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SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter #4678744
02/26/18 02:46 PM
02/26/18 02:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline OP
paulri  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
Just changed the oil in my Sienna. Put in 5w20 for the first time (always used 5w30 before), but I doubt this is the oil. Both I and my wife (unprompted, although I did ask her if she noticed anything different at startup) have noticed that it takes a second or two longer to get the engine starting.

I just put on an M1 filter (yes, the correct size, 102). I'm wondering if this is an ADBV that is not functioning properly, or what? I am pretty sure this is not my imagination. I've changed the oil myself the past year or so on these cars, and I've never noticed anything like this. This is not a horrible grinding noise---just an extra second or two for the engine to start.

Assuming for the sake of argument that what I'm hearing is a real difference, what are the chances that this is a faulty ADBV? This is not even an additional 3-4 seconds, so perhaps that rules out the ADBV? I don't know how much time it would take oil to go through the filter, if the ADBV were not working right. There are absolutely no leaks, so the oil is there in the engine.

FWIW, I have replaced the starter last Feb (Feb 2017) after a new one failed after 4 months--so perhaps this is the starter slowly going out, again assuming that there is a delay in starting time. I'm not necessarily convinced that this is the filter, but if it is, I will put on a new one ASAP.

Last edited by paulri; 02/26/18 02:47 PM.

2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678750
02/26/18 02:49 PM
02/26/18 02:49 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,657
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,657
PNW
An engine should start-up the same regardless of the oil filter used. And a bad ADBV isn't going to cause the engine to crank longer before starting. An engine should even start up in the same time if there was no oil in the sump ... of course it might only result in one start-up.

Sounds more like a fuel supply issue going on ... maybe the fuel pump is going out or not priming the system well before starting. And yes, it could be the starter is again going out and turning over just slightly slower causing the engine to take a hair longer to fire up. IMO, the last thing to blame a slow engine start-up on would be the oil filter.

Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678755
02/26/18 02:52 PM
02/26/18 02:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline OP
paulri  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
Z06, I'm fine with that. Saves me the cost of a new filter! smile


2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678757
02/26/18 02:53 PM
02/26/18 02:53 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,839
South Florida
bubbatime Offline
bubbatime  Offline
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 5,839
South Florida
Only, and I mean only thing I can think of, is the thinner oil gives you less cylinder compression. Basically, if you had bad rings and/or worn cylinder, and low compression, a thicker oil could give you better compression.


17 Chrysler Pacifica Mobil 1 5W30
13 Yamaha XT250 Valv MC 10W40
12 Suzuki S40 Rotella 15W40
10 Acura TSX 2.4 PZL Plat 5W30
06 GMC Sierra Nextgen 10W30


Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678758
02/26/18 02:53 PM
02/26/18 02:53 PM
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,657
PNW
ZeeOSix Offline
ZeeOSix  Offline
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 18,657
PNW
Might even just be some bad gas, or the injectors are getting a bit dirty. Might throw in a bottle of fuel system cleaner and see how that goes.

Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: ZeeOSix] #4678790
02/26/18 03:25 PM
02/26/18 03:25 PM
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 170
Virginia
GravelRoad Offline
GravelRoad  Offline
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 170
Virginia
I do not see how that oil and filter would cause slower starting.
I'd look elsewhere.


2016 Subaru Outback Premium. PUP or PP 5w30 oem filter
2013 Hyundai Elantra loaded. lifetime free oil/filter change
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678811
02/26/18 03:45 PM
02/26/18 03:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,003
Cajun Country, La.
BlueOvalFitter Offline
BlueOvalFitter  Offline
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,003
Cajun Country, La.
Any time an engine starts to turn over slow, start with the basics; Battery, starter, alternator.
If you can't check it yourself, take it to one of the major parts stores. They will do a FREE electrical check for you.
My money is on a bad cell in the battery.

Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: BlueOvalFitter] #4678844
02/26/18 04:08 PM
02/26/18 04:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,713
Texas
Dallas69 Offline
Dallas69  Offline
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,713
Texas
I don't know what it is without being there but it is not oil or filter related.


2009 Galant-ultra oil and filter
1987 Ford F-150 302
Smittys 5-30
Motorcraft filter
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678866
02/26/18 04:29 PM
02/26/18 04:29 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline OP
paulri  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
I can't believe this. I think I've finally gotten everyone in a BITOG thread to agree on something. smile

Anyways, that's great. I'd rather not have to get a new filter, and then replace the old one with top off oil.


2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678886
02/26/18 04:42 PM
02/26/18 04:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,731
War Eagle
toneydoc Offline
toneydoc  Offline
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 1,731
War Eagle
That would have nothing to do with the oil filter


1994 Jeep 159k Mobil 5000 5w30
2014 Camry 34k Havoline 5w20
2018 Jeep Cherokee 2k FactFill
2014 HD Ultra 40k Mobil1 15w50
2012 Rav4 37k Pennzoil Platinum 5w20
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678892
02/26/18 04:48 PM
02/26/18 04:48 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,171
New England
gathermewool Offline
gathermewool  Offline
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 6,171
New England
Did you perform the oil change, as follows?

1. Change oil and filter cold

2. Start engine to circulate for a 5-10 seconds

3. Shut the engine off to check and add oil, as necessary

What I'm asking, is if the car had been run for only a short time while cold before attempting again? I've experienced hard-starts after starting vehicles up only to move them a few feet (< 20 seconds run time), so I always wait until the secondary air injection pump turns off (if I can hear it) or 30 or so seconds.

//

Also, how many times have you started the engine since you changed the oil? Might just be coincidence.

Your oil light is going out immediately upon starting, right?


'14 Forester XT (Cobb Stage 1)
Edge 0W-40 + FU filter
'15 Legacy 2.5i (OEM Stage -7)
Edge 0W-20 + FU filter
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678897
02/26/18 04:52 PM
02/26/18 04:52 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
paulri Offline OP
paulri  Offline OP
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 839
CA, USA
after the OC, the engine ran for a couple of minutes. It has been started 3-4 times since then. The oil pressure light went out after a solid 2 seconds, which is typical (from what I've seen) on my cars after an oil change. I have not looked at the oil pressure light since the first start on the ramps.


2005 Toyota Sienna LE; 156,000 miles
1998 Honda Civic DX; 202,000 miles
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: bubbatime] #4678919
02/26/18 05:22 PM
02/26/18 05:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC
Vladiator Offline
Vladiator  Offline
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 802
NC
Originally Posted By: bubbatime
Only, and I mean only thing I can think of, is the thinner oil gives you less cylinder compression. Basically, if you had bad rings and/or worn cylinder, and low compression, a thicker oil could give you better compression.

I am leaning towards less viscous oil theory too, as it happened to me before and OP description matches the symptoms perfectly. 5w20 just seems to lower the compression a bit vs 5w30 in a 150k mile engine. I would say that it is perfectly normal, considering age and miles. Though personally I would use 0w40 until the end of car's life or end of my ownership.


2000 Lexus GS300-361k
1999 Lexus GS400-213k
2006 Toyota Camry-187k
2006 Toyota Highlander Hybrid-125k
2009 Scion xB-120k
2013 VW Tiguan-120k
2009 Toyota Tacoma-60k
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678920
02/26/18 05:22 PM
02/26/18 05:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 519
Richmond, BC, Canada
mechjames Offline
mechjames  Offline
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 519
Richmond, BC, Canada
It may be waiting to see oil pressure build before it commands spark and fuel.


86 Mustang 5.0L 170km - Amsoil XL 5w30 / Baldwin B2-HPG
14 Ram 1500 5.7 - Amsoil XL 5w20 / Baldwin B7443
98 Jeep ZJ 5.9 - Amsoil OE 10w30 / Baldwin B34
Re: SLIGHTLY slower startup with new filter [Re: paulri] #4678959
02/26/18 06:03 PM
02/26/18 06:03 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
Virtus_Probi Offline
Virtus_Probi  Offline
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 4,225
New England
My daughter's Impreza was still fairly new when my wife took it to someplace like Midas for a cheapie oil change.
After the car sat at my daughter's school that afternoon, she said it was slow to start when she went to play softball...when I made it to the field, I checked the oil level and it was fine. I noticed then that they used a Brand X (almost unmarked) oil filter that was even smaller than the OEM one. The Impreza started fine after the game, but it was still pretty warm then.
When I got home later, I changed the filter out for one of my Tokyo Rokis and the car started fine the next morning and ever since. After asking around here, I inspected the Brand X filter and it didn't seem to have an ADBV.

I sure can't prove it, but it seems likely to me that the jobber filter resulted in a different feel to the start for my daughter. Could have just been some weird random occurrence or nothing at all, of course.


2014 Forester XT, 86000 miles
Last Change;
M1 5W30 d1G2
Tokyo Roki 15208AA170 filter
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