That trapped soccer team in flooded cave system

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Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
My wife had the TV on earlier and said they have three or four out. Something about placing reserve oxygen tanks along the route out.Those kids must be scared beyond what we can imagine, but with time running out they are probably open to almost any rescue effort. Looks like this news maker will be over today.


Looks like 4 out now. One of the problems with reporting is that lots of times they don't know what they're reporting about. Some of them are saying air tanks and some say oxygen tanks. For diving, they use air tanks as it's a mixture of air and oxygen. Oxygen tanks would be pure oxygen. There's some pictures where some truck is pulling up with oxygen tanks, but maybe that's just to recharge the air tanks or for something else.
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
My wife had the TV on earlier and said they have three or four out. Something about placing reserve oxygen tanks along the route out.Those kids must be scared beyond what we can imagine, but with time running out they are probably open to almost any rescue effort. Looks like this news maker will be over today.


Looks like 4 out now. One of the problems with reporting is that lots of times they don't know what they're reporting about. Some of them are saying air tanks and some say oxygen tanks. For diving, they use air tanks as it's a mixture of air and oxygen. Oxygen tanks would be pure oxygen. There's some pictures where some truck is pulling up with oxygen tanks, but maybe that's just to recharge the air tanks or for something else.


Most diving is done with air.
There are enriched gas mixtures, like Nitrox, that can be used to extend allowable bottom time at moderate depths.
There are also more exotic mixtures that are used for really deep dives, which some people do for sport even though these are in the realm of technical and not sport diving. A down line is normally rigged for these dives with bottles of various gas mixtures with regs hung at every planned deco stop.
It isn't that your body needs more O2. It doesn't and a high enough concentration of O2 at too high a partial pressure will cause a diver to convulse, spit out his reg and drown. The advantage is in reducing the amount of nitrogen in the breathing gas, since your body will load nitrogen in all of its tissues and this gas will come out of solution as ambient pressure is reduced as a diver ascends. If a diver ascends too quickly and makes no deco stops, the diver may experience DCS (decompression sickness), commonly known as the bends or earlier as caisson's disease which can result in permanent impairment or even death. The only cure is a chamber ride that might last for days. The bent diver will be administered O2 on the way to the recompression chamber mainly to avoid introducing any more nitrogen into his system, since he's already outgassing it more quickly than should be the case. O2 at sea level or above is harmless even in very high concentrations.
O2 bottles are always painted green and are always steel AFAIK, so are easily identified while scuba cylinders can be almost any color and can be aluminum or steel. The advantage of a steel cylinder is that it's always negatively buoyant even as its empties. I need quite a bit more weight to sink with my wetsuit when diving an aluminum 80 cf tank versus a steel 95 cf tank. You must be weighed such that you're never positively buoyant since you must be able to control your ascent. You use your BCD or drysuit if you're wearing one to control buoyancy in the water, with the goal being neutral buoyancy, easy at depth and harder in shallow water.
Anyway, I'd kind of doubt that anyone was staging O2 cylinders in the cave. More likely compressed atmospheric air, which averages 79% nitrogen.
 
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Quote:
6 out at this point. Fingers are crossed for the rest.

thumbsup2.gif



That's such great news! Better take a 24 hour hiatus!!
 
A huge future problem is that now this location is in the open: World-wide. That means plenty attention from others who will want visit the location where they were stranded. That's very, very bad.

Once is bad enough. Imagine having to do it all again...

I'm thinking they'll probably close the entrance or block (dynamite) the passage leading to that section to prevent this from ever occuring again.
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
A huge future problem is that now this location is in the open: World-wide. That means plenty attention from others who will want visit the location where they were stranded. That's very, very bad.

Once is bad enough. Imagine having to do it all again...

I'm thinking they'll probably close the entrance or block (dynamite) the passage leading to that section to prevent this from ever occuring again.


It's a popular cave that the boys had actually been to before. The sign said no entry from July-October. So they probably just need to update the sign to say June instead of July. It's be good as a tourist attraction so I don't think they'd do anything drastic. Just make sure it's closed during Monsoon season.
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
A huge future problem is that now this location is in the open: World-wide. That means plenty attention from others who will want visit the location where they were stranded. That's very, very bad.

Once is bad enough. Imagine having to do it all again...

I'm thinking they'll probably close the entrance or block (dynamite) the passage leading to that section to prevent this from ever occuring again.


It's a popular cave that the boys had actually been to before. The sign said no entry from July-October. So they probably just need to update the sign to say June instead of July. It's be good as a tourist attraction so I don't think they'd do anything drastic. Just make sure it's closed during Monsoon season.


This also ain't America, so the hyper cautious no need for anyone to accept personal responsibility ethos that rules here doesn't apply.
The locals will no doubt post some warnings but won't destroy this lovely cave system.
Had the coach and the team known that heavy rains might flood the cave and trap them in it, they'd probably have foregone the excursion.
 
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Those rescue divers are some serious tough as nails guys! Genuine heroes! Keeping them all in my prayers!

Yes, pretty amazing, and the kids deserve some credit, too. If I were ever to take up diving, I'm sure I wouldn't want my first dive to be a cave dive after being trapped for days. I guess they have some powerful motivation, though.
 
Originally Posted By: Garak
I guess they have some powerful motivation, though.


Yeah, possible death or spending months inside a cave usually sparks the motivation pretty good.
grin2.gif


Exploring miles inside from the entrance of any cave can be risky.
 
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: Yah-Tah-Hey
My wife had the TV on earlier and said they have three or four out. Something about placing reserve oxygen tanks along the route out.Those kids must be scared beyond what we can imagine, but with time running out they are probably open to almost any rescue effort. Looks like this news maker will be over today.


Looks like 4 out now. One of the problems with reporting is that lots of times they don't know what they're reporting about. Some of them are saying air tanks and some say oxygen tanks. For diving, they use air tanks as it's a mixture of air and oxygen. Oxygen tanks would be pure oxygen. There's some pictures where some truck is pulling up with oxygen tanks, but maybe that's just to recharge the air tanks or for something else.
The usual SCUBA tank fill is compressed air
the media can't be trusted for the facts.
 
Prayers sent. I believe there are seven more to go. I'm hearing conflicting reports.
 
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Prayers sent. I believe there are seven more to go. I'm hearing conflicting reports.


5 out (1 in the last hour) and 8 to go is the latest report. Apparently more to follow shortly.
 
A few enterprising individuals will parlay this occurrence into big $$$.Would speculate that some have already been contacted and offered special deals for exclusive coverage. Won't be too long before the first book shows up.
 
The efforts of this international rescue team as well as the tough minds and physical training of the rescue divers are things of awe. From the search to the discovery of the team and then their rescue, the divers showed great courage and persistence. Tough guys in every sense.
I noted in two previous posts in this thread that the trapped team and their assistant coach would probably have to be taken out with some underwater work. I figured that there might well be at least one fatality among this group.
That they got everyone out is amazing and is a tribute to the planning, the fortitude and the courage of the rescue drivers.
The only dark spot in this whole event was the loss of the retired Thai navy diver. It will be interesting as technical details emerge about the rescue as a whole as well as how this man died.
I guess I'll have to visit some dive shops and pick up next month's editions of the various dive magazines since I no longer subscribe to any, although the WSJ and The Economist might have pretty good coverage.
 
Great post, fdcg. I watched the video of the first time they found the kids in the cave. Wow. That was intense. To think the kids were in the cave for almost 10 days just waiting to, uh, waiting hopeful someone would find them. They were a bit subdued when the first divers found them.

The coach was orphaned when he was 10 and sent to live in a monastery. He doesn't seem to have a job other than coaching soccer and being a fine citizen. Seems a lot of the meaning is lost when translating Thai to English so it's hard to get a good feel for the words coming out of Thailand.

I think there will be books and a movie made about this and a lot of the money makes its way to this village. The people there seem to have a lot of integrity. The people, parents, and family very calm in accepting that the rescuers are risking their lives to same the kids and their coach and hoping for the best but prepared for the worst.

Interesting is the poor media accuracy and coverage. Probably due to lack of a central source of the truth in Thailand and general media incompetency.
 
Originally Posted By: Leo99

Interesting is the poor media accuracy and coverage. Probably due to lack of a central source of the truth in Thailand and general media incompetency.


I thought the way the Thai authorities handled it by ejecting the media from the area and maintaining a quite effective managed radio silence was brilliant. It meant the families could be managed, speculation kept under control and information leakage tightly minimised. Sure, it lead to some confused speculation, but that was limited to "did they get 4 or 6 kids out today" rather than headline grabbing speculation about whether the first boy out might have been the second cousin, fifteenth removed of a Kardashian.

No reports on health condition other than "one boy had an issue on his foot, one had a slow pulse and two might have lung conditions (such as pneumonia).". No names linked with conditions and almost complete anonymity. Brilliantly managed.

As for the leadup to the rescue itself, one fatality and 4 injured in a car accident. Tragic, but on the whole a massively positive outcome. The lessons learned from this will be awesome. I just hope these kids are left out of the spotlight to deal with the inevitable mental fallout and given the support they need to deal with what they've just been through. I bet there are 12 sets of very happy parents today.
 
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