Toyota trucks...for work or for parades?

[Black Bart]

Originally Posted By: njcruiser
Originally Posted By: Jaybird
njcruiser,
Does your manual not advise to not run with the tailgate down?


I see the following. I will put it in bold so you know that is from the manual.. First, inside a square box:
NOTICE
Avoid driving with the tailgate open.

Then, in normal text later when talking about installing the tailgate.
We recommend you keep the tailgate closed when not in use.

That is all I can find so now you can beat me up with that info if you like!

I have owned toyota trucks for years. I purchased my first one at 16 yrs old brand new, and have not stopped yet at 33 yrs old. They all have done what I need them to do, never less. This one is no different. It does what I need which is:
1. Reliable now, good resale years later with tons of miles.
2. Picks up supplies for home projects from lowes, home depot, etc.
3. Moves me and the family around comfortably. It is bigger inside than our 08 4runner.
4. Hauls me, family, and friends to the hare scramble races easily with the bikes, usually 2, sometimes 3, and gear in the bed. Tailgate is open, ha.!
5. On the rare occasion I need to tow, I can do up to 10K easily and safely. This is not often.
6. Keeps us safe(well...........)Has all the saftey airbags standard, everywhere front and rear.
7. Gets decent mpg with incredible power. The engine and 6 speed transmission is pretty nice.

If anyone is looking for a 1/2 ton truck, then they would be foolish to not look at the tundra. Once again when it was time to buy in 07, I looked at all the options just as I always do. As usual, toyota won.
FOr those who say toyota can not build a heavy duty truck, they have no idea what they are talking about. Toyota has the land cruiser, which is one of the most over built and over engineered trucks ever produced. The tundra is pretty [censored] beefy for a 1/2 ton as well. I think some issues start when it is compared to a 3/4 or 1 ton truck. Not a fair comparison.
Yea, I am pro toyota, but that is based on my experience. I do not care what anyone purchases, and by no means am I pushing anyone towards a toyota.
I forgot, I left out something else I enjoy. THe look on the owners face of a "big 3" truck when they want to race me, and then they lose. It is priceless when I see that at the next light. No one ever wants to go twice, but they always want to go the first time. I guess they still live under a rock and think toyota does not have a serious engine yet?? My wife was VERY surprised how fast the [censored] thing is, it can be fun.
Now I want to go drive my truck.
Just turned 15K, no issues, 10 months old. Not that I would expect any in the low amount of miles though, just reporting.
Oil relation: I use 5w20 Penzoil platinum.
As my son calls it, and not because I drive fast in it, it is based on the little einsteins, I present silver rocket:
http://www.tundrasolutions.com/photopost/showphoto.php/photo/41658/ppuser/27915/sl/t
This is a typical Toyota buyer bought his first vehicle at 16 and by his own admission never has bought anything else.
That makes him very qualified to pass judgment on all other brands as he said based on his experience.

 

[ekpolk]

Originally Posted By: Black Bart
. . .This is a typical Toyota buyer bought his first vehicle at 16 and by his own admission never has bought anything else.
That makes him very qualified to pass judgment on all other brands as he said based on his experience.


Oh come now, it's not as if the legions of Big-3 buyers who all laugh at the Tundra all have balanced experience, including the ownership of several Toyotas. Actually, I like the point about the Land Cruiser -- hadn't really thought of that before, but yeah he's right. They're pricey, but they've been holding up like tanks for about 40 years. And if you really want to talk about people who are willing to express strong opinions about vehicles they've never driven before, perhaps we should move on to the hybrids...

 

[Black Bart]

Originally Posted By: ekpolk
Originally Posted By: Black Bart
. . .This is a typical Toyota buyer bought his first vehicle at 16 and by his own admission never has bought anything else.
That makes him very qualified to pass judgment on all other brands as he said based on his experience.


Oh come now, it's not as if the legions of Big-3 buyers who all laugh at the Tundra all have balanced experience, including the ownership of several Toyotas. Actually, I like the point about the Land Cruiser -- hadn't really thought of that before, but yeah he's right. They're pricey, but they've been holding up like tanks for about 40 years. And if you really want to talk about people who are willing to express strong opinions about vehicles they've never driven before, perhaps we should move on to the hybrids...
GOOD POINT but I'm not commenting on a hybrid other than to say if I ever buy one regardless of who built it they will have to come up with something that has better looks than the current crop.

 

[brianl703]

There are plenty of ugly non-hybrid vehicles out there too.

 

[oilnoob425]

Originally Posted By: Camu Mahubah
And yes I know the Toyota is American made but it's not the same!


Oh yeah Mexican made "American Trucks" sounds way better! These pictures are just some propoganda for bigotted redneck "patriots" that can't accept the facts and always looking for something to stick. I'm sure you can find similiar or some other faults with american trucks too. Besides most brand new "american" trucks I see on the road are always sparkling clean and never loaded, there is not one single trace that would indicate these trucks used for it's actual purpose. So I guess it's safe to assume that they've being bought by posers as well.

 

[oilnoob425]

Originally Posted By: Jaybird
Americans have the best work ethic on the planet. You are making statements based on your perception, and not reality, njcruiser.


It's funny how you acusing him of being perceptive, and doing the same thing at time. Americans have best work ethic on the planet? Why? Where does it say exactly? Because I haven't read about it. Honestly I don't think so, at least not all of them. You obviously very biased, typical ignorant, blindfolded American "patriot" whose fed by government propoganda. Have you even been to many diferent countries to make such generalisation statements?

 

[oilnoob425]

Originally Posted By: GMFan
Originally Posted By: Duffman77
Originally Posted By: Jaybird
Americans have the best work ethic on the planet. You are making statements based on your perception, and not reality, njcruiser.


Do you have any data to back up this claim or is it based on quick perceptions as well?


http://www.boston.com/news/world/europe/...ost_productive/


Working more hours and faster got nothing to do with works ethic or better quality. That's exactly why american made products are worse quality than european or japanese products. Also american service industry is pretty horrible as well. You article precisely explains why. If supervisor treats you like a slave with overloading you, the outcome is bigger production and worse quality(see chinese goods). It's all about quantity vs quality, and has nothing to do with work ethic. Good work ethics mean providing the best products and services possible, which is of course is not the case in US.

 

[brianl703]

I've actually been bitched at because I did my job too efficiently and quickly. But I knew what I was doing. What I ended up doing to placate the idiotic management is basically wasting time running a bunch of diagnostic tests on the severs I was building (they rarely ever showed a problem; if they did they showed the error long before the hour or so I continued to baby-sit the diagnostic programs was up). It seemed as though management would have been happier with someone who worked so slow that the backlog of unbuilt servers kept growing day by day (which is precisely what was going on prior to my taking over that work--the guy I replaced had NO CLUE what he was doing. But at least he was a hard worker. You know, work is indeed hard when you don't know what you're doing).

 

[Drew2000]

Originally Posted By: byez
Ford makes a real mans truck.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB0araA0T_k


The video is testing 2003 and prior model years. Ford substantially redesigned the truck after this test and the vehicle now performs well.
http://www.iihs.org/ratings/rating.aspx?id=192

Both 2008 Ford and Chevy score 5 stars in NHTSA crash ratings for both driver and passenger. 2008 Toyota Tundra could only manage 4, which is interesting considering the amount of R&D $$ that supposedly went into it's design.

(FYI... Toyota USA went $100 million over budget designing the Tundra and came under great pressure from corp. HQ in Japan to cut costs.)

Drew

 

[Jaybird]

oilnoob, I can only say that you have no idea of what you are talking about. I will excuse the "blindfolded, bigoted redneck" names you throw around, as you probably don't know better.
But I ask you, how can a nation, that has only been around for a short period of time, be the leader of the world? And make no mistake, we ARE the leaders of the world, in technological as well as social advancement. It surely doesn't happen by the lack of motivation and work ethic.

I suggest you take your anti-American drivel and move to imadorkistan, where your depth and insight would be more appreciated.

And for your information, yes, I have been to multiple foreign countries, and have seen the workforces there.

Let me guess, you are another upset Toyota buyer full of angst and buyers remorse? I wouldn't worry. There are lots of those with similar misconceptions of reality and skewed perceptions of what quality actually is. You shouldn't have any trouble unloading your Toyota.

 

[oilnoob425]

Originally Posted By: Jaybird
oilnoob, I can only say that you have no idea of what you are talking about. I will excuse the "blindfolded, bigoted redneck" names you throw around, as you probably don't know better.
But I ask you, how can a nation, that has only been around for a short period of time, be the leader of the world? And make no mistake, we ARE the leaders of the world, in technological as well as social advancement. It surely doesn't happen by the lack of motivation and work ethic.

I suggest you take your anti-American drivel and move to imadorkistan, where your depth and insight would be more appreciated.

And for your information, yes, I have been to multiple foreign countries, and have seen the workforces there.

Let me guess, you are another upset Toyota buyer full of angst and buyers remorse? I wouldn't worry. There are lots of those with similar misconceptions of reality and skewed perceptions of what quality actually is. You shouldn't have any trouble unloading your Toyota.


I know exactly what I'm talking about. Your comments about americans being leaders of the world in technological as well as social advancement ARE NOT true. It's just your biased opinion based on nothing and doesn't mean anything. I had many jobs and bought many american made products, what I've seen wasn't very thrilling. I didn't give you any antiamerican drivel, I just don't like your empty sensless "patriotic" drivel. Your "imadorkistan" remark pretty much prove my "blindfolded, bigoted redneck" assesment. And I suggest your keep your suggestions to youself. FYI I don't own and never did own any Toyota products.

 

[dickdog1]

Originally Posted By: Drew2000
Originally Posted By: byez
Ford makes a real mans truck.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB0araA0T_k


The video is testing 2003 and prior model years. Ford substantially redesigned the truck after this test and the vehicle now performs well.
http://www.iihs.org/ratings/rating.aspx?id=192

Both 2008 Ford and Chevy score 5 stars in NHTSA crash ratings for both driver and passenger. 2008 Toyota Tundra could only manage 4, which is interesting considering the amount of R&D $$ that supposedly went into it's design.

(FYI... Toyota USA went $100 million over budget designing the Tundra and came under great pressure from corp. HQ in Japan to cut costs.)

Drew

wow i have a 2002 lariat f150. what a dog! I always felt like it was unsafe.man. I cant in good consciense sell it or trade it i either. And I wont drive it. Anyone wanna buy a 10,000 boat anchor?

 

[Jaybird]

I found this report very interesting. Sort of a clash between the poor American work ethic, and the quality driven professionalism of a Japanese auto maker.

What I found most interesting in the piece, was the fact that this lady is still brainwashed into thinking that the corporation she worked for has nothing but quality and consumer safety in mind.

Are Japanese auto makers really putting out a better product?
Perception is far from reality when we look deeper than what is advertised, and what we can glean from biased anecdotes.

Quote:
Worker in whistleblower suit says "Toyota way" ignored at factory
Associated Press Newswires 11/27/07
by Yuri Kageyama
Copyright 2007. The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.

TOKYO (AP) - The California auto worker who is suing Toyota and others in a whistleblower lawsuit said Tuesday she was merely carrying out the quality-conscious "Toyota way" in spotting defects when managers demoted her.

Katy Cameron, 54, employed for 23 years at New United Motor Manufacturing Inc., a joint venture between Toyota Motor Corp. and General Motors Corp. in Fremont, Calif., is suing the companies in a lawsuit, filed Nov. 6 in Alameda County Superior Court.

The lawsuit accuses management at NUMMI of routinely deleting or downgrading defects that Cameron found as a certified auditor -- including broken seat belts, faulty headlights, inadequate braking and steering wheel alignment problems -- and demands $45 million in damages for retaliation against a whistleblower and intentional infliction of emotional distress.

"I believed in the Toyota way. I really did. I just wanted to know why they turned their head on me," Cameron said from California in a telephone interview with The Associated Press. "Why did they look the other way when I cried out for help?"

Cameron said she was trained in Toyota's corporate philosophy, which emphasizes the importance of the workers on the assembly line not only in making manufacturing more efficient but also pointing out defects and other problems. She was so good she trained other auditors, she says.

But about five years ago, the management at NUMMI seemed to shift its emphasis to quantity over quality, eager to reduce defect numbers, which determined their bonus pay, said Cameron.

And Toyota's vaunted quality-check system seemed to get neglected, she said.

Cameron said she went to court only after she tried to alert higher-ups to what she saw as serious wrongdoing, including her bosses, as well as the top executive at NUMMI, handing him a letter and other reports in writing in 2006.

She also sent reports in writing to Toyota executives, including one to President Katsuaki Watanabe but has received no response so far, she said.

The companies are declining comment on the lawsuit, saying the case is pending. But NUMMI spokesman Lance Tomasu said in a statement last week that quality is a priority and said the claims will be investigated thoroughly.

Toyota Executive Vice President Kazuo Okamoto, who oversees technology, acknowledged he was aware of the lawsuit but said Monday he did not know details.

Toyota has built its global empire riding on its reputation for reliable vehicles. Toyota executives have repeatedly said they are worried about quality standards slipping as the automaker steps up worldwide expansion.

Toyota's products, such as the Camry and Corolla, are so popular some analysts say the company is on track to beat GM as the world's biggest automaker by sales this year. But the number of recalls has ballooned with the surge in vehicle sales.

"It was Katy's passion to be the eye of the consumer," said Cameron's attorney Kelly Armstrong in San Francisco. "This is a $45 million message to NUMMI, Toyota and General Motors that they can no longer emphasize quantity over quality at the expense of hardworking Americans and consumers."

Cameron, who has been on medical leave from stress the lawsuit says is caused by persistent on-the-job harassment, returned to work Tuesday. But she has been assigned to putting auto parts in boxes, and is no longer allowed to inspect vehicles. Her bosses have repeatedly threatened to fire her, according to the lawsuit.

Cameron said NUMMI management blocked her attempts to relay quality problems to Toyota in Japan by preventing her from using the company phone and fax and taking away her in-company Internet privileges.

She expressed admiration for the Toyota work ethic, praising the corporate culture as "awesome." There is nothing Cameron wants more than to have her job back checking for defects, she says.

"I was trying to do my job. It was my job. And now here I am: I am punished for doing my job," she said. "I felt really betrayed. And I felt used because I worked hard. I worked very hard."

 

[biomed_eng_2000]

The only reason people think that the Tundra is a Japanese pickup is that it is sold under the Toyota name.

The new Tundra was Styled by Americans, Engineered by Americans, Tooled-up by Americans, Made with American Steel, Built by Americans, Transported by Americans, Sold by Americans and Bought by Americans.

I would even bet that a good number of the people that engineered the Tundra were the EXACT same engineers that engineered the current and/or past "American" pickups.

 

[lght1]

Hi

These Tundras may be fine for the market that they are targeted at..the weekend crowd going to Lowes or Home Depot for a bag of peat moss and to carry dirt bikes.

However, as I mentioned earlier,even Fisher Engineering doesn't recommend anything much beyond the lightweight "homesteader" plow as the Tundra's front end isn't up to the job of carrying a heavier model.

These trucks arent capable of competing with the heavier GVW F150s and SD models as far as vocational use is concerned.

 

[1sttruck]

It seems to vary by industry and maybe it's changing, but Japanese companies seem to do better at evolving products to cater to consumers, whether it results in 'better' product or not. I've seen this in products like cameras, stereos, motorcycles, snowmobiles, autos, etc.

If people want small, affordable point and shoot / digital cameras with a big zoom range and lots of features they'll get it, even if it means that the optics are slow, often medicocre, and the products aren't very durable. We have a 10 year or so old 35mm f2.8 fixed lens Contax P&S film camera that so far has outlasted four small digital cameras. I'll never buy another digital camera for the kids, and maybe never for myself. My daughter used my dad's 30 year or so old Canon F1 with a Canon 50mm f1.8 for her photo class, a camera that she can probably pass on to her kids if she has any.

Motorcycles are a good example of catering to customers, where the current generation of sport bikes are providing better performance than GP bikes were when I was riding. The other side of the coin is that the industry also offers lots of 'crusiers', which are just fake Harleys, and 'motobagos', which are also essentially fake full dress Harleys (apologies to anyone who is offended). You want it, if there is a market they'll provide it.

You can bet your donkey that Toyota and others did lots of customer surveys to find out what people wanted in a full size truck, and even though the market may have shifted beneath them due to fuel prices they provided vehicles targeted to those stated / perceived wants. Be careful what you ask for as you might just get it, whether it's a 'better' product or not.

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: oilnoob425
Also american service industry is pretty horrible as well.


Never stayed at a hotel in Mexico, have ya!

 

[Drew99GT]

Originally Posted By: oilnoob425
Besides most brand new "american" trucks I see on the road are always sparkling clean and never loaded, there is not one single trace that would indicate these trucks used for it's actual purpose. So I guess it's safe to assume that they've being bought by posers as well.


Good; you live where trucks aren't meant for work. I live where they work, and work HARD. I've never seen anything other than a Dodge, Ford, or GM loaded down with 10,000 + lbs of horses at 9,000 feet ASL going up 7% grades, blasting through cow pastures at 30 miles an hour where it's nothing but punishment. Ask a rancher in the west if he'd buy a new Tundra.

And yes, I own a Toyota

 

[ekpolk]

Everyone be cool now. I really don't think that there's any specific place where trucks aren't truly work implements. And no matter where you go, you'll find legions of people buying them who really don't have any true need for them (other than the urge to have one...). They exist right along side the "real" truck operators. Sure, you may find more wannabes in the 'burbs (or other particular places), but they're everywhere, as are the true W/Ts.

 

[Jaybird]

Originally Posted By: biomed_eng_2000
The only reason people think that the Tundra is a Japanese pickup is that it is sold under the Toyota name.

The new Tundra was Styled by Americans, Engineered by Americans, Tooled-up by Americans, Made with American Steel, Built by Americans, Transported by Americans, Sold by Americans and Bought by Americans.

I would even bet that a good number of the people that engineered the Tundra were the EXACT same engineers that engineered the current and/or past "American" pickups.
Built by Americans, yes. And those builders will often times have a team leader that comes straight off the boat, and can't even speak the language yet. One of the Japanese engineers who actually designs the vehicles and tooling, is probably this team leaders uncle. This happens all the time with mid-level management of most any Japanese plant I have been in. Upper management is almost always exclusively Japanese.

And the steel used in Toyota plants is NOT domestic. Not sure where you came up with that one, but of this I am certain.
I have actually installed steel in a Toyota plant. Their specifications require that the steel be of a metric persuasion.
And no US steel maker provides this. All of the metric steel I have seen used in a Toyota plant was Japanese, and and a large portion of it is supplied by a joint venture between Jervis B Webb and Tsubakimoto. Lot's of help from our Japanese friends in keeping our struggling domestic steel industry alive and well.

Toyota did not place any plants here in the US and say; "Here you go Americans..run this operation for us". They run them from top to bottom, and don't believe otherwise. And you can bet there will be NO major decisions acted upon without the approval from the Japanese management.

If GM puts a car plant in Bolivia, do you think the Bolivians will be managing the operation? Designing the cars and making the decisions? No, the Bolivians will be providing menial labor, just as we are the Japanese in a Toyota plant.