda come back....

The honda has an internal fuel pump which allows an external tank to be rigged. since it only holds a gallon of fuel, this is a big deal if you need to live off the generator 24/7 for a few days. refueling the little tank every 4-6 hours becomes a nuisance.

Whatever engine is in the 2000i, it is solid. It actually took me a couple of years to break it in!! I used to get light smoke puff on cold start, but now at 3 years old and prolly ~125 hrs of use, it starts on the first pull often enough and runs quiet. it gets one OC per year... 5-30 or 10-30 syn.

The 2000i recently kept my fridge and the neighbor's fridge powered for 5 days 24x7 along with half of my house circuits, CFL lamps, fans, TV and radio, and ceiling fans. I worried about it being a strain, but managed properly, it did fine.

If I were to do it again, I would look harder at the yamaha, but it uses gravity fed fuel and is not as easily expanded to a larger tank. The eu2000 is easy to carry, with the lightweight plastics. 47lbs dry...

M

M
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#2292921 - 06/20/11 02:21 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
car54 Offline


Registered: 06/15/05
Posts: 242
Loc: Wdbg, VA
The yamaha doesnt use a fuel pump? I see a lot of the sites sell the add-on gas cap for it, I just figured it worked in a similar manner.

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#2293343 - 06/20/11 10:07 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: car54]
JellyBeanDriver Offline


Registered: 06/26/10
Posts: 30
Loc: So. Calif.
Nope, gravity fed on the Yamaha.

FWIW, people say the Honda doesn't have a fuel shutoff - not true. It does, but it also cuts the ignition so you cannot run the bowl empty.

Regarding which unit's carb is more finicky, I've mostly read people having issues with Hondas and not Yamahas, but I think it really comes down to whether your fuel has ethanol in it or not and how often you run your gen. The emulsion tube gets gummed up on the Hondas and I bet just as easily on the Yamaha too.

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#2294663 - 06/22/11 10:03 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
Cujet Online   content


Registered: 02/15/03
Posts: 6313
Loc: Jupiter, Florida
It's not easy. I am leaning towards the Yamaha still. I don't have a need for big time power. However, I do want the unit to last 30 years. And, the plastic parts are not ideal for that. I think there is a risk of them aging poorly.
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#2294708 - 06/22/11 10:51 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
meep Offline


Registered: 02/20/07
Posts: 3308
Loc: Southeast
heh. take one for the team-- try the yamaha... I'd personally like a bitog review on it. I do wish the eu2000 had a little more juice in reserve which the yamaha has. eu2000's max sustained load is 13.7 amps... and there have been times I wished it had more. I also like that the yamaha has all the controls on one side.

only thing I raise my eyebrow at--- reading above, does the eu2000i have a larger engine? this is a big deal if you are in eco mode and a big load hits.... it has to have enough hp to rev up immediately without getting bogged down. the eu2000i most of the time spools up without fuss but you know it's just gone WOT until it reaches the needed rpm. IF the surge is too high, it will go zero volt, spool up, and go active.... rather than risk brown-out which could hurt genset and device. a weaker HP engine will not handle the spool-up from eco mode as well.
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2015 crv (wifey!)
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#2295181 - 06/22/11 07:45 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
JellyBeanDriver Offline


Registered: 06/26/10
Posts: 30
Loc: So. Calif.
Meep,
The Honda has more power in reserve, not the Yamaha.

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#2295595 - 06/23/11 08:44 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
meep Offline


Registered: 02/20/07
Posts: 3308
Loc: Southeast
in my personal experience, that reserve is very important!
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2015 crv (wifey!)
2005 s60 2.4L

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#2295611 - 06/23/11 09:13 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
raffy Offline


Registered: 09/21/09
Posts: 242
Loc: AL
Yes, the reserve power capability is important. During the recent tornado-induced power outages here in the south, we wound up heating leftovers using the over-the-stove microwave with our EU-2000i. It was in eco mode but handled the load without any problem, although it sounded like it was at full throttle the whole time the microwave was running. I later looked at the power output sticker of the microwave, and I was shocked to find it was 1.58 kW! Much more than I had thought, which means the generator had to be putting out more than that. I bet the startup load was close to 2 kW, which is the maximum for that generator. But it did it, no problem, no red light on the genny. With the Yamaha EF-2000i only being about 1.8 kW or so, that might have been a problem.

If I were going to get a Yamaha, I'd probably go for the EF-2400i.
_________________________
2008 Honda Ridgeline, Amsoil 0W-20
2004 Honda Odyssey, Amsoil 0W-20
2000 Saturn SL, Mobil 1 5W-30
2009 Toyota Corolla, Amsoil 0W-20

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#2295696 - 06/23/11 11:07 AM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
meep Offline


Registered: 02/20/07
Posts: 3308
Loc: Southeast
that red light, and the overload protect, i believe, is a TEMP sensor on the inverter. If you read the manual, it's a little unclear on *exactly* what it can and can't handle. It will produce over the rated 13.7 amps, but the higher the draw, and shorter the duration, and it also mentions reduced lifespan on the components. So the transistors may overtemp for brief periods before the heat wave makes it through the casing to the sensor... and i think it said something like 20 minutes at 1800 watts, less for 2000 watts... with a peak of slightly more?

My circular saw, handheld, will blink the overload light if the rotor is close to locked during high-cycle use.

It takes a lot of use to run a 1.5kw microwave!!!

M
_________________________
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2015 crv (wifey!)
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#2295811 - 06/23/11 01:16 PM Re: Inverter generators: Honda EU2000i vs Yam EF2000is [Re: Cujet]
IndyIan Offline


Registered: 09/23/08
Posts: 8269
Loc: Ontario, Canada
I think the inverter generators in general have a bit more starting capacity than they advertise. My EF2800 will start my fridge and freezer at the same time in eco mode, and when I bought it, I brought a 1500W hairdryer and my 15 amp mitre saw and cut 2X12's to the point of almost jamming the saw and it just revved up a little.
Maybe for 100's of hard starts like running a well pump for weeks maybe they don't stand up like a conventional generator would?
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