Recent Topics
New gaming build shutting down on Metro 2033
by Cujet - 02/17/20 07:09 PM
Snapon
by P10crew - 02/17/20 06:51 PM
Conventional or Synthetic
by charmer37 - 02/17/20 06:49 PM
Jeep Wrangler 3.0L Diesel
by HighbrowHillbill - 02/17/20 06:36 PM
94 B4000 overheat Eureka
by HyundaiAbuser - 02/17/20 05:48 PM
PP Euro 5w40 SN Plus formulation VOA
by BurntMusic - 02/17/20 04:35 PM
Bicycle Shops
by CourierDriver - 02/17/20 04:26 PM
EBC Brakes
by hatt - 02/17/20 04:17 PM
Dream Car
by MrQuackers - 02/17/20 04:06 PM
What are people using now for outdoor antennas?
by BAJA_05 - 02/17/20 02:49 PM
3.0L TDI
by Shorthorn - 02/17/20 02:48 PM
Mountain Bike Whee/Tire Sizes!
by jcartwright99 - 02/17/20 02:21 PM
Found this old Fram XG8A on eBay
by blufeb95 - 02/17/20 01:54 PM
2005 Civic Horn Replacement
by cb450sc - 02/17/20 01:51 PM
QS Conv vs. QS HM vs. PYB
by Fordiesel69 - 02/17/20 01:09 PM
Kia Proceed?
by WhyMe - 02/17/20 12:44 PM
RIP Donald Stratton
by 02SE - 02/17/20 12:41 PM
Newest Members
Predator35001819, Markapuu, jds59, JimMorrison, bjfangjd
70727 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
114 registered members (5AcresAndAFool, 2015_PSD, 28oz, 2002 Maxima SE, 2013ecof150, 13 invisible), 2,172 guests, and 22 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums67
Topics301,584
Posts5,198,498
Members70,727
Most Online4,538
Jan 20th, 2020
Donate to BITOG
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5188613 08/16/19 08:31 AM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7
A
Anton_N Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7
So, I didn’t give up… and I learn what a lot of manufactures for engine additives do not want to tell ingredients they use for, they are saying this is a secret, and they can not share because of competitive. Same time they keep saying what their product unique, and much more what they never prove.
But if their product has a patent, they can share more information, more detail, not very deep, but even little more detail about what they use.
After my research I have left only two, who share the product details, what they use and how and why it will work with technical and exclamational details. They are open to public what additives included carbon fulleroid nanoparticles.
You can google a lot of information from about benefits of carbon fulleroid nanoparticles in additives for reduction of the friction losses and increase of the wear resistance
I decide to trust this information from different scientist.
Those two company is Tribotex and ArmActiv.
First is US product, second from Russia, what interesting Russian company using the patent issued in USA. Bot product use carbon fulleroid nanoparticles. Both companies claiming very interesting results.
And if first it is from scantiest from university, second from Russian scientist who first have made huge progress in nuclear research, they have always been in the forefront of scientific discoveries, and a lot of their scientists work in USA laboratories ...

Wil check more information for these 2 products. If I decide to try, I will share …

Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5188702 08/16/19 10:38 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 12,537
PimTac Offline
Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 12,537
The internet is full of information that will confirm anyone’s thoughts. Blueberries help prevent cancer? Sure, there are lots of articles on the Internet. Blueberries cause cancer? You will find those as well.


It’s called confirmation bias.


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: PimTac] #5188770 08/16/19 12:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,485
K
kschachn Offline
Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,485
I agree. In the end, and from a performance standpoint it is entirely irrelevant what is in the additive and it makes zero difference if the company discloses the composition or not. It also doesn't matter if it is from Russia, the US or Lichtenstein. It also doesn't matter if it has nano particles or macro ones, or if they are fullerenes (hey we made those in the lab I worked at back in the early '90s) or bucky onions.

What actually does matter is the results of standardized tests that prove it does something statistically significant, repeatable, and worthwhile to the purchaser. Once those tests are published by the manufacturer of the additive I'm all ears. Until then it is just more unsubstantiated yapping.


1994 BMW 530i, 251K
1996 Honda Accord, 280K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 430K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: kschachn] #5188803 08/16/19 12:36 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 12,537
PimTac Offline
Offline
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 12,537
I caught that subtle reference to Buckminster Fuller


2017 Mazda CX5
Valvoline Advanced Synthetic 0w20
Roki OEM filter.
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5188840 08/16/19 01:30 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7
A
Anton_N Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7
Now even serious organization have all information available on internet. I read topics from universities and institutions. What do you thinkcan we trust Shell or Mobil?

Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5188843 08/16/19 01:40 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,485
K
kschachn Offline
Offline
K
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,485
Originally Posted by Anton_N
Now even serious organization have all information available on internet. I read topics from universities and institutions. What do you thinkcan we trust Shell or Mobil?

Funny and completely untrue. What company divulges proprietary trade secrets?

What they may divulge is performance test results. Again for these additives, where are those? Shell and ExxonMobil divulge performance results all the time. I know which ones meet API SN or have Porsche A40 approval for example. I know which ones are fuel-saving formulas. Which 3rd party additives publish test results to prove their claims?

Your post is only more irrelevant obfuscation and diversion.


1994 BMW 530i, 251K
1996 Honda Accord, 280K
1999 Toyota Sienna, 430K
2000 Toyota ECHO, 284K
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5189005 08/16/19 04:51 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 28,128
G
Garak Offline
Offline
G
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 28,128
Originally Posted by Anton_N
What do you thinkcan we trust Shell or Mobil?

Look at it this way. What do you think any automaker that relies on CAFE credits (they all do) would do and/or say if all the oil companies were intentionally withholding an almost free ingredient that would automatically give you 10-20% better fuel economy?


Plain, simple Garak.

2008 Infiniti G37 - Shell ROTELLA T6 Multi-Vehicle 5w-30, Wix 57356
1984 F-150 4.9L - Quaker State GB 10w-30, Wix 51515
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5189984 08/17/19 10:23 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,889
MolaKule Offline
Global Moderator
Offline
Global Moderator
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,889
Originally Posted by Anton_N
I read topics from universities and institutions...



Can you provide us a list of those Universities, papers and authors? Maybe we can help you understand some of those papers.

Last edited by MolaKule; 08/18/19 01:56 PM.

Charlie Eppes: "Larry, have a minute?"
Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "Yes. Because we all have exactly the same number of minutes at all times, do we not?" From NUMB3RS
Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: MolaKule] #5282774 12/02/19 10:31 AM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7
A
Anton_N Offline OP
OP Offline
A
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 7

Re: I heard a lot but never used any engine additives for protection and some fuel s [Re: Anton_N] #5283571 12/03/19 12:30 AM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,889
MolaKule Offline
Global Moderator
Offline
Global Moderator
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 20,889
Originally Posted by Anton_N
Sure. Have a look at some links that I found on internet:

https://www.researchgate.net/public...anical_and_Wear_Properties_of_AZ31_Alloy


Not applicable to automotive drivelines.




The application here is for metalworking so not applicable to automotive drivelines.


https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s12239-017-0102-9

https://www.researchgate.net/public...on_nanomaterials_as_lubricants_modifiers[/quote]


Neither of the two above can accessed without a subscription or payment, but here are two main problems i have found with nano-carbon research thus far:

1) Agglomeration of carbon nanostructures without special dispersants can actually increase friction and load up filters. Agglomeration means that the nano-carbon structures group together to form larger particles, similar to soot.

2) In order to disperse these particles, conventional friction reduction chemistry must be used to disperse these particles to keep them from agglomerating.

From one of my Materials papers:

"...To exert the lubricating properties of graphene in a lubricant, the dispersibility of graphene in the lubricant must be considered. The dispersity of graphene in most lubricants is very poor [23]. Chemical modification is usually used to improve its dispersity. For instance, Lin et al. [24] reported that after chemical modification by stearic acid and oleic acid, the dispersibility of graphene in base oil was obviously improved...

So if one has to use those friction modification acids to disperse the Graphene, how does one differentiate the friction modification contributed by the Graphene and the friction modification contributed by those friction modifiers?

So while interesting, carbon nanoparticles have not proven any efficacy in real world automotive engine tests.

And with that we will close this thread.


Charlie Eppes: "Larry, have a minute?"
Dr. Larry Fleinhardt: "Yes. Because we all have exactly the same number of minutes at all times, do we not?" From NUMB3RS
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Previous Thread
Index
Next Thread

BOB IS THE OIL GUY® Powered by UBB.threads™