What causes a running vehicle to shut down in extremely cold weather?

[captainbeandip]

Back in high school on a -40 deg morning my friend's Mom gave us a ride to school in their 390 engined Ford pickup. The coolant had froze and the engine overheated so badly that it started knocking and then quit. We had to walk the remaining couple of blocks to school, while she knocked on someone's door to phone for help (this was a long time ago).
I was surprised in that bitter cold that an engine could overheat so badly. I found out later that it had to be rebuilt.

Holy crap, that's hardcore! Was that in Canada?

Even long ago I would imagine that most schools would close and give kids a "snow day" if it were that cold. Having kids walking to school and/or standing at a bus stop can easily turn into a dangerous situation at those temperatures.

I just looked up the rules for the school that my kids go to (in Minnesota), and their policy is to call off school if the temperature and/or windchill is forecasted to be -35°F, which is a bit surprising to me since I know they have called it off at warmer temperatures than that.

 

[dogememe]

When I was driving through Montana a few years ago in a GMC Canyon 2.8 diesel it died while I was driving on the highway. Temps were -20something. We pressed the OnStar button and sat in the back of a cop car to stay warm til the tow truck came several hours later. They towed us to the GM dealer and we got a hotel.

We suspect the diesel gelled up inside the fuel filter, as the next day, in the GM dealer's parking lot (they wanted a week to look at it and told us try whatever you want as long as you don't make a huge mess), we replaced the fuel filter, poured some diesel-anti-cold-stuff in there, and with a lot of cranking, got the truck going again. Drove it right back home to California and my buddy whose truck it was made GM buy it back and got a Bolt instead.

My point is, even an almost-new, under-warranty vehicle can leave you stranded in extreme conditions. New cars and old cars alike can break down, and are more likely to do so when it's really cold or really hot.

 

[carviewsonic]

Holy crap, that's hardcore! Was that in Canada?

Even long ago I would imagine that most schools would close and give kids a "snow day" if it were that cold. Having kids walking to school and/or standing at a bus stop can easily turn into a dangerous situation at those temperatures.

I just looked up the rules for the school that my kids go to (in Minnesota), and their policy is to call off school if the temperature and/or windchill is forecasted to be -35°F, which is a bit surprising to me since I know they have called it off at warmer temperatures than that.

That was in Saskatchewan in the late 70's. I couldn't tell you what the rule was for cold weather, or if there even was a specific rule. I can remember listening to the radio in the morning on cold windy days to see if school was cancelled, which never seemed to happen. There was probably no or very little wind that morning. I'm sure that a blizzard would have kept us home.
Yes, my kids had snow days for bad weather and sometimes the buses would not run due to bad roads.

 

[Snagglefoot]

That was in Saskatchewan in the late 70's. I couldn't tell you what the rule was for cold weather, or if there even was a rule. Possibly just left up to the parents to decide. There was probably no or very little wind that morning. I'm sure that a blizzard would have kept us home.
Yes, my kids had snow days for bad weather and sometimes the buses would not run due to bad roads.

Yep, they never cancelled school because of cold in Saskatchewan. I was able to look up the record on the Time and Date website and the coldest day in my home town was -42 F. Canada was not metric yet. I actually recall walking to school that day, uphill both ways.

 

[JWC86]

In my experience working in Northern Alberta with light trucks and equipment it’s usually the hydraulic systems that I see fail when we get into these -40 temps that we see now.

I think it’s because you can’t really “warm them up” in most case like you can a engine in some cases and people don’t go easy enough in them while starting there trip and “ease” into things, somethings just cant be “eased into” anyways.

Power steering- mostly blowing hoses
Brakes - again, hoses blowing
Transmission cooler - lines blowing
Suspensions components - that were barely hanging in and the stress of the extreme cold finishing them off
Etc

 

[BillyHW]

Environment Canada is now predicting -50 C = -58 F for Saturday night. That would break the all-time record cold of -49.4 C from 1886 here.

Wishing I had installed a battery blanket last summer when I had a chance. I've got the trickle charger hooked up but still kind of worried about the battery freezing.

 

[vpr5703]

Environment Canada is now predicting -50 C = -58 F for Saturday night. That would break the all-time record cold of -49.4 C from 1886 here.

Wishing I had installed a battery blanket last summer when I had a chance. I've got the trickle charger hooked up but still kind of worried about the battery freezing.

Maybe disconnect the battery and take it inside to keep warm overnight? This will have the added benefit of giving the battery more chemical energy to turn the car over when you reinstall it as it will be much warmer than ambient.

 

[BillyHW]

Maybe disconnect the battery and take it inside to keep warm overnight? This will have the added benefit of giving the battery more chemical energy to turn the car over when you reinstall it as it will be much warmer than ambient.

Let me introduce you to Lee Iacocca's cab forward design. Only 137 easy steps to change the battery!

 

[BillyHW]

This is a new personal record.

 

[Astro14]

Holy crap, that's hardcore! Was that in Canada?

Even long ago I would imagine that most schools would close and give kids a "snow day" if it were that cold. Having kids walking to school and/or standing at a bus stop can easily turn into a dangerous situation at those temperatures.

I just looked up the rules for the school that my kids go to (in Minnesota), and their policy is to call off school if the temperature and/or windchill is forecasted to be -35°F, which is a bit surprising to me since I know they have called it off at warmer temperatures than that.

Nope. Not when I was a kid in Winnipeg.

-40? (C=F at -40, so it doesn’t matter)

School was open and I walked to school.

That was the temp, not the windchill. Windchill was off the chart low with an actual temp of -40.

Maybe schools have become more thoughtful since then, or maybe it depends on the average winter weather, but in 1969?

School was open and I walked.

 

[vpr5703]

Let me introduce you to Lee Iacocca's cab forward design. Only 137 easy steps to change the battery!

Oh God one of these. Yea my MIL has an Avenger. Battery is in the same location. Nevermind!

 

[BillyHW]

It just won't stop.

 

[BillyHW]

In freedom units:

 

[vpr5703]

Good god. Nope. I'd be calling into work at that point. But if my area got that cold we'd be in nuclear winter or something.

 

[JWC86]

Something to consider is the freezing point of the OEM coolant ratio which is typical 50/50 as delivered when new. For this reason I mix mine 60/40 and then test with a refractometer to ensure.

My truck is in the shop currently getting a new heater core(great timing) so I have borrowed a truck. It’s a GM 6.0L with 200k on it. It’s about to get sent to action. I just went out to start it and it looks like the block heater cord is bad or the block heater itself. I measured with a heat gun and no diff in temp anywhere, was a constant -43C all over then engine.

If the people I borrowed it from cared about it I wouldn’t have but since I know they would do the same thing I tried to start it. It wasn’t happy but it did start right up. Been running for a hour now and starting to get warmish in the cabin.

 

[BillyHW]

Something to consider is the freezing point of the OEM coolant ratio which is typical 50/50 as delivered when new. For this reason I mix mine 60/40 and then test with a refractometer to ensure.

My truck is in the shop currently getting a new heater core(great timing) so I have borrowed a truck. It’s a GM 6.0L with 200k on it. It’s about to get sent to action. I just went out to start it and it looks like the block heater cord is bad or the block heater itself. I measured with a heat gun and no diff in temp anywhere, was a constant -43C all over then engine.

If the people I borrowed it from cared about it I wouldn’t have but since I know they would do the same thing I tried to start it. It wasn’t happy but it did start right up. Been running for a hour now and starting to get warmish in the cabin.

I should have asked the dealer to put 60/40 when I had the coolant flushed a few months ago, pretty sure they just did 50/50. I wasn't thinking. Maybe in the summer time I can take some out of the reservoir and fill it back with pure coolant to get the ratio up to 60/40.

I have the block heater hooked up though.

I also have a block heater tester. It tells you if the outlet is giving power, and it also tells you if the block heater is using power. Very handy.

It is quite common for block heater cords to fail because people leave the hanging out and then they fray. Happened to me before I knew better and I had to repair the plug myself.

Here is the block heater tester:

MS002 Plug Alive Block Heater/Outlet Tester

Easily test block heaters for proper function Keep it in your vehicle to quickly test electrical cords/outlets for power Helps to ensure your battery is charging and ready to go when you are

www.partsource.ca

Green light means outlet has power. Red light means block heater is actually drawing power.

 

[BillyHW]

I should go outside and have a look if the coolant in the reservoir is still liquid or what.

 

[JWC86]

Looks handy. I have a “killawatt” device that would tell me if it’s working also.

I just replaced a block heater cord yesterday for a friend.

 

[JWC86]

I should go outside and have a look if the coolant in the reservoir is still liquid or what.

I’d be willing to bet it is. I should have mentioned that some types of coolants are better than others as far as freezing point goes. The other thing to consider is that is he temps where ice crystals will start to form. Not the temps where it turns into a thick un-pumpable slush.

I think most of the issues you see with coolant freezing is when people top up with water or something like that.

 

[BillyHW]

I’d be willing to bet it is. I should have mentioned that some types of coolants are better than others as far as freezing point goes. The other thing to consider is that is he temps where ice crystals will start to form. Not the temps where it turns into a thick un-pumpable slush.

I think most of the issues you see with coolant freezing and when people top up with water or something like that.

They used Mopar 5-year coolant. HOAT I think.

Do you folks think my block heater is enough to keep things from freezing? I think it's 400 Watts maybe.