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Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: GumbyJarvis] #5287382 12/07/19 02:29 AM
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ZeeOSix Offline
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Originally Posted by GumbyJarvis
Originally Posted by bbhero
Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
Originally Posted by bbhero
Other filters have had oil come out and I have had to use a paper towel to clean up the front side of the motor.


There's a trick I use to to prevent that on my Tacoma. wink



Yeah I think it is to put a hole in the top of the filter... If I am not mistaken.



Gallon ziploc freezer bag, loosen the filter a tad, place bag over it, continue unscrewing until filter falls in bag.


Won't work in his or my case.

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287387 12/07/19 02:47 AM
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GumbyJarvis Offline
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Originally Posted by ZeeOSix


Won't work in his or my case.


Yeah. It works with vertical filters though. Especially rams where you have to finagle a filter and try not to get oil coming out in every which direction.

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287394 12/07/19 03:21 AM
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wrcsixeight Offline OP
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The filter mounts on my engine at a 45 degree angle, dome end down.

I am not sticking my lips up to a dirty oil filter for the blow test, nor rigging up a sterile way to do so.

It's simply too freakingly overwhelmingly obvious it drained down through the ADBV.

There is no more start up rattle.

Note I bought and used another Fram Ultra, but if I hear that start up rattle again, out it comes, and never FU again.



Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287422 12/07/19 05:39 AM
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Lubener Offline
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10k and 13 months, you got your money's worth out of it.


The "thinking" man's friend.
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287438 12/07/19 06:21 AM
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Triple_Se7en Offline
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You have a LA 318 roller cam..... what ever that is! But do you have a vehicle brand - year - model name and engine size displacement please?
Why are you NOT telling us what vehicle this filter was installed on?


19' Hyundai Santa Fe 2.4 GDI - Valv Adv. 5w30 / OEM Oil Filter / 6oz Liqui-Moly
20' Kia Soul X-Line 2.0 Multi-port / Pennzoil Gold 5W30 / OEM filter
04' Colorado 3.5 Castrol Edge 0W40 / K&N filter
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287457 12/07/19 06:54 AM
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bullwinkle Offline
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Not that it should matter, but doesn't a Dodge 318 generally use a PH/XG16? I use the XG8A on the Jeep 4.0 in my sig, it's mounted sideways, not had an ADBV issue with one yet. XG2 on the 4.6 mounted at a 45 degree angle, it's been fine too. I have to put this one in the "doo-doo happens" category, sometimes things happen.


06 Ram 3500 CTD 4X4(FG Venturi), 93 GMC C3500 6.2, 89 F-450 7.3, 98 XJ 4.0(XG8A), 05 xB(XG3600), 18 Transit 3.7, 03 Merc Grand Marquis 4.6 2V(XG2)
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287481 12/07/19 07:29 AM
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Snagglefoot Offline
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I’ve been changing the oil in my 6.0 Chevy for almost 12 years. It’s a vertical orientation. It always dumps oil as soon as I loosen the filter, including with a Fram XG.


If you want the job done right......do it yourself.
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287542 12/07/19 08:49 AM
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alarmguy Offline
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This is why I prefer to run cheap oil (that meets the specs anyway) and filters and change often then the other way around. I would be upset.

Last edited by alarmguy; 12/07/19 08:49 AM.

14 Road King (current)
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Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287570 12/07/19 09:38 AM
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Farnsworth Offline
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The Fram baseplate doesn't capture and center the adbv, the valve just lays on top of it. The centering in done by the can tabs on the end cap. not very precise. Combine that error with base holes being off center error and too high up on the crown of the baseplate and the holes can be exposed, leaking. If air is allowed into the filter the vacuum breaks and he filter drains out. The Fram baseplate and adv is an old and lousy design IMO. Time to upgrade that design.

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: ZeeOSix] #5287581 12/07/19 09:55 AM
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MrMoody Offline
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Originally Posted by ZeeOSix
I asked the same, wondering what the orientation was. If it's vertical with base up, then proves that an ADBV is also important with that mounting orientation, which has been argued for years around here, lol.
No argument here. My LS2 with filter straight up WILL drain out through the filter if the ADBV doesn't seal. Clatter, clatter, clatter. No question, no argument. The engine galleries will drain through the filter if they are higher than the sump, no matter which way the filter is oriented.

318s are all upward at 45 degrees as far as I know, unless remoted. Many of them have room for the 8A unless the exhaust manifold is in the way. All 3 of mine did.


2018 Hyundai Kona 1.6T DCT
2006 Pontiac (Holden) GTO AT
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2005 Toyota Matrix FWD (ultra beater)
"Fob" and "Noack" are not acronyms.
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287616 12/07/19 10:44 AM
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Farnsworth Offline
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This is the first thread that shows proof of the “I got a start up rattle” with a Fram. The seal isn’t good when design and manufacturing errors add up in the wrong direction.

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: wrcsixeight] #5287696 12/07/19 12:42 PM
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Oro_O Offline
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Quote
This, I would think would limit fatigue. I have at least one of these ADBV’s on the shelf and will gladly supply a picture illustrating these tabs if I must. One more observation I have made is that Ford Motorcraft and Ford Racing Filter ADBV’s are labeled FOMOCO.


Interesting, but I don't think it's a definitive advantage. Ford filters were the only one's where the adbv wold consistenly fail in our Lexus (three Motorcraft in a row); I went to FU to solve it and no problems for years now.

I think different applications apply different stresses - even independent of manufacturing issues.

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: Farnsworth] #5287706 12/07/19 12:59 PM
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newtoncd8 Offline
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Originally Posted by Farnsworth
This is the first thread that shows proof of the “I got a start up rattle” with a Fram. The seal isn’t good when design and manufacturing errors add up in the wrong direction.


It may be small numbers, but when you personally experience the issue, it is pretty unnerving. Our RX330 had a major knocking sound (much more than a rattle) upon start-up after sitting overnight with the XG3614.

I sent the filter to car51 and he dissected it, but didn't see anything visually wrong -- I switched back to the Toyota 90915-YZZD1/3 filter.

Here is the thread: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...723/fram-ultra-3614-6-500-miles-cut-open



12 Jeep GC, 04 Lexus RX330, 77 MG-B
Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: Farnsworth] #5287709 12/07/19 01:03 PM
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ZeeOSix Offline
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Originally Posted by Farnsworth
The Fram baseplate doesn't capture and center the adbv, the valve just lays on top of it. The centering in done by the can tabs on the end cap. not very precise. Combine that error with base holes being off center error and too high up on the crown of the baseplate and the holes can be exposed, leaking. If air is allowed into the filter the vacuum breaks and he filter drains out. The Fram baseplate and adv is an old and lousy design IMO. Time to upgrade that design.


The ADBV is captured and centered in the end cap center hole, and the ADBV hole annulous is pinched between the end cap and base plate to seal around the center tube. The element assembly is centered in the can by tabs on the outside circumference of the end cap. My photo shows the tabs.

Nothing wrong with the design. One guy reports a leaky ADBV and all of a sudden "the design is old and lousy". LOL

Re: ADBV Failure FU XG-8A ,10K miles 13 months [Re: Oro_O] #5287731 12/07/19 01:35 PM
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69Torino Offline
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Originally Posted by Oro_O
Quote
This, I would think would limit fatigue. I have at least one of these ADBV’s on the shelf and will gladly supply a picture illustrating these tabs if I must. One more observation I have made is that Ford Motorcraft and Ford Racing Filter ADBV’s are labeled FOMOCO.


Interesting, but I don't think it's a definitive advantage. Ford filters were the only one's where the adbv wold consistenly fail in our Lexus (three Motorcraft in a row); I went to FU to solve it and no problems for years now.

I think different applications apply different stresses - even independent of manufacturing issues.


Some Motorcraft filters do not have a silicone ADBV. The silicone valve part numbers will have an “S” at the end. Maybe your part number was a nitrile valve? The FL1-A is still a nitrile valve. But the Ford Racing version has silicone.


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