dnewton3
Staff member
OK - I'm going to link my UOA here. I realize this is the filter forum, and I intend to discuss filters, but rather than hover over a topic with conjecture and hypothesis, I thought it might be nice to have a real world example of data-driven discussion ...
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...;gonew=1#UNREAD
There are two OCIs of note in there:
run #1: from 220k miles to 230k miles on ST dino oil and Puro Classic filter (one 10k mile OCI and one UOA on one filter)
run #2: from 230k miles to 245k miles on ST dino oil and MC filter (separate 15k mile OCI with two UOAs on one filter)
Look at the insolubles: .4 even after 15k miles. 'Nuff said.
Look at the wear: still in statistical control after two back-to-back extende O/FCIs. Again - 'nuff said.
What is much more apparent is that air filtration probably affected my wear moreso than oil filtration. I have a Si leak I cannot seem to locate. When I changed the air filter at 230k miles, I either created a leak point, or the filter itself is suspect. I have yet to determine which is true.
You all can banter about how wonderful synthetic oil filter media is, and how premium oil filters are "better" than normal ones, but in the end, REAL WORLD DATA speaks louder than your rhetoric.
Clearly, base line filters from a decent brand name are well able to go 10-15k miles. I ran 10k miles on a Puro Classic and 15k miles on a MC filter. And both of those were on extend oil runs. One 10k mile oil/filter run and the second 15k mile oil/filter run.
- Most of you choose a filter based upon inputs; syn media this, end-cap that, leaf versus coil spring, etc. Blah, blah, blah ...
- I choose a filter based upon it's ability to affect outputs; how does it actually perform, and does the selection of different inputs actually show causation in output differential?
Those of you that think you "need" to change oil and fitlers frequently are fooling yourselves. Do it because you "want" to; that's fine by me. But you don't "need" to; data says otherwise.
I strongly encourage anyone that considers longer O/FCIs to validate their personal experience with UOAs and PCs, etc. But that is my point here ...
When I make a statement about filter longevity (be it time or mileage based) it's because I've tested the situations and make generalizations based upn facts and data, not conjecture and mythology.
If you disagree with me, that's fine. But don't YABUT me ("yeah, but ...) with silly marketing sales brochure hype or your buddies wife's sister-in-law third-hand story about how the OCOD caused her engine to explode. You want to counter my postion? BRING DATA! You think premium filtration makes a huge difference in "normal" OCIs? Then show me tangible proof, please. Because what I can PROVE is that house brand lubes and normal everyday filters are WAY more capable than nearly any BITOGer would ever give them credit for.
Bottom line: any decent filter will likely last 15k miles and easily out to three years.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...;gonew=1#UNREAD
There are two OCIs of note in there:
run #1: from 220k miles to 230k miles on ST dino oil and Puro Classic filter (one 10k mile OCI and one UOA on one filter)
run #2: from 230k miles to 245k miles on ST dino oil and MC filter (separate 15k mile OCI with two UOAs on one filter)
Look at the insolubles: .4 even after 15k miles. 'Nuff said.
Look at the wear: still in statistical control after two back-to-back extende O/FCIs. Again - 'nuff said.
What is much more apparent is that air filtration probably affected my wear moreso than oil filtration. I have a Si leak I cannot seem to locate. When I changed the air filter at 230k miles, I either created a leak point, or the filter itself is suspect. I have yet to determine which is true.
You all can banter about how wonderful synthetic oil filter media is, and how premium oil filters are "better" than normal ones, but in the end, REAL WORLD DATA speaks louder than your rhetoric.
Clearly, base line filters from a decent brand name are well able to go 10-15k miles. I ran 10k miles on a Puro Classic and 15k miles on a MC filter. And both of those were on extend oil runs. One 10k mile oil/filter run and the second 15k mile oil/filter run.
- Most of you choose a filter based upon inputs; syn media this, end-cap that, leaf versus coil spring, etc. Blah, blah, blah ...
- I choose a filter based upon it's ability to affect outputs; how does it actually perform, and does the selection of different inputs actually show causation in output differential?
Those of you that think you "need" to change oil and fitlers frequently are fooling yourselves. Do it because you "want" to; that's fine by me. But you don't "need" to; data says otherwise.
I strongly encourage anyone that considers longer O/FCIs to validate their personal experience with UOAs and PCs, etc. But that is my point here ...
When I make a statement about filter longevity (be it time or mileage based) it's because I've tested the situations and make generalizations based upn facts and data, not conjecture and mythology.
If you disagree with me, that's fine. But don't YABUT me ("yeah, but ...) with silly marketing sales brochure hype or your buddies wife's sister-in-law third-hand story about how the OCOD caused her engine to explode. You want to counter my postion? BRING DATA! You think premium filtration makes a huge difference in "normal" OCIs? Then show me tangible proof, please. Because what I can PROVE is that house brand lubes and normal everyday filters are WAY more capable than nearly any BITOGer would ever give them credit for.
Bottom line: any decent filter will likely last 15k miles and easily out to three years.
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