Redline Oil & TEOST ASTM D 6335

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I agree with you. That's what I believe as well. I'm actually very suprised, and disappointed that RL's oil barely passed the TEOST (did it pass?).

They definitely make some outstanding racing oils.

RLI used M1 5w30 as a comparison in their TEOST test and the Mobil 1 scored a bit better, but this was the SM version.

http://www.teraspeed.com/RLI/STLE Cleveland.pdf


Page 10. Reference oil is Mobil 1 per Bill from RLI.
 
buster,

At the beginning of the thread, you said it barely passes the TEOST test, then at the end of the thread, you are saying that it doesn't pass the TEOST test. Can you clarify how you got from one statement to the other? Do you have any links to the database where it shows Redline failed?
 
Of all the oils on that list, besides AMSOIL kicking everyone's rear end in AMSOIL's tests....I was happy to see Valvoline Synpower perform so well.

It really is an outstanding oil. Yeah, the NOACK was near the highest, but it performed as well as any of the other oils in all the other tests.
 
Originally Posted By: buster
^ page 7

http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g3115.pdf

Quote:
*Results for Red Line High Performance ranged from 29.1 mg to 31.4 mg. The average of the three tests run is shown in the
graph.


Thanks buster,

That's very informative. The average of the TEOST was slightly above the spec, but I would call it OK because the average rounds down to 30. I've been running RedLine for a couple of oil changes, and my concern with it is poor TBN retention. I've been considering switching to AMSoil SS, so this report is relevant. Despite the fact that this information is coming off the AMSoil website, the data was taken by a third-party lab, so maybe it's trustworthy.
 
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Originally Posted By: Phishin
Of all the oils on that list, besides AMSOIL kicking everyone's rear end....

If you are concerned about engine deposits it was Castrol Edge that kicked everyone's butt including Asmoil and that's with an average 10.5% NOACK. It also had a TBN second only to Amsoil.

So if I was looking for a long drain oil in a DI application it's Castrol Edge that I would be thinking of trying.
 
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: Phishin
Of all the oils on that list, besides AMSOIL kicking everyone's rear end....

If you are concerned about engine deposits it was Castrol Edge that kicked everyone's butt including Asmoil and that's with an average 10.5% NOACK. It also had a TBN second only to Amsoil.

So if I was looking for a long drain oil in a DI application it's Castrol Edge that I would be thinking of trying.

That said, TBN and TEOST are at the bottom of the oil attributes list in terms of importance to me.
 
TBN retention is much more important than intial TBN, so that Amsoil test is not that meaningful.

TEOST means a lot to me, but I don't have a turbo engine so it's not that important to me at the moment. In a turbo, definitely.
 
Originally Posted By: 229
How does HTO-6 relate to this?

I'm sure it does although I'm not sure how the Honda turbo test is conducted.
TEOST seems to have more specific relevance to DI applications.
 
Mobil mentions the proprietary Honda test on their website.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Synthetics/Mobil_1_Heat_Protection.aspx

One of the differences is the HTO-06 tests used oil


*I just want to point out that these are bench tests, and I've spoken to people that have said what they see in the field does not match up to the bench testing.

There can be a disconnect between bench tests and field testing and that is very important.
 
Yes having a low virgin TEOST result is one thing but how much the deposits increase as the oil is used would seem to be even more important.
One would want to know if there a benefit to changing the oil early to minimize intake valve deposits?
 
http://8g.hondaclub.cz/files/J_Jetter_Honda_042109.pdf

Page 6 gives you details on the HTO-06 test.

Notice the following:

Quote:
Main feature is a modified hot-tube test. Purpose:
• Evaluate the deposit-forming tendency of an oil after aging. (Testing an oil in
fresh condition only is not useful
.)
• The aging procedure simulates additive consumption and sludge/soot build-up.


Quote:
Procedure is available to lubricant and additive companies upon request.
• This procedure does not discriminate against high-moly oils. (High-moly oils are
not a problem for Honda turbocharger technology.)
• This test correlates well with Honda turbocharger testing (bench and real-world).
 
With that in mind^

Are there any global oils that excel (with dexos1 and HTO-06 in mind) 5W30 PP and M1 for their respective applications?
 
Originally Posted By: buster
http://8g.hondaclub.cz/files/J_Jetter_Honda_042109.pdf

Page 6 gives you details on the HTO-06 test.

Notice the following:

Quote:
Main feature is a modified hot-tube test. Purpose:
• Evaluate the deposit-forming tendency of an oil after aging. (Testing an oil in
fresh condition only is not useful
.)
• The aging procedure simulates additive consumption and sludge/soot build-up.


Quote:
Procedure is available to lubricant and additive companies upon request.
• This procedure does not discriminate against high-moly oils. (High-moly oils are
not a problem for Honda turbocharger technology.)
• This test correlates well with Honda turbocharger testing (bench and real-world).

Buster thanks for digging that up.

As Jeff Jetter says, "testing an oil in fresh condition only is not useful" and that is a limitation of the virgin TEOST test.
So if one is concerned about engine deposits in a 30wt oil I'd want to use an oil that that meets HTO-06 and also has a low TEOST test score as well.
 
Originally Posted By: donnyj08
im glad i stocked up on clearanced EDGE FST and QSUD for the S2000 Both oils looked super impressive in the amsoil testing.

im actually very surprised to see the EDGE FST perform so well.

Since the S2000 does not have DI I wouldn't be concerned in the slightest with TEOST. I would probably want to run an oil that has AW additive levels more typical of an SL oil. And if the price didn't bother you RL 0W-30 would be an excellent oil choice.
 
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Ive not been impresed by redline lubes for many years now. and while Ive never used redline lube oils, the UOA results we have seen havent been that stellar.

That's a little harsh for someone that has never used their motor oil.
I for one have been very impressed RL UOAs.
Their oils have proven to be shear proof with more than acceptable wear numbers.


More than acceptable is relative. Sure, we can argue meaning or validity of x ppm vs y ppm of some wear metal, and whether it means anything at all... But the reality is that we have seen MANY times that RL produces high wear metal numbers compared to other lubes. This isnt a question of what UOA tells you - in the context of this specific thread, it appears that RL may not meet certain specs well, and if there is some compromise in the design of the lube, protection may be compromised despite its grp V base, which per the rest of my orginal post, appears to be a differentiator to those who (foolishly) demand specific basestocks for some semblance of "value proposition" that isnt really there.

RI_RS4 was not impressed with RL results in the RS4 engine - driving to the need for a new lube. Sure that is turbo and DI, but for more simplistic engines, Im not sure we have absolute certainty that an extra ton of moly or other AW/EP/FM adds do much at all... and perhaps hinder. And how about TBN?

I cant say that shear stability has been a challenge in any oils Ive ever run, and I have quite a few >10k mile OCIs out there in the UOA section.

Maybe youre specifically talking about racing applications and racing oils... But if so, you arent clear, and most on here couldn't care less about racing applications as compared to longgevity under their regular driving use - even if they drive very hard.
 
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