A modern computer controlled vehicle can't be harmed by throttle inputs from the driver.
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How bad is WOT for your car?
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You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
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Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
A modern computer controlled vehicle can't be harmed by throttle inputs from the driver.
Basically correct even if over simplified. A correctly built engine with a modern suite of features which includes "soft" rev limiting and other modern protection features will be VERY hard to kill if it is oiled up properly and has a good cooling system capacity.
Our guys worked a service van the other day with the upper rad hose blown completely off the radiator! No damage at all, and no idea how long it continued to run in 'limp mode'. But we could not put water in it 25 minutes after we shut it down!
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
A modern computer controlled vehicle can't be harmed by throttle inputs from the driver.
Basically correct even if over simplified. A correctly built engine with a modern suite of features which includes "soft" rev limiting and other modern protection features will be VERY hard to kill if it is oiled up properly and has a good cooling system capacity.
Our guys worked a service van the other day with the upper rad hose blown completely off the radiator! No damage at all, and no idea how long it continued to run in 'limp mode'. But we could not put water in it 25 minutes after we shut it down!
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
A modern computer controlled vehicle can't be harmed by throttle inputs from the driver.
When it comes to automotive, I don't believe in absolutes.
You guys know the kind of off road driving I do with my clubs. Bouncing off the rev limiter all day in the snow can most certainly blow your engine if you're not careful.
Fried rings and spun bearings are the most common calamity in winter.
We are not gentle and despite factory controls/limits, stuff will grenade when pushed.
A modern computer controlled vehicle can't be harmed by throttle inputs from the driver.
When it comes to automotive, I don't believe in absolutes.
You guys know the kind of off road driving I do with my clubs. Bouncing off the rev limiter all day in the snow can most certainly blow your engine if you're not careful.
Fried rings and spun bearings are the most common calamity in winter.
We are not gentle and despite factory controls/limits, stuff will grenade when pushed.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
I'll disagree with the comment that you can't go wide open throttle for that long on the street. There are secluded spots out there where you can do it, you just have to be willing to do it at a low speed with lots of cornering.
I'm only making the comment that increased exposure to high heat isn't necessarily good for the car, because the parts on a car that fail aren't limited to the ones that are inside the engine being washed by oil.
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
I'll disagree with the comment that you can't go wide open throttle for that long on the street. There are secluded spots out there where you can do it, you just have to be willing to do it at a low speed with lots of cornering.
I'm only making the comment that increased exposure to high heat isn't necessarily good for the car, because the parts on a car that fail aren't limited to the ones that are inside the engine being washed by oil.
Thanks for that post Darwin! Very interesting. This is another reason i love BITOG. Lots of knowledge here.
I just thought of something. How many cars are going WOT for hours while driving on the Autobahn?
WOT may not be so bad, because look at how many people had 1970s-1980s diesel cars, and used WOT very often because of the low horsepower? Benz and VW made such engines and they did last. Obviously I can't include GM engines here....
Also, many of the old compact cars with gasoline engines frequently needed WOT. My father told me about what it was like to drive a 1971 Toyota Corolla.
WOT may not be so bad, because look at how many people had 1970s-1980s diesel cars, and used WOT very often because of the low horsepower? Benz and VW made such engines and they did last. Obviously I can't include GM engines here....
Also, many of the old compact cars with gasoline engines frequently needed WOT. My father told me about what it was like to drive a 1971 Toyota Corolla.
WOT? Think the last time I did that was in the 70's.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
I can only tell you that the mfgrs do much worse as standard testing. They start engines at below zero and run them immediately to peak power, and of course they repeat it a bunch of times. With a good thermostat and if the engine is mechanically sound the extra throttle will simply warm the coolant super fast. Remember the temp in the head is rarely what you see on the gauge, especially when the engine is 'cold'.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
I can only tell you that the mfgrs do much worse as standard testing. They start engines at below zero and run them immediately to peak power, and of course they repeat it a bunch of times. With a good thermostat and if the engine is mechanically sound the extra throttle will simply warm the coolant super fast. Remember the temp in the head is rarely what you see on the gauge, especially when the engine is 'cold'.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
Absolutely, 100%. Really stop to think about it, on public roads even in a "slow" car 15 seconds at WOT is going to put you at or above any legal speed limit in this country. Fact is, engines just aren't run WOT for very long at a clip. Even if you find a nice stretch of empty highway and decide to open it up, so you top it off after a min or two and then what? Run into the next county/state at that speed? No. Same for the autobahn example above, assuming you could even do that, run for a couple hours at WOT and you're out of Germany.
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
FYI on off road applications like boats or in equipment WOT is measured as a percentage for each hour of operation. Like say 10 or 20 minutes of WOT operation per hour.
You can't do that on a street car let alone a track car. WOT for 10-30 seconds is enough to get into illegal speeds and won't even get any heat into a performance car like a Porsche or Ferrari, or a Cummins.
I'll take something like say the Yanmar's in the cruising sailboat and run them for 2-3 days straight at 3.5k RPM, and they won't complain.
Car engines are simply not pushed.
Absolutely, 100%. Really stop to think about it, on public roads even in a "slow" car 15 seconds at WOT is going to put you at or above any legal speed limit in this country. Fact is, engines just aren't run WOT for very long at a clip. Even if you find a nice stretch of empty highway and decide to open it up, so you top it off after a min or two and then what? Run into the next county/state at that speed? No. Same for the autobahn example above, assuming you could even do that, run for a couple hours at WOT and you're out of Germany.
It was well understood in '80s Deutschland that German cars were designed to tolerate continuous use at top speed. Tire size and speed rating was printed on your reg and had to match what's on the car ... unless you had snow tires on and then you were required to stay under 100kph and have a sticker on the back to indicate that.
Once I drove my own car for around 25 minutes at WOT for fun and all it did was use up a lot of expensive fuel and resolve my slight oil burning problem.
I've also seen quite a few engine tests since I worked in that industry, and yes they are brutal. Even engines on the production line got only a few seconds of running before a WOT power test.
Once I drove my own car for around 25 minutes at WOT for fun and all it did was use up a lot of expensive fuel and resolve my slight oil burning problem.
I've also seen quite a few engine tests since I worked in that industry, and yes they are brutal. Even engines on the production line got only a few seconds of running before a WOT power test.
Brief but factual...
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertrain-development-teams-ensure-durability-by-beating-the-[censored]-out-of-engines
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertrain-development-teams-ensure-durability-by-beating-the-[censored]-out-of-engines
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
Tell that to my car lot buddy who has a '08 CVPI with a locked up 4.6... Cops actually destroy the engines fairly often...
If you make enough of something you will get failures, and a lot of times those failures can be attributed to the end user. IE improper maintenance.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
You can't run a motor at WOT for long enough on the street.
Tell that to my car lot buddy who has a '08 CVPI with a locked up 4.6... Cops actually destroy the engines fairly often...
If you make enough of something you will get failures, and a lot of times those failures can be attributed to the end user. IE improper maintenance.
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Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Brief but factual...
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertr...-out-of-engines
The guys who run turbo charged equipment shut it down all the time without letting the turbo's cool. Turbo failures are fairly rare even with 10k+ hours.
Break them in hard!
Brief but factual...
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertr...-out-of-engines
The guys who run turbo charged equipment shut it down all the time without letting the turbo's cool. Turbo failures are fairly rare even with 10k+ hours.
Break them in hard!
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Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
Nah that's just a little toy motor with a few quarts of oil in it, and that's not 100% load at least not more more than a few seconds.
Lets see how this works with a big motor, full load in 10 seconds.
To test on your car, aim to at the on ramp, start it and floor it.
How do you guys think stop/start works and hybrids work? The motors kick on and off and go on load constantly.
You guys baby these things to much, they don't need to be treated like they are made from glass.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Many modern engines can protect themselves pretty well.
Does that include the guy who lives two minutes from the highway acceleration ramp and mashes the gas pedal to get on every morning in cold temps? That seems to be a question that used to come up from time to time in the past. Thanks!
Nah that's just a little toy motor with a few quarts of oil in it, and that's not 100% load at least not more more than a few seconds.
Lets see how this works with a big motor, full load in 10 seconds.
To test on your car, aim to at the on ramp, start it and floor it.
How do you guys think stop/start works and hybrids work? The motors kick on and off and go on load constantly.
You guys baby these things to much, they don't need to be treated like they are made from glass.
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Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Brief but factual...
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertrain-development-teams-ensure-durability-by-beating-the-[censored]-out-of-engines
Thanks. ...I always love reading the comments as well.
Brief but factual...
http://blog.caranddriver.com/how-powertrain-development-teams-ensure-durability-by-beating-the-[censored]-out-of-engines
Thanks. ...I always love reading the comments as well.
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