Replacing 2 prong outlets

[jjcom]

It's hard to see for sure, but that looks a lot like standard NM wire. I've seen folks run the neutral to a screw in the box to make it appear grounded. While it tricks the tester, it is not a safe configuration. I would check for that. I've also seen folks splice NM behind the box to cover up that it is really being fed by old knob and tube or other cloth covered wire. If you're not sure, I would take the extra time to check. I found charred/burnt wire in this configuration in my house.

You'll want to put the GFCI outlet in the first outlet in the series. All outlets after will then have GFCI protection and can have three prong outlets installed, with label. Please check your local codes though!

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: jjcom
It's hard to see for sure, but that looks a lot like standard NM wire. I've seen folks run the neutral to a screw in the box to make it appear grounded. While it tricks the tester, it is not a safe configuration. I would check for that. I've also seen folks splice NM behind the box to cover up that it is really being fed by old knob and tube or other cloth covered wire. If you're not sure, I would take the extra time to check. I found charred/burnt wire in this configuration in my house.

You'll want to put the GFCI outlet in the first outlet in the series. All outlets after will then have GFCI protection and can have three prong outlets installed, with label. Please check your local codes though!
I don't think anyone has played with the wiring like that, they've owned the house for 45 years.

 

[sxg6]

I went through this recently. From what I can see, it reminds me of the cloth covered wiring I have in parts of my house. It's hard to see, but in my house they hooked up the ground to the outside of the boxes.

So your box may or may not be grounded, not all cloth covered wire has a ground. In one outlet I ran a ground from the box to the receptacle, and in another two locations I just did self grounding receptacles. Not exactly like what's in the link below, but similar.
https://store.leviton.com/products/15-am...ant=18216826883

 

[SHOZ]

If it's two wire romex or cloth covered then there probably is no ground. To actually convert it to grounded then you need to add wire to each outlet box.

The GFCI would work as far as protection is concerned without the ground wire as mentioned.

If you know the order in which the outlets are strung, a GFCI on the first one would protect the entire string.

 

[Nick1994]

Not sure what kind of wiring this is. I had to take the cover off the panel.

 

[Wolf359]

Need pictures of wires going into the panel, not the panel itself. If you have bx, it would end at the outside of the panel. Can't tell from the pictures if you have BX. I don't think you do as the wires leading in seem to be in conduit. Need a wider shot of the outside of the panel.

 

[Nick1994]

Everything is in conduit, but I opened up some covers and took some pictures.

Still not sure what kind it is.

 

[Wolf359]

Well many of the wires on that bus bar are just neutral wires, don't see too many ground wires. Can't tell what type of conduit you have in the pictures but it sounds like you don't have bx. If the conduit doesn't connect to the gang box, then you have no ground.

 

[SHOZ]

Volt meter set on ohms would tell you if those boxes are grounded if there is continuity between the box and a bare ground wire. There are ground wires in them.

 

[Nick1994]

Thanks for all the help guys. I'm on a 2 week road trip now so I'll do some more testing when I get back. If anyone has any more info, feel free to add.

 

[dareo]

Are those Zinsco breakers? If so they have a bad reputation, cost a lot to replace, and may even be dangerous. Replacing the main breakers would be prudent if funds allow.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: dareo
Are those Zinsco breakers? If so they have a bad reputation, cost a lot to replace, and may even be dangerous. Replacing the main breakers would be prudent if funds allow.
Yeah the panel cover said Zinsco. I'll look into it and talk to my grandparents.

 

[exranger06]

Have an electrician replace the panel and while he's there, ask him what it would take to convert all outlets to 3 prong. Based on the pictures, I have a feeling you don't have BX cable. Even if you did, I don't believe it's code to simply run a ground wire from the outlet to the box. It USED to be code, but not anymore. I think your only options are to use GFCIs everywhere or run new wire. Or just keep the 2 prong outlets.

 

[exranger06]

Oh, and throughout this thread, I didn't see one person mention the words "bonding strip" when talking about BX. If the BX cable does not have a bonding strip, the outer sheathing CANNOT be used as a grounding conductor. If it does, it can be used, but as I said, I "believe" code changed and you're no longer allowed to simply run a pigtail from the outlet to the box.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: exranger06
Have an electrician replace the panel and while he's there, ask him what it would take to convert all outlets to 3 prong. Based on the pictures, I have a feeling you don't have BX cable. Even if you did, I don't believe it's code to simply run a ground wire from the outlet to the box. It USED to be code, but not anymore. I think your only options are to use GFCIs everywhere or run new wire. Or just keep the 2 prong outlets.


Might just keep the 2 prong outlets for now, there's nothing used much in the bedrooms except for an alarm clock and a small LED tv. But we were considering putting in a window A/C in one of the bedrooms, I guess I could just use a plug adapter. It would be a tiny window A/C at 4 amps max so way less than a vacuum cleaner.

 

[SHOZ]

Why not use the GFCI outlets?

 

[exranger06]

2 prong adapters are garbage; using them is basically the same as replacing the outlet with a 3-prong and not connecting the ground screw to anything. I would at least replace the outlet where the AC will be plugged into with a GFCI and leave the rest as 2-prong.

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: Nick1994


Might just keep the 2 prong outlets for now, there's nothing used much in the bedrooms except for an alarm clock and a small LED tv. But we were considering putting in a window A/C in one of the bedrooms, I guess I could just use a plug adapter. It would be a tiny window A/C at 4 amps max so way less than a vacuum cleaner.


Window ACs have a GFI on the plug end of things now. That "might" need a ground to work correctly or at least to turn off the warning LED.

90% of the thing is out in the rain, and could catch lightning in a thunderstorm. Just sayin'.

 

[Nick1994]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Nick1994


Might just keep the 2 prong outlets for now, there's nothing used much in the bedrooms except for an alarm clock and a small LED tv. But we were considering putting in a window A/C in one of the bedrooms, I guess I could just use a plug adapter. It would be a tiny window A/C at 4 amps max so way less than a vacuum cleaner.


Window ACs have a GFI on the plug end of things now. That "might" need a ground to work correctly or at least to turn off the warning LED.

90% of the thing is out in the rain, and could catch lightning in a thunderstorm. Just sayin'.

Ha, rain. What's that?

 

[Nick1994]

Ordered a new electrical tester on Amazon. With the 2 prong to 3 prong adapter it shows an open ground. In the living room, dining room, and kitchen where they have been changed over to 3 prong outlets in the past I put the tester in and it showed open ground. I then pulled out one of those outlets and there is no ground wire hooked up, just the neutral and hot wires.

My grandparent's had an add-on bathroom and laundry room put in in the 80's and the tester shows them as "Correct" as well as the back porch outlets which my grandfather had put in about 10-15 years ago.

So now I wonder if I should just put in 3 prong outlets and hook them up exactly like the rest of the outlets in the house and then someday they can have an electrician run some grounds.