Philly- safe injection site for opiod users
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OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
The problem has the potential to solve itself with these most recent strains of Fentanyl. People in BC were dying in droves from this stuff. You eliminate the client base, the supply serves no purpose and those people will move on to something else.
Yes, they move onto other drugs.
That assumes that the client base isn't dead. If it is, there's no other drugs to move onto, that's pretty much what I was getting at.
You need active consumers of your product, IE, non-dead folk to make a successful business out of drugs. The latest strains of Fentanyl seem to work against that philosophy by killing the customers.
What percentage of drug abusers move on to become productive members of society? What's the downside of letting them overdose and die? I'm not the most compassionate person, so perhaps there's something here that is lost on me but I've watched our downtown become a ghost town, occupied by the homeless, the addicted and those that fall into both categories, many of which are nurtured by our wide array of methadone clinics, which falls into this whole opioid addiction category. It seems catering to them isn't working
It may save tax dollars, but it doesn't make those areas conducive to normal traffic anymore given the new demographic.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
The problem has the potential to solve itself with these most recent strains of Fentanyl. People in BC were dying in droves from this stuff. You eliminate the client base, the supply serves no purpose and those people will move on to something else.
Yes, they move onto other drugs.
That assumes that the client base isn't dead. If it is, there's no other drugs to move onto, that's pretty much what I was getting at.
You need active consumers of your product, IE, non-dead folk to make a successful business out of drugs. The latest strains of Fentanyl seem to work against that philosophy by killing the customers.
What percentage of drug abusers move on to become productive members of society? What's the downside of letting them overdose and die? I'm not the most compassionate person, so perhaps there's something here that is lost on me but I've watched our downtown become a ghost town, occupied by the homeless, the addicted and those that fall into both categories, many of which are nurtured by our wide array of methadone clinics, which falls into this whole opioid addiction category. It seems catering to them isn't working
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
Show me a pharmaceutical company that makes heroin.
Here ya go, http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/14/health/prescription-heroin-canada/index.html
Show me a pharmaceutical company that makes heroin.
Here ya go, http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/14/health/prescription-heroin-canada/index.html
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Nickdfresh
Portugal’s Example: What Happened After It Decriminalized All Drugs, From Weed to Heroin
From the article:
Quote:
Though often narrowly assessed in reference to its decriminalization law, Portugal's experience over the last decade and a half speaks as much to its free public health system, extensive treatment programs, and the hard to quantify trickle down effects of the legislation.
The lack of socialized healthcare in the USA makes this a non-starter IMHO.
Portugal’s Example: What Happened After It Decriminalized All Drugs, From Weed to Heroin
From the article:
Quote:
Though often narrowly assessed in reference to its decriminalization law, Portugal's experience over the last decade and a half speaks as much to its free public health system, extensive treatment programs, and the hard to quantify trickle down effects of the legislation.
The lack of socialized healthcare in the USA makes this a non-starter IMHO.
Originally Posted By: Alfred_B
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
Originally Posted By: UberArchetype
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
That's the rub right there. There isn't a solution.
That's quite the defeatist POV. Actually solving problems involves tracing them to their source, among other things. But nobody wants to admit the pharmaceutical industry is the biggest single factor poisoning our society right now - everything from peddling drugs to consumers on TV to insanely expensive cancer chemo drugs that don't work.
Opiates are just the currently obvious problem.
Show me a pharmaceutical company that makes heroin.
you have no idea how addiction works, do you?
Yes I'm 73 and I've never been an addict!
Originally Posted By: JimPghPA
Originally Posted By: UberArchetype
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
That's the rub right there. There isn't a solution.
That's quite the defeatist POV. Actually solving problems involves tracing them to their source, among other things. But nobody wants to admit the pharmaceutical industry is the biggest single factor poisoning our society right now - everything from peddling drugs to consumers on TV to insanely expensive cancer chemo drugs that don't work.
Opiates are just the currently obvious problem.
Show me a pharmaceutical company that makes heroin.
you have no idea how addiction works, do you?
Yes I'm 73 and I've never been an addict!
Originally Posted By: Rhymingmechanic
Unfortunately, he doesn't say as much about solutions. But understanding the problem and who it affects is an important place to start. The writing is also good, for those who care about such things.
Author's Website
I'll tell you the solution right here: don't just prescribe opiate right when someone complains about pain.
Yes, I broke my bone during a fall or I have a serious case of cold, and the doctor automatically just tell me he's giving me Codine. I'll have to tell him just stop it right there, I'll take Advil and put up with it for a few days.
The FDA has to change the guideline on how opiate is prescribed and doctors have to be more of a care giver than just throw meds at people to send them away.
Unfortunately, he doesn't say as much about solutions. But understanding the problem and who it affects is an important place to start. The writing is also good, for those who care about such things.
Author's Website
I'll tell you the solution right here: don't just prescribe opiate right when someone complains about pain.
Yes, I broke my bone during a fall or I have a serious case of cold, and the doctor automatically just tell me he's giving me Codine. I'll have to tell him just stop it right there, I'll take Advil and put up with it for a few days.
The FDA has to change the guideline on how opiate is prescribed and doctors have to be more of a care giver than just throw meds at people to send them away.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
The problem has the potential to solve itself with these most recent strains of Fentanyl. People in BC were dying in droves from this stuff. You eliminate the client base, the supply serves no purpose and those people will move on to something else.
Yes, they move onto other drugs.
That assumes that the client base isn't dead. If it is, there's no other drugs to move onto, that's pretty much what I was getting at.
You need active consumers of your product, IE, non-dead folk to make a successful business out of drugs. The latest strains of Fentanyl seem to work against that philosophy by killing the customers.
What percentage of drug abusers move on to become productive members of society? What's the downside of letting them overdose and die? I'm not the most compassionate person, so perhaps there's something here that is lost on me but I've watched our downtown become a ghost town, occupied by the homeless, the addicted and those that fall into both categories, many of which are nurtured by our wide array of methadone clinics, which falls into this whole opioid addiction category. It seems catering to them isn't working
It may save tax dollars, but it doesn't make those areas conducive to normal traffic anymore given the new demographic.
Granted, but you are missing a few things:
1. There is no recreational drug with a 100% distribution, usage, and mortality rate. You need all three at the same time in order for all junkies to get killed off.
2. A lot of junkies are very smart about their junk. There will be at least some significant level of people who are going to avoid the drug. As unbelievable as it sounds, there are things even a junky will turn down.
3. Power vacuum. One dealer sells poison, and others will push the "good stuff". This has been witnessed with things like bad ecstasy and bad heroin. Unless all junkies everywhere are simultaneously killed, the survivors and new entries carry on with a different kind of junk.
4. "Standing aside" means knowingly allowing a foreign power to intentionally kill our own citizens. Trashy people or not, what will that forever say about our society that we let someone mass murder our citizens as we stood by and watched? And you know as well as I do that both legally and morally, the supplier is a murderer.
If ISIS offers to blow up the junkies, should we stand by and let them walk in and do that too?
What of the fabric of society when we have taught our citizens that some people are OK to kill? Who will be next on that list? This is not theory. I've personally witnessed a death squad before in South America. They slaughter homeless children before they can become homeless men.
Once we teach a generation that human life is worthless enough to let some just get killed, we can never take that back. Our children will know that it's open season on human lives, and who will be next on the list? Homeless? Poor? Unemployed?
"Sir, he looked like a junkie to me, and it's no different than letting the dealer get him. Yes sir, I did what anyone else would do!"
Again, not theory. Just look at the Philippines.
Through time, people have always turned to "The Final Solution" to solve a "problem" in their society, and it has always lead to more and more killings. Nobody will be safe from this. Not you, not me, not your loved ones, nobody.
Originally Posted By: DoubleWasp
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
The problem has the potential to solve itself with these most recent strains of Fentanyl. People in BC were dying in droves from this stuff. You eliminate the client base, the supply serves no purpose and those people will move on to something else.
Yes, they move onto other drugs.
That assumes that the client base isn't dead. If it is, there's no other drugs to move onto, that's pretty much what I was getting at.
You need active consumers of your product, IE, non-dead folk to make a successful business out of drugs. The latest strains of Fentanyl seem to work against that philosophy by killing the customers.
What percentage of drug abusers move on to become productive members of society? What's the downside of letting them overdose and die? I'm not the most compassionate person, so perhaps there's something here that is lost on me but I've watched our downtown become a ghost town, occupied by the homeless, the addicted and those that fall into both categories, many of which are nurtured by our wide array of methadone clinics, which falls into this whole opioid addiction category. It seems catering to them isn't working
Granted, but you are missing a few things:
1. There is no recreational drug with a 100% distribution, usage, and mortality rate. You need all three at the same time in order for all junkies to get killed off.
2. A lot of junkies are very smart about their junk. There will be at least some significant level of people who are going to avoid the drug. As unbelievable as it sounds, there are things even a junky will turn down.
3. Power vacuum. One dealer sells poison, and others will push the "good stuff". This has been witnessed with things like bad ecstasy and bad heroin. Unless all junkies everywhere are simultaneously killed, the survivors and new entries carry on with a different kind of junk.
4. "Standing aside" means knowingly allowing a foreign power to intentionally kill our own citizens. Trashy people or not, what will that forever say about our society that we let someone mass murder our citizens as we stood by and watched? And you know as well as I do that both legally and morally, the supplier is a murderer.
If ISIS offers to blow up the junkies, should we stand by and let them walk in and do that too?
What of the fabric of society when we have taught our citizens that some people are OK to kill? Who will be next on that list? This is not theory. I've personally witnessed a death squad before in South America. They slaughter homeless children before they can become homeless men.
Once we teach a generation that human life is worthless enough to let some just get killed, we can never take that back. Our children will know that it's open season on human lives, and who will be next on the list? Homeless? Poor? Unemployed?
"Sir, he looked like a junkie to me, and it's no different than letting the dealer get him. Yes sir, I did what anyone else would do!"
Again, not theory. Just look at the Philippines.
Through time, people have always turned to "The Final Solution" to solve a "problem" in their society, and it has always lead to more and more killings. Nobody will be safe from this. Not you, not me, not your loved ones, nobody.
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