Why Did Mobil 1 Fail?

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I admit I do not like the second sentence. (long combined sentence)

Is it meaning ...
Allow an ExxonMobil representative to .... determine the extent of the damage and to confirm that the lubricant was the cause

or

provide proof of ..... that the lubricant was the cause.

Depending how you read can define as long as i let them look into it or I need show proof first before they look into it.
 
Originally Posted By: 4WD
So now there is a bad batch? … who else got some of that bacon grease ?

We are unlikely to ever hear about it. When you have nothing to add to the conversation except a snarky comment, move on. Nobody cares. You act like a child.
 
You are nothing dude … you are the only one foolish enough to support this guy who hijacked a thread about AP …
 
My argument in this thread is not about fault of my case. But what I am saying is that they sell this extra mileage oil. They say this will last,they warranty it. But in reality claiming warranty is near impossible because they put condition beyond reason to file claim. So all I am saying here is take their warranty with a grain of salt. It added to the failed of long lasting oils.. as related to this thread.
 
^Ok so like most oil companies their warranty sucks, I understand that, and now read it.^ Why would they change the terms and conditions for you? They aren't making it especially hard for you, you see their terms. Now that that hurdle is out of the way, why would they even consider warrantying something that you proved and posted wasn't their product, or even oil for that matter in your engine? The way I see it the burden of proof here is on you, on your dime, not theirs. Prove they bottled and sold 1 jug of something that wasn't oil that came off their line, and ruined your engine. The ball is clearly in your court now. I still maintain if a bad batch came off the line, there would be at least one other person having the same problem with their lousy warranty complaining here by now. There isn't, at the moment this still appears to be a one off. Your problem is still with WMT.

FTR I'm always for the little guy, but not at the expense of wrongly accusing a business or person for doing something wrong that they clearly didn't do.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
^Ok so like most oil companies their warranty sucks, I understand that,


With an OCI of 3-10K miles, and an engine life of 200k miles, there's 20-70 oil changes to get there, and mostly whatever quickylube throws in.

That's why some of the conditional warranties are install our oil, then provide proof that it's been replaced every x miles forever"...that to me is entirely fair.

When an oil "fails" an engine in a single oil change of mixed prior providence, then it's also fair to ask for the burden of proof, rather than last person holding the ball.
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
^Ok so like most oil companies their warranty sucks, I understand that,


With an OCI of 3-10K miles, and an engine life of 200k miles, there's 20-70 oil changes to get there, and mostly whatever quickylube throws in.

That's why some of the conditional warranties are install our oil, then provide proof that it's been replaced every x miles forever"...that to me is entirely fair.

When an oil "fails" an engine in a single oil change of mixed prior providence, then it's also fair to ask for the burden of proof, rather than last person holding the ball.


Absolutely … companies have to protect themselves from somebody low enough to swap products in a container returned to Walmart … known for very liberal exchange policy …
 
Yep, these oil warranties, or even oil filter warranties, depend on the customer jumping through a lot of expensive hoops with little hope of "proving" anything to a biased arbitrator (oil maker is biased obviously). So its like a trial where the judge is biased and its all rigged against you. Kangaroo court.

I just think Walmart has all the liability here if you assume something got swapped into the jug.
If you assume Mobil put non-real-oil in there in the first place, of course thats their fault.
Proving anything? I guess not.
 
Originally Posted By: Jooksing
Ignore my event. Let say you have legit warranty claim, you put in oil and they had a bad batch.. they give you (and hundreds others) a run around before they actually look into it. That's what all I am saying, the warranty portion is a run around.

Oil companies have paid for damages due to formulation errors. Of course, the investigation and the chain of events is required to demonstrate this. Any oil company is entitled, if someone claims damages, to make sure, first off, that their product was used, that their product was used as directed, and that their product was responsible for the damage. Wanting purchase receipts and service history, in addition to actually determine what was in the sump, isn't onerous. It's pretty basic and understandable.

Oil companies do have a responsibility to customers if their products cause damage when used as directed. Oil companies also have a responsibility to their directors and shareholders not to write cheques to everyone on the planet who has an engine failure, based just upon a customer's say-so.

JAG: Mobil 1's warranty, that you linked, only applies when Mobil products are in use. That wasn't the case here. You might as well grab Pennzoil's warranty document, or Valvoline's, or Quaker State's, because they are all equally relevant here, in that not one of these products was used.
 
We had over two dozen pages on this before … and we don’t have the basis to judge any warranty …
The conclusion was probably in the 90%+ group …
When someone refuses to listen to that many experienced members … that blows the whole idea of this website …

BTW…There have been other members wind up with used oil in jugs they bought as “new” …
 
Garak, none of us can prove that any one of the many plausible scenarios is what actually occurred. If you don’t believe it, go ahead and prove it. I’m not talking about making a convincing case. I’m talking about proving it. It’s not possible. So this is not a case where anyone can say “I’m right and you are wrong.”. Likely, nobody will ever, including XOM or Walmart, absolutely discover what happened.

Let me state a scenario that I think matches part of what happened to jooksing, but I will state it such that it happened to you. At the end is a question. There is no wrong answer. I’m just curious what your answer will be. I’m not picking on you. I respect your contributions to this site and anyone else can answer too.

You buy 5 qt. jug of Mobil 1 EP at Walmart and nothing about the bottle seems off. It’s oil change time. You twist the cap and the base of the cap separates like it is supposed to. You peel off the seal which is attached around the entire circumference and it has no holes in it. You pour the oil into your engine, and the color and consistency match what you expect. Then after so many thousands of miles of using the oil, the sequence of observations that jooksing made occur for you. The UOA you get is the same as the UOA jooksing got. No coolant in the oil. You have no reason to suspect that anyone messed with your car while the oil was in the engine.
The question: who or what company do you go after? What do you think most likely happened?
 
Absolutely. What I am saying is that the indications was that this product wasn't Mobil 1. So, unless it can be shown this was a bad batch (VOAs of the same lot number), it's hard to pin this on Mobil.

Once that position is established, one has an idea where the blame lies. If analysis of other jugs from the same batch number show the same thing, we have something useful. Either it's a bad batch from XOM or we have counterfeit product.

If the analysis shows the same batch number in different jugs has a different product in it, as in legitimate M1, then we are stuck with the oil that was used as being a counterfeit or tampered with by someone else.

I don't know what happened, that's the thing. I'm taking jooksing completely on his word and giving him the benefit of the doubt. None of that, however, does much to assign blame without getting more information. I like to use oil from the same batch number (thanks to my OCD), and I haven't got oil in several years that didn't come from a sealed box directly from the oil company. Obviously, we can't tell whether this is tampering, an XOM problem, or counterfeit, but whatever it is, it's exceedingly rare, which is of cold comfort to him.
 
Me? Well, of course, if it went to court, we know that all bets are off and everyone might try to get themselves excluded from a suit and/or add everyone else in sight to it. Aside from that, if I found that another identical jug (same product, same batch number) had this sketchy product in it (i.e. by a VOA), then I'd proceed to contact the oil company and seek information or redress from them. It's possible they could verify it as a counterfeit product (for example, by an imaginary lot number, label errors, or other product markings), or it could be confirmed as their own. If it were counterfeit, I'd be after the retailer, who I'm sure would be interested in what was going on and what they were getting and from whom.

Now, if it weren't a counterfeit product, in that the VOAs didn't match (one seemed like ordinary motor oil and the other in an identical jug was the mess we've come across), I'd gather that someone took great pains to buy Mobil 1, return something in its place for a refund, and foist an inappropriate product on an unsuspecting consumer. I'd be after the retailer again. Now, if someone did the oil change for me, that adds a little more complexity, and more suspects.

I'm not trying to give any oil company a free pass here, but it just seems to me, and we've had formulators discuss the procedures followed when filling and shipping product before, that the odds of XOM filling an M1 jug with something that is decidedly not motor oil are pretty slim, and when it does happen, it's a much wider problem with an entire batch. If XOM were filling M1 bottles with a product that were blowing engines, we, of all people, would be hearing about it, even before XOM customer service. That's not to say that cannot happen, or even didn't happen here. The first place I'd be looking, however, is that someone did some pretty fancy tampering (it's happened before) or that a counterfeit product hit the shelf.

As I mentioned, though, this is all cold comfort to the victim in this situation, since he's the one stuck trying to track down what went wrong, not to mention dealing with the inconvenience and the cost. Additionally, all this inconvenience and cost still exist for him, regardless of whom is at fault. If XOM goofed, it would be nice of them to correct the situation on an individual basis, and to ensure that there isn't some procedural problem. If a retailer goofed, aside from making things right, some of these return procedures should be reviewed.

On a wider point, I'm generally not a fan of the notion of returning products unless said product is defective or the retailer/shipper provided you with the wrong product. If you don't know what you're buying (as in oil grade or filter part number), stay out of the store until you know what you're buying. So many places just take things back without questions, simply to avoid fights and arguments, and people take advantage of that, and the next purchaser winds up suffering. Other posters here have seen used oil on the shelf. Here, I know people from electronics stores that have people buy a big screen TV on the Friday before Super Bowl, and then return the stupid thing on Monday. Gee, that's not suspicious at all.
wink.gif
 
Question not asked of me, but I think chain of custody is the order in which litigation would/should progress.
 
I still maintain the OP was a victim of someone buying oil from WMT, using it and replacing the contents with some cheap cooking oil. Odds are the person even bought the cooking oil from WMT. I bet the oil was returned with an invoice too, which negates the person returning the product from showing ID. If someone were to take the time and work carefully the odds are pretty good they'd pull it off too, especially seeing how busy WMT returns can be, and their help isn't always on top of their game. A no return policy for oil and filters might be in order.

I hope the OP gets his car back to the condition it was before this nightmare! But I fear it will be a very long and hard battle.
 
Originally Posted By: Panzerman
People with warranties can't use it. Motorheads can't wait a entire year and people with junkers won't pay that.
The synthetic oil market is flooded.

Yet people still fall head over heels for AMSOIL!
whistle.gif
 
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