will they ever be a push back on car technology?

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: MCompact
I tended to avoid a lot of features such as navigation and voice recognition; the CPO M235i I wound up with had those options, but I went with it anyway since it was RWD(even in the Ohio Valley nitwits think AWD is necessary). Anyway, I've come to appreciate the systems and I especially like being able to send destinations to the car from my phone.
On the other hand, I'd pay extra to delete most all of the Helen Keller "driving aids"- the only "aids" I find useful are the front/rear proximity sensors.

Similar situation here. 5 years ago, I'd never have paid money for Bluetooth integration, voice commands, cruise control, or an "upgraded" sound system. But all that stuff came with my RX-8 and I ended up liking most of it. Good Bluetooth integration almost feels like a safety feature now. Voice commands are super convenient.

What I do wish my car had was climate control, just so I don't have to keep fiddling with the HVAC controls all the time. I kind of wish it had power rear quarter windows, too.

Friend of mine put it best: everything directly related to the act of driving should be manual; everything else should be automatic. The perfect car would have a manual transmission, a cable throttle, and unadulterated brakes and steering (other than power assist) -- but automatic headlights, auto-dimming mirrors, and automatic climate control.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


Of course they do (myself included) until it breaks.

 

[edwardh1]

Originally Posted By: brages
Features I like:

• Power windows
• Power locks
• Keyless entry
• Cruise control
• Bluetooth aux in
• Heated mirrors
• Auto headlights (why not?)

Features I think I would like:

• Adaptive cruise control
• Lane assist
• Rain-sensing wipers
• Auto dimming mirrors

Features I could live without:

• Dual zone climate control
• Automatic climate control
• On-board GPS
• Onstar type service
• Homelink garage openers
• Power seats

Features I don't like:

• Integration of audio system that makes aftermarket head units problematic
• Super expensive keys that can only be programmed by the dealer
• Electronic modules that must be reprogrammed by the dealer to be replaced
• Automatic transmissions

In short, I think "modern" (which to me is circa 2006) cars are great and I like most of the features. The only thing that bugs me is the proprietary programming that makes it more likely that some dumb accessory failure can "total" the value of the car to repair.


well said!!!

 

[edwardh1]

Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


Of course they do (myself included) until it breaks.


and most love the super trick tires on their BMW that they paid extra for, but when the tire guy says they are $585 and they say gee not bad for 4 tires, and he says no you dont understand- I have seen this is costco at least 4 times

 

[Cujet]

Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


I think part of the problem is that the simple cars are the economy cars, and not particularly inspiring or fun. Good luck finding a larger, capable, family car with zero cockpit gizmos now.

 

[AVB]

That is what I was thinking, the problem isn't the lack of features it is the car itself.

 

[jstert]

both cars in my signature are base level, simple and enjoyable. both were bought used so the first owner took the depreciation bath. the push back against complex technology, high priced gizmos, and car payments the size of mortgages 30 years ago is between your ears and in your left rear pocket. now if i could only find a car with vent front side windows...

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: edwardh1


and most love the super trick tires on their BMW that they paid extra for, but when the tire guy says they are $585 and they say gee not bad for 4 tires, and he says no you dont understand- I have seen this is costco at least 4 times


Haha yup. Both mine and my GF's BMWs have been converted to regular tires instead of the stupid run flats. Much cheaper and they ride so much better.

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted By: edwardh1

and most love the super trick tires on their BMW that they paid extra for, but when the tire guy says they are $585 and they say gee not bad for 4 tires, and he says no you dont understand- I have seen this is costco at least 4 times


Wow, some folks get hosed... I paid a whopping $828 for four Michelin PSS tires for the 2er- replete with the BMW "Star."

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


I think part of the problem is that the simple cars are the economy cars, and not particularly inspiring or fun. Good luck finding a larger, capable, family car with zero cockpit gizmos now.
Pretty much. I wanted to buy a Versa on the premise of it being dirt-simple, but for the want of a bit more sound deadner it was a no-go.

 

[Silverado12]

Originally Posted By: supton
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


I think part of the problem is that the simple cars are the economy cars, and not particularly inspiring or fun. Good luck finding a larger, capable, family car with zero cockpit gizmos now.
Pretty much. I wanted to buy a Versa on the premise of it being dirt-simple, but for the want of a bit more sound deadner it was a no-go.


Problem is with a Versa you'll be working on it more than buying a decent used car in the first place that's a whole lot better and safer to begin with. A friend of mine had one and he said is was a miserable POS.

 

[Kestas]

Originally Posted By: raytseng
the reason there wont be pushback is people who buy cars that are getting made will be enjoying them under warranty and not having to care or pay should stuff break for the first 3 or 4 years.

There actually was a bit of push back some 10 or 15 years ago. New car buyers began to realize their vehicles had little residual value when they went to trade it in and started complaining. The price of used cars dropped quicker than they did before. Few people wanted to pay good money for a used car that they knew was going to start developing problems and be very expensive to fix. I haven't heard much about that lately. People probably got used to all cars being expensive to fix nowadays.

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


Of course they do (myself included) until it breaks.


Yeah, it's strange that this thread seems to be dominated by people who want basic cars, but there are very few base model sold. Also not that many cars that are fully loaded. I see that term used all the time, but once all the options are added on, the price can really skyrocket.

I like all the tech and it's even nicer if you can find a used car with lots of options, they're not usually priced into nadadguide, just some of the basic option.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: Silverado12
Problem is with a Versa you'll be working on it more than buying a decent used car in the first place that's a whole lot better and safer to begin with. A friend of mine had one and he said is was a miserable POS.


That's the thing, for a couple grand more it'd be decent--and simple.

Anyhow, my point was, I would have bought, if it just was slightly better than what it was. And I skipped on the Mirage as I thought it had poorly spent its budget on gizmos (well that and a few other reasons). As it is, my fleet IMO qualifies as simple (for this day and age): no backup cameras, lane departure, etc. TPMS is functional on only one of them; only one of them has auto up windows. Only one has RKE. I will admit to having BT on two of them though, and if I drove the third any amount I would have added it by now. Two are so base they didn't even have a model name!

Although I did find myself adjusting the power seat in my '99 the other day while driving and was immediately amazed at the ability to do so. Have to admit, I might think about making that a priority in the next vehicle purchase. Power windows, power mirrors and now power seat. I'm going downhill I'm afraid.

 

[DweezilAZ]

Originally Posted By: supton
Originally Posted By: Cujet
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


I think part of the problem is that the simple cars are the economy cars, and not particularly inspiring or fun. Good luck finding a larger, capable, family car with zero cockpit gizmos now.
Pretty much. I wanted to buy a Versa on the premise of it being dirt-simple, but for the want of a bit more sound deadner it was a no-go.


Ahhh, but the money you saved would have paid for a lot of Dyna Mat

 

[DweezilAZ]

Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: Miller88
How many people buy base model Versas with crank windows and basic head unit ?

Not that many. Most people love the technology


Of course they do (myself included) until it breaks.


Yeah, it's strange that this thread seems to be dominated by people who want basic cars, but there are very few base model sold. Also not that many cars that are fully loaded. I see that term used all the time, but once all the options are added on, the price can really skyrocket.

I like all the tech and it's even nicer if you can find a used car with lots of options, they're not usually priced into nadadguide, just some of the basic option.


Wolf, I actually DO buy the base models.

Even on the 05 ION 1 there was drive by wire, electronic steering assist, power brakes.

Aside from the AC and auto I "splurged" on floor mats.

BTW, had the manual been as pleasing to shift as the 95 SL1 I had, would have been my choice. As it was I found it noisy and jumpy and irritating to operate. Not a plus in LA traffic, so automatic it was.

Perfectly satisfying, great mileage, low operating costs, huge trunk, tiny turn radius. I've never paid for a power window repair [on all of my cars, none has had them], keys I can have ground at Ace for $1.98, tires are inexpensive.

I bought a car with cruise control once. It didn't work.

But it's a dying market for people like me.

Way back in 1964 Motor Trend addressed the same people asking the same thing and tested a 64 Plymouth Savoy, manual, base V8, radio delete and came to the conclusion that a few more options would have made the car more livable.

They also observed that what people said they wanted was not what they actually bought.

So this is nothing new.

My 63 Valiant Signet was delivered with radio, heater and probably whitewalls. No auto, PS, PB, PW, 225 six, AC.

When I bought it years ago it's simplicity and lack of things to go wrong {i was young then and just starting out. If something went out, I could fix it myself} became the template for what I wanted in a new car. And I've followed that standard for decades.

But then, I buy my cars for the long long term, a couple of decades if possible. Not the ordinary buyer, for certain.

Simplicity, ease of service, parts availability over the long haul are all priorities, not the lease or purchase payment.

So much is standard on even the most basic cars, they are like the fully equipped models of 20 years ago.

I simply don't need or have an interest in all of this "connectivity". I don't talk on the phone when I drive. I can get a Garmin device for navigation rather than a $3000 package. A lot of this is in the "that might be nice category", but isn't something I'd willingly pay for just to say I had it.

 

[sleddriver]

The story is told of the power of Gold
and it's lure on the unsuspecting.
It glitters and shines, it badgers and binds
and constantly needs protecting
.......
are you under the power of Gold?
---- Dan Fogelberg

Her mind is Tiffany twisted
she got the Mercedes Benz
she got a lot of pretty boys
she calls friends...
........
Welcome to the Hotel California
You can check out any time you like
but you can never leave!
---- Eagles

Life in the Fast Lane really makes you lose your mind
---- Eagles

Sooner or later, there's going to be a big CRUNCH. It'll happen when the first wave of baby-boomers is in the grave, then those of my years are about 75. Diabetes is already at crisis levels as is sick care. There will be a massive amount of money no longer being earned as all of those older retire and begin drawing from retirement funds. There is going to be some MAJOR pension funding problems. Likewise they'll leave a lot of 'holes' in the job market and causing a large brain drain.

The younger ones coming in will have a tough time dealing with it and will be required to pay for it. Right now they're very lucky as they've largely taken advantage of "the way things are". In about 15-20yrs though, they'll realize those days are over. So will all of the newcomers. Suddenly they'll realize the party's over, the CRUNCH has begun and they'll be asked to pick up the check.

This big slouch has already begun. Just look at the student loan crisis and how it has affected many. It's not coming; it's already here. You can't discharge that debt. Will their degree allow them enough to float that + all of their other expenses? Depends. Once everyone has a degree, then what? They're no longer unique. Scientists, engineers, technical types will have much better odds due to their demand and high starting salaries. But they're a small minority when you compare their numbers in a public university of 50,000 or so.

How many people can afford an $85,000 truck? Is that sustainable? For how long? Sure contractors and businesses will need HD trucks, rigs, etc. They always have. They use them to solve problems and make money, not show off. Plus they get to write off the depreciation as a business expense. (And talk about depreciation with a 6 or 7 yr note + plus the interest expense just to "qualify" in the first place).

When all of the cutting back begins en masse, plenty will change. Plenty of you guys have already mentioned the ridiculous amount of digital "bling" in current autos. Packed to the hilt, fore & aft. Agreed.

I wonder how long they'll last when they begin breaking in multi-thousand dollar increments? In addition to big trucks, SUV's, Subs, I see lots and lots of itty-bitty-cars. The pint size models. The chihuahua-class. I wonder how long those will last when there owners have grown up staring into a screen since childhood?

"Is there an ap for that? How much?"
?????
Auto maintainence isn't an "AP".

See my point?

You have to be a certain age to understand "Who is John Galt?" and actually ask the question. The upcoming generations aren't, don't and won't. Instead they'll reply "What the $%^# happened?"

It's sort of like people who never bother with auto maintainence. In the beginning it's new, there's a warranty, they're covered, and they go to the dealer for service and get a rental free-of-charge.

But afterwards, if you never open the hood, nor check the tire pressure, (or ignore the flash-dash of ensuing idiot lights), you're going to get stuck somewhere, clueless, wondering "What the $%^# just happened?" All they'll know is to look for an "AP". Further, they won't even realize what AP stands for either.....as they'll have learned it from childhood as only "AP". The underlying knowledge will be completely lost on them.

There's a reason I still drive the sled. It's a known quantity. Repairable. Fixable. Still relevant to the owner. I'm definitely in the minority. That suites me just fine. It's not about chasing the latest and the greatest: That's a Fool's Game. And an expensive one at that.

"You can check out any time you like but you can never leave."

Think about it.......

 

[Wolf359]

Median household income was 59k in 2016. Maybe the half below that won't be able to afford new cars and maybe a percentage above that won't be able to, but there's about 250 million adults in the US and about 17 million were sold last year. While there's always lots of poor people out there, there's also lots of people who are making enough for it not to be an issue. It's that segment that are buying the cars.

 

[fdcg27]

People have been talking about how much more complicated and potentially costly to repair cars have gotten ever since spark plugs replaced hot tube ignition.
That cars have gotten progressively more durable and reliable over the intervening century and a quarter is often overlooked.
The first adopter hazard is there, but as what were once considered technically advanced or complex features become commonplace, this is usually because they've also become inexpensive as well as trouble-free.
For those who'd prefer something a little more rudimentary, there are tens of millions of such cars available from the many channels through which used cars are offered.