Oil recommendation for Honda Civic with LPG usage

[HiqhWoltage]

Hi everyone, I have a honda civic 9. gen. at 100k kms and it has 1.6lt motor that natural aspirated. I'm using it with lpg kit. I'm living Istanbul and generaly its hot here (usually 30 Celcius in summer) and there is also a lot of traffic (avg. speed 30-40km/s usually). My OCI is about 10-12K kms (7-8k miles). I have used Eneos 0w20 first 40k kms, Mobil 1 0w30 fuel economy for 2 OCIs and then I'm using Motul 5w30 Eco-Nergy which is Full saps. I have not got any oil analaysis. And i have not seen any problem with these oils.

So, here my question: Full saps motor oils are good for lpg users ? I've read some comments that says it's not... Honda service recommends 0w20, 5w30 Acea A5 , A1 or A3... Does not mention about saps. I just find out what is the best oil for my car. Then i will go with it.

I can buy Motul 0w20 eco-lite, or Motul 5w30 Eco clean (C3 Mid saps). These oils has good quality. What do you think?

Thank you.

 

[tahoe_hybrid]

mobil1 annual protection LPG does not make much carbon so the oil last quite a bit of time

the typical OCI is about 15k or once a year which ever comes first miles on LPG (propane or natural gas correct??)

change it when it starts getting dirty, that is my Oil change POLICY .

 

[UrS4]

If it was my car I would go with what well known and reputable brands (Mobil, shell, total, castrol, ect) recommends for that engine and at the same time comply with Hondas recommendations regarding acea / API.
I would probably lean towards castrol 0w30 or 5w30 and then 12-15K depending on how many short trips, or do oil analysis.

You seem to care a lot about your engine,
Maybe "castrol edge professional h" is something for you - they claim it has been co-engineered with honda....


And by the way,
Don't determine oci based on how "dirty" the oil is, that's dumb - and even dumber if it's an engine running on lpg!

 

[tahoe_hybrid]

LPG is . It is a mixture of propane and butane dumb [censored] those don't make a [censored] load of carbon

that is the main issue of engine failure (the carbon wears away at the aluminium in the engine and wears away the seals causing leaks)

mobil1 annual protection will work fine for 10 to 15k miles with a mobil1 filter in a LPG or CNG Honda civic
..


For me I have ACTIVE FUEL MANAGEMENT


The valve lifter oil manifold (VLOM) assembly solenoids foul up badly a cause catastrophic engine failure if the oil is dirty...

and 1/16"ID oil tubes clog with sludge starving the upper part of the engine (valve rockers etc..)

THIS is a very good example of poor maintenance

https://youtu.be/NQfA2UXsnjU?t=418


There is No oil flow tell about 45 seconds

that is why many many AFM engine burn a ton of oil BAD maintenance on the owners part

My AFM system is in perfect working order and burns NO oil 6qt in and 6qt out at the oil change
that is because i keep the system Clean as a whistle . No sludge NO bull [censored]

it shifts so smoothly from v4 to v8 and back again 100% undetectable by the driver or passengers
I also use 91 octane to prevent AFM engine knock

 

[gamefoo21]

Propane burning makes lots of water. It fouls sumps with water.

Or so I thought...

 

[dave1251]

You are off on more than a couple subjects there.

 

[dave1251]

OP I would use a reputable 5W30 and get the lube tested via analysis at 6K miles.

 

[HiqhWoltage]

Originally Posted by tahoe_hybrid
mobil1 annual protection LPG does not make much carbon so the oil last quite a bit of time

the typical OCI is about 15k or once a year which ever comes first miles on LPG (propane or natural gas correct??)

change it when it starts getting dirty, that is my Oil change POLICY .


There is no Mobil 1 Annual protection on sale in Turkey. I just looked it and it's looks good with its approvals.
LPG does not makes sulphuric acid or smut like diesel. Therefore, it takes more time to get black. Maybe when the air filter expired then oil gets dirty. My policy is: Change the oil at max. 11k kms .

 

[HiqhWoltage]

Originally Posted by UrS4
If it was my car I would go with what well known and reputable brands (Mobil, shell, total, castrol, ect) recommends for that engine and at the same time comply with Hondas recommendations regarding acea / API.
I would probably lean towards castrol 0w30 or 5w30 and then 12-15K depending on how many short trips, or do oil analysis.

You seem to care a lot about your engine,
Maybe "castrol edge professional h" is something for you - they claim it has been co-engineered with honda....


And by the way,
Don't determine oci based on how "dirty" the oil is, that's dumb - and even dumber if it's an engine running on lpg!

I just take a look to castrol edge pro's datasheet. Its looking good but there is no info abaout its sulfated ash percent and its TBN. Unfortunatly its not on sale in Turkey.

I'm trying to find which parameters should i look to choose the best oil for my car.

I think, i wouldn't be worried about oils TBN values because of lpg. I just want to learn is it good using full saps oil in my car ?

 

[HiqhWoltage]

Originally Posted by Guybrush
Interesting.

My discoveries the last 24 hours has gone in the same direction as this thread...

Quote
For a long time I wondered why there are "LPG engine oils." I recently I found a great site that explains that. Actually quite simple and logical. One should LOW SAPS use oils that are required for a number of years with the diesels with DPF. These are low-ash oils. Ash-rich oils, NO Low Saps, standard oils, no matter what price range, the intake valves can become encrusted, since a small amount by the shanks is drawn and blowing through the vent. Also the piston crown may become encrusted. LOW SAPS oils are far less inclined to do so. When enough petrol additives in it to wash the valves and keep the pistons / combustion chambers clean. Case of LPG, as we all know, nothing in it ... Anyway, everything positive and enlightening. My car get future only LOW SAPS. Regards, Heiko


The text above is google translated from Lpgforum.de, where they recommend VW 504/507 oils because they are LOW SAPS. I do not know if this is sound advice for flat tapped engines.

They recommend Fuchs Titan GT1 Pro C3 5W-30 (see data sheet). The oil is ACEA C3, ACEA A3/B4 which means HTHS >3.5 which is right for my Audi. (For reference: Audi 12V can have 5W-30 - Blauparts actually lists a 5W-30 oil for it with kinematic viscosity at 100 'C of 10.x.. - But I've read on BITOG that if going 5W-30 it should be a thick one, like the Fuchs in question which @ 100 'C is 11.7.)

But I assume it has pathetic zinc and phosphor due to VW 504/507 low saps formula. Fuchs doesn't say. But I was lucky enough to find a VOA (virgin oil analysis...for newcomers like me) of the oil!

Although Fuchs doesn't market this oil for LPG, it looks similar to AMSOIL Synthetic Vehicular Natural Gas 15W-40 (see data sheet ) in terms of being low ash, low TBN,..

These attributes were surprising to me, as some people recommend HDEOs like Mobil Delvac 1. These oils are pretty much in the opposite end of spectrum...? Compared to the aforementioned AMSOIL, Mobil Delvac 1 5W-40 (see data sheet ) is up 105% on TBN, and up 130% on ash content!!

HDEOs has bucket loads of zinc and phosphorus, but according to some, ZDDP is dead...? Do you call [censored] on this?

Would you personally use the Fuchs with Boron 80, Zinc 750, Phosphorus 650, HTHS >3.5 in a flat tapped engine?


Cheers

I found this comment that i quated. It is for an Audi with lpg. What do you think guys ?


https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php/topics/3678973/Re:_Oil_for_Audi_12V_on_LPG

 

[Bailes1992]

My experience of LPG is it is very clean burning and TBN depletion is very slow.

I'd pick an A3/B4 lubricant in *w30 or *w40 with some nice approvals like 229.5 or LL01 etc.

Castrol Edge 0w40, M1 FS 0w40, Shell Helix Ultra 5w40 etc.

 

[Silk]

This is how we did it in NZ when CNG/LPG was very common. The diamonds say approved for gas fuels. This is what Mitsubishi supply here for their vehicles, it's rebottled Castrol Edge 5W-30, A3/B4.

 

[HiqhWoltage]

Thank you for your advice @Silk.

So, the mitsubish oil is same as castrol edge A3 ? Right ?

https://msdspds.castrol.com/bpglis/FusionPDS.nsf/Files/6E381DAAE02AB64780257D540060FBE8/$File/BPXE-9P9HK3.pdf

It's a fullsaps motor oil then, and has good approvals too. I like it.

However, the problem is there is not 5w30 A3 castrol here, there are 10w40 a3's and 5w30 A5.

I think i'm gonna be with Motul 5w30 Eco-lite. It tells something ebout LPG

https://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/motul-production2/images/product_descriptions/technical_data_sheets/81588/8100_Eco-lite_5W-30_%28GB%29.pdf?1519924727

What do you think ? Motul has no A3 because of its HTHS <3.5, and no A5 because of thicker viscosity prevents fuel economy... Bu it has API SN and GF5