Doing a little reading on this oil & found the 10w30 has half the NOACK value of all the rest of the oils....how is it possible ? If using the same base stock (Pure Plus Technology) is the additive pack that different that it lowers the volitility of the oil that much ? Just trying to understand how the 10w30 has a value of 5.7 NOACK & the others range from 11-13 NOACK. Would the 10w30 be a viable option to replace running 5w30 in a state that rarely sees temps below 15-20 degrees in the winter ? Just thinking the lower NOACK would help with valve deposits in my direct injection engine, or is my thinking wrong.
Pennzoil Ultra Platinum
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Lower viscosity spread requires fewer/no VIIs. Fewer VIIs = more shear stability, hence lower Noack.
Originally Posted By: Fasttimez
Would the 10w30 be a viable option to replace running 5w30 in a state that rarely sees temps below 15-20 degrees in the winter ? Just thinking the lower NOACK would help with valve deposits in my direct injection engine, or is my thinking wrong.
You're likely right. Some argue that NOACK matters little, but everybody wants zero NOACK.
A strategy for colder sates is 10w-30 in the warmer 6 months, 0w-30 for the colder months.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Lower viscosity spread requires fewer/no VIIs. Fewer VIIs = more shear stability, hence lower Noack.
Thats a non sequitur. Shear stability is just what happens to VIIs to break them up. NOACK is a different set of physics that involves the polymer additives dispersed in the base oil, and the greater amount of VII in non-10w-30 oils does trigger greater boil-off with current technology.
Would the 10w30 be a viable option to replace running 5w30 in a state that rarely sees temps below 15-20 degrees in the winter ? Just thinking the lower NOACK would help with valve deposits in my direct injection engine, or is my thinking wrong.
You're likely right. Some argue that NOACK matters little, but everybody wants zero NOACK.
A strategy for colder sates is 10w-30 in the warmer 6 months, 0w-30 for the colder months.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Lower viscosity spread requires fewer/no VIIs. Fewer VIIs = more shear stability, hence lower Noack.
Thats a non sequitur. Shear stability is just what happens to VIIs to break them up. NOACK is a different set of physics that involves the polymer additives dispersed in the base oil, and the greater amount of VII in non-10w-30 oils does trigger greater boil-off with current technology.
I can't answer any of these question all I can say is I use that there 10w30 oil you speak of. It's great. It's the stuff dreams are made of. It added 100 unicorns to my dyno numbers.
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
Are you sure they use the same exact base stock composition?
I can't say for sure, but they are both 30 grade oils, both are Pennzoil Ultra Platinum that according to Pennzoil uses the Natural Gas Pure Plus Technology, so I can't see why the base stock would be any different between them. I'm just thinking add packs are different to get the 5w & 10w ratings.
Are you sure they use the same exact base stock composition?
I can't say for sure, but they are both 30 grade oils, both are Pennzoil Ultra Platinum that according to Pennzoil uses the Natural Gas Pure Plus Technology, so I can't see why the base stock would be any different between them. I'm just thinking add packs are different to get the 5w & 10w ratings.
Not only Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10W30 has lower NOACK than its 5W30 and other grades, other brands are the same. Of all types(dino/syn)/grades 10W30 seems to have lowest NOACK.
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Not only Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10W30 has lower NOACK than its 5W30 and other grades, other brands are the same. Of all types(dino/syn)/grades 10W30 seems to have lowest NOACK.
I've noticed that also, more investigation as to why this is would be great. I'm wondering if it's just the amount of research that's been put into 10w30 oils because that grade has been around for what seems forever vs other "boutique" grades such as your 0w & 5w grades. I'm sure plenty of research has been done on them also, but to have NOACK values reaching 13.5 for some is crazy. The old Pennzoil Ultra 5w30 had a NOACK of like 6.9 I believe, the NEW Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w30 is 11.5, it just doesn't make sense to me why that is.
Not only Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10W30 has lower NOACK than its 5W30 and other grades, other brands are the same. Of all types(dino/syn)/grades 10W30 seems to have lowest NOACK.
I've noticed that also, more investigation as to why this is would be great. I'm wondering if it's just the amount of research that's been put into 10w30 oils because that grade has been around for what seems forever vs other "boutique" grades such as your 0w & 5w grades. I'm sure plenty of research has been done on them also, but to have NOACK values reaching 13.5 for some is crazy. The old Pennzoil Ultra 5w30 had a NOACK of like 6.9 I believe, the NEW Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w30 is 11.5, it just doesn't make sense to me why that is.
If we are talking NOACK, Pennzoil Platinum PP in 5W20 has a great NOACK at 8.6....impressive for a 20weight!
http://www.pennzoil.com/wp-content/uploa...GF-5-en-TDS.pdf
http://www.pennzoil.com/wp-content/uploa...GF-5-en-TDS.pdf
Originally Posted By: Fasttimez
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Not only Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10W30 has lower NOACK than its 5W30 and other grades, other brands are the same. Of all types(dino/syn)/grades 10W30 seems to have lowest NOACK.
I've noticed that also, more investigation as to why this is would be great. I'm wondering if it's just the amount of research that's been put into 10w30 oils because that grade has been around for what seems forever vs other "boutique" grades such as your 0w & 5w grades. I'm sure plenty of research has been done on them also, but to have NOACK values reaching 13.5 for some is crazy. The old Pennzoil Ultra 5w30 had a NOACK of like 6.9 I believe, the NEW Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w30 is 11.5, it just doesn't make sense to me why that is.
I think 10W-30s with a very low Noack are simply a result of blending a 10W-30 with the basestocks they have available for the lowest cost. They aren't going to put special effort or money into a legacy grade. As long as it makes the certification they're seeking Noack is likely an afterthought anyway.
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Not only Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 10W30 has lower NOACK than its 5W30 and other grades, other brands are the same. Of all types(dino/syn)/grades 10W30 seems to have lowest NOACK.
I've noticed that also, more investigation as to why this is would be great. I'm wondering if it's just the amount of research that's been put into 10w30 oils because that grade has been around for what seems forever vs other "boutique" grades such as your 0w & 5w grades. I'm sure plenty of research has been done on them also, but to have NOACK values reaching 13.5 for some is crazy. The old Pennzoil Ultra 5w30 had a NOACK of like 6.9 I believe, the NEW Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 5w30 is 11.5, it just doesn't make sense to me why that is.
I think 10W-30s with a very low Noack are simply a result of blending a 10W-30 with the basestocks they have available for the lowest cost. They aren't going to put special effort or money into a legacy grade. As long as it makes the certification they're seeking Noack is likely an afterthought anyway.
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Originally Posted By: lubricatosaurus
A strategy for colder sates is 10w-30 in the warmer 6 months, 0w-30 for the colder months.
I thought seasonal switches were precluded by the proliferation of multigrades. If you really want a low Noack shear stable oil and insist on changing viscosity seasonally, just stick with SAE 30 for the summer. Personally, if I can't rely on an oil year round, I have little interest in purchasing it.
Hatt: I say you're right on the money. No one in any of the majors is expending a huge amount of man hours or ingredients or money to make a wonderful 10w-30 that no one in North America specifies anyhow. They're all looking at making an SN/GF-5 lube, without even ACEA specifications, much less builder approvals, so who really cares? Up here, it's very, very difficult to even buy a 10w-30 synthetic at Canadian Tire.
A strategy for colder sates is 10w-30 in the warmer 6 months, 0w-30 for the colder months.
I thought seasonal switches were precluded by the proliferation of multigrades. If you really want a low Noack shear stable oil and insist on changing viscosity seasonally, just stick with SAE 30 for the summer. Personally, if I can't rely on an oil year round, I have little interest in purchasing it.
Hatt: I say you're right on the money. No one in any of the majors is expending a huge amount of man hours or ingredients or money to make a wonderful 10w-30 that no one in North America specifies anyhow. They're all looking at making an SN/GF-5 lube, without even ACEA specifications, much less builder approvals, so who really cares? Up here, it's very, very difficult to even buy a 10w-30 synthetic at Canadian Tire.
Originally Posted By: Fasttimez
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
Are you sure they use the same exact base stock composition?
I can't say for sure, but they are both 30 grade oils, both are Pennzoil Ultra Platinum that according to Pennzoil uses the Natural Gas Pure Plus Technology, so I can't see why the base stock would be any different between them. I'm just thinking add packs are different to get the 5w & 10w ratings.
I doubt that, as adding VI polymer adds viscosity to the oil at any temperature. So to create a 0w-30 you have to start with a thinner base oil mix than to create a 5w-30 or 10w-30
Originally Posted By: Nate1979
Are you sure they use the same exact base stock composition?
I can't say for sure, but they are both 30 grade oils, both are Pennzoil Ultra Platinum that according to Pennzoil uses the Natural Gas Pure Plus Technology, so I can't see why the base stock would be any different between them. I'm just thinking add packs are different to get the 5w & 10w ratings.
I doubt that, as adding VI polymer adds viscosity to the oil at any temperature. So to create a 0w-30 you have to start with a thinner base oil mix than to create a 5w-30 or 10w-30
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