Thoughts on the Cadillac ATS 2.0 Standard AWD?
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Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Seems like an example of media bias. Did they ever say this about Japanese and Korean makes? When Lexus introduced the LS400, the media praised it to high heaven and never suggested it is not as good a genuine Mercedes or BMW. They never said any of the Johnny come lately copy cat asian vehicles were not the real deal.
I think it has to do with the fact that GM themselves has openly admitted that they were trying to create a bmw 3-series killer and have extensively studied the driving dynamics of an earlier 3-series model. Hence, all the mags now latch onto this info, trying to determine how close this ATS has come. Many of the reviews I've seen claim that in terms of driving dynamics this ATS is actually better than the current 3-series. However, there are some people out there that just want to be seen with a BMW badge on the hood, regardless of how it drives. For those, buying this ATS is pointless, even though it may be the better car. I think that's what Jalopnik was getting at. Maybe I'm wrong.
Seems like an example of media bias. Did they ever say this about Japanese and Korean makes? When Lexus introduced the LS400, the media praised it to high heaven and never suggested it is not as good a genuine Mercedes or BMW. They never said any of the Johnny come lately copy cat asian vehicles were not the real deal.
I think it has to do with the fact that GM themselves has openly admitted that they were trying to create a bmw 3-series killer and have extensively studied the driving dynamics of an earlier 3-series model. Hence, all the mags now latch onto this info, trying to determine how close this ATS has come. Many of the reviews I've seen claim that in terms of driving dynamics this ATS is actually better than the current 3-series. However, there are some people out there that just want to be seen with a BMW badge on the hood, regardless of how it drives. For those, buying this ATS is pointless, even though it may be the better car. I think that's what Jalopnik was getting at. Maybe I'm wrong.
Right but they could've made the same argument about the LS400. Lexus was brand new and basically imitating and benchmarking luxury Euro sedans. Instead all the media did was praise it's superiority to BMW and Mercedes. The examples are almost endless RX7/Porsche 944, Fiero/MR2 etc. What Cadillac did with the ATS is no different whether they acknowledge it than what Infiniti, Lexus, Hyundai are doing with their 3-series competitors, except that Cadillac arguably built a better "3-series" than BMW itself is.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
If it was a touch bigger on the inside I bet we'd have liked it even better. Plus there is almost no trunk!
Cadillac should make a wagon version of it. That would at least solve the small cargo problem.
If it was a touch bigger on the inside I bet we'd have liked it even better. Plus there is almost no trunk!
Cadillac should make a wagon version of it. That would at least solve the small cargo problem.
Quote:
Among initial buyers who traded in a vehicle to purchase an ATS, 70 percent are new to Cadillac. In the crucial and often trend-setting state of California, Cadillac retail sales rose 70 percent in October over the same month last year, and are up 13 percent year-to-date.
http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/cadillac...v/1101_ats.html
I think they need to develop a coupe, wagon and convertible.
Among initial buyers who traded in a vehicle to purchase an ATS, 70 percent are new to Cadillac. In the crucial and often trend-setting state of California, Cadillac retail sales rose 70 percent in October over the same month last year, and are up 13 percent year-to-date.
http://media.gm.com/media/us/en/cadillac...v/1101_ats.html
I think they need to develop a coupe, wagon and convertible.
Originally Posted By: barlowc
Hmm... and maybe I should think about the TREMEC 6-speed manual transmission too? I know how to drive a stick; just never owned one.
One of the absolute best features of my new SRT-8 is the Tremec. Wonderful gearbox, very sporty, but also very easy to drive. Nothing at all like the days when a manual in a high-powered vehicle would grow your left thigh and right arm disproportionately to the rest of your body...
Hmm... and maybe I should think about the TREMEC 6-speed manual transmission too? I know how to drive a stick; just never owned one.
One of the absolute best features of my new SRT-8 is the Tremec. Wonderful gearbox, very sporty, but also very easy to drive. Nothing at all like the days when a manual in a high-powered vehicle would grow your left thigh and right arm disproportionately to the rest of your body...
^^^I am always amazed at the light clutch pedals and smooooooth shifting gearboxes in all the modern high powered cars!
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Right but they could've made the same argument about the LS400. Lexus was brand new and basically imitating and benchmarking luxury Euro sedans.
Finally the BMW/MB had a match or superior in other ways when LS400 when was introduced and I believe price was on par or even less. It was a major auto event.
Cadillac still has an uphill battle for sure as folks who buy BMW 3 series don't always fully care about the driving experience. Cadillac has been a non-player with dynamic cars and has to somehow figure out how to occupy this space via marketing. The engineers did a great job. Good luck to Cadillac on this front.
There are some great cars out that barely sell but the average ones that sell like hot cakes.
Right but they could've made the same argument about the LS400. Lexus was brand new and basically imitating and benchmarking luxury Euro sedans.
Finally the BMW/MB had a match or superior in other ways when LS400 when was introduced and I believe price was on par or even less. It was a major auto event.
Cadillac still has an uphill battle for sure as folks who buy BMW 3 series don't always fully care about the driving experience. Cadillac has been a non-player with dynamic cars and has to somehow figure out how to occupy this space via marketing. The engineers did a great job. Good luck to Cadillac on this front.
There are some great cars out that barely sell but the average ones that sell like hot cakes.
Don't forget this platform will underpin some other great cars for GM, they're going to use it a LOT!
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Now THIS is a Cadillac :^) I passed one of these on the hwy today and was in total awe!!!!!!!!!
http://www.cadillac.com/cts-v-sport-coupe.html
http://www.cadillac.com/cts-v-sport-coupe.html
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Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
My point is that the media totally did all the marketing in favor for Lexus. Anyway, did you see the link I posted? The ATS is selling quite well.
Its doing well. However while Cadillac sales are way up but they were at the bottom. I believe they surpassed Acura however BMW sold around 25k/month vs Cadillac 15k which is a Cadillac record in 23 years. Once the newness wears off with the new Caddy models those numbers flatten off.
Personally I have only seen 2 ATS on the road as they are quite distinct. However many,many BMW's especially with paper plates(temporary tags). However it may just be a locale thing here.
My point is that the media totally did all the marketing in favor for Lexus. Anyway, did you see the link I posted? The ATS is selling quite well.
Its doing well. However while Cadillac sales are way up but they were at the bottom. I believe they surpassed Acura however BMW sold around 25k/month vs Cadillac 15k which is a Cadillac record in 23 years. Once the newness wears off with the new Caddy models those numbers flatten off.
Personally I have only seen 2 ATS on the road as they are quite distinct. However many,many BMW's especially with paper plates(temporary tags). However it may just be a locale thing here.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
Wait for the 2014 CTS, the design as matured significantly.
I dislike the current CTS coupe, I don't like the chopped street rod feeling with the high doors and little windows.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
Wait for the 2014 CTS, the design as matured significantly.
I dislike the current CTS coupe, I don't like the chopped street rod feeling with the high doors and little windows.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
You have to admit though, the wagon is still pretty sick.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Looks awfully gaudy. Love the engine though.
Completely agree. Had two chances to get one of these and the absurdly angular styling turned me off both times. Plus this is a SMALL car in person, with small wheels, tight interior, and a lack of 'street presence', IMO. There are great used deals out there, though, and in bang for the buck quotient these are VERY hard to beat. Simple pulley and tune is well over 600 reliable horses.
You have to admit though, the wagon is still pretty sick.
^^^YES! I do think a wagon with 556 hp and a six speed stick is VERY cool.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I'll be the dissenter and say wagons are not cool or stylish at all anymore than a crossover or minivan is imo. They have utility though. They need a 2-door ATS, but just like the wagon there's probably not as much market for them.
It's NOT a matter of style, it's just cool because NO ONE expects a wagon to be that quick, nor be available with a 6 speed manual gearbox (it even beats out the old RS4 Audi Avant estates in that respect
).
I'll be the dissenter and say wagons are not cool or stylish at all anymore than a crossover or minivan is imo. They have utility though. They need a 2-door ATS, but just like the wagon there's probably not as much market for them.
It's NOT a matter of style, it's just cool because NO ONE expects a wagon to be that quick, nor be available with a 6 speed manual gearbox (it even beats out the old RS4 Audi Avant estates in that respect
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Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I'll be the dissenter and say wagons are not cool or stylish at all anymore than a crossover or minivan is imo. They have utility though. They need a 2-door ATS, but just like the wagon there's probably not as much market for them.
It's NOT a matter of style, it's just cool because NO ONE expects a wagon to be that quick, nor be available with a 6 speed manual gearbox (it even beats out the old RS4 Audi Avant estates in that respect
).
And the 540i Estate too!
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I'll be the dissenter and say wagons are not cool or stylish at all anymore than a crossover or minivan is imo. They have utility though. They need a 2-door ATS, but just like the wagon there's probably not as much market for them.
It's NOT a matter of style, it's just cool because NO ONE expects a wagon to be that quick, nor be available with a 6 speed manual gearbox (it even beats out the old RS4 Audi Avant estates in that respect
And the 540i Estate too!
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