Good point and not to highjack Franks thread, but you are right about the silicone valve. If all my filters weren't mounted upright I'd be more concerned about it. I do wonder why all the Motorcraft filters but the FL-1A seem to have the silicone valve...
Motorcraft FL820S
- Thread starter Not the Autorx Frank
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http://www.fleetguard.com/fleet/en/products/en_prod_inn_stratapore.jsp
Have a look at the FLEETGUARD site for information on the "Stratapore" medium. The whole idea to reduce filter restrictions at cold start-up . . to avoid bypass in the first place from an otherwise unduly restrictive medium, yet retain the "contaminant capture" of same.
I'm not trying to say that the posts above lack merit in their argument. Not in the least. It was Terry's comments about an "ideal" filter flowing like a submarine screen door is what got me searching:
1] Given an extra-clean engine [with the "right" oil; by analysis];
2] coupled with an Auto-Rx (or other) maintenance dose (liquid filter "suspension");
3] and a high-flowing, extended-service synthetic filter "could be" ideal in terms of best performance.
If I have understood him correctly, avoiding bypass in the first place is an important consideration.
As to anti-drainback it would seem that correct oil chemistry (again, by analysis) hinders the "problem" of "filter wash-back" (if I have understood the above posts correctly.)
I haven't yet received the filters I've ordered, and will have a look (as well as pose the question to FLEETGUARD).
Have a look at the FLEETGUARD site for information on the "Stratapore" medium. The whole idea to reduce filter restrictions at cold start-up . . to avoid bypass in the first place from an otherwise unduly restrictive medium, yet retain the "contaminant capture" of same.
I'm not trying to say that the posts above lack merit in their argument. Not in the least. It was Terry's comments about an "ideal" filter flowing like a submarine screen door is what got me searching:
1] Given an extra-clean engine [with the "right" oil; by analysis];
2] coupled with an Auto-Rx (or other) maintenance dose (liquid filter "suspension");
3] and a high-flowing, extended-service synthetic filter "could be" ideal in terms of best performance.
If I have understood him correctly, avoiding bypass in the first place is an important consideration.
As to anti-drainback it would seem that correct oil chemistry (again, by analysis) hinders the "problem" of "filter wash-back" (if I have understood the above posts correctly.)
I haven't yet received the filters I've ordered, and will have a look (as well as pose the question to FLEETGUARD).
If you want to get a look at what the element with stratopore looks like, i cut one open and posted a couple of pics on my yahoo website.
The white element is the fleetguard. It is the same as the donaldson and looks to be the same that the ultraguard gold used before they stopped production on them. The ones I have cut open are the fl1a equivlaents in fleetguard and donaldson.
The tall filter in the first pic is a baldwin bt251 cellulose media.
http://photos.yahoo.com/dan4510
The white element is the fleetguard. It is the same as the donaldson and looks to be the same that the ultraguard gold used before they stopped production on them. The ones I have cut open are the fl1a equivlaents in fleetguard and donaldson.
The tall filter in the first pic is a baldwin bt251 cellulose media.
http://photos.yahoo.com/dan4510
To me there are two kinds of filters. Filters that remove large engine damaging abrasives and filters that remove smaller engine wearing abrasives. There are almost no large engine damaging abrasives in a good engine and millions of small engine wearing abrasives. Use the Ford filters then install a filter that cleans oil.
Ralph
Ralph
STP S2
Bosch: 3410
Mobil1: M1-210
Valucraft: V2 (don't buy these [censored] filters)
K&N: HP-2010
Bosch: 3410
Mobil1: M1-210
Valucraft: V2 (don't buy these [censored] filters)
K&N: HP-2010
Ancient thread alert...
If you can run a longer filter you should look at the Baldwin B281
B281
O.D.: 3 11/16 (93.7)
Length: 5 3/8 (136.5)
Just about 2" longer than stock.
ROD
B281
O.D.: 3 11/16 (93.7)
Length: 5 3/8 (136.5)
Just about 2" longer than stock.
ROD
Just for the record...
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
^^^^ Not a "shocker" for those that regularly read this board. IIRC at least two members (Nick R, ARCO) have previously posted pics here of the Ford OEM filter, and it's been posted here many times that Champ supplied the factory OEM filter.
And while the Motorcraft FL-820 may "technically" be "aftermarket", if one walks into a Ford dealer and asks for the FL-820S, it will be the Purolator made for Motorcraft filter that one will purchase, not the OE Champ made filter. Fwiw imo, the term 'aftermarket' means little in terms of gauging quality of the filter. But, the Champ factory filter fact is an interesting data point, if nothing else, I suppose.
And while the Motorcraft FL-820 may "technically" be "aftermarket", if one walks into a Ford dealer and asks for the FL-820S, it will be the Purolator made for Motorcraft filter that one will purchase, not the OE Champ made filter. Fwiw imo, the term 'aftermarket' means little in terms of gauging quality of the filter. But, the Champ factory filter fact is an interesting data point, if nothing else, I suppose.
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Have you seen this?
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Oil_Filter_Cutaway_Comparison.pdf
Nice link, thanks! They "forgot" to compare Motorcrafts to Purolators though hah hah.
Have you seen this?
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Oil_Filter_Cutaway_Comparison.pdf
Nice link, thanks! They "forgot" to compare Motorcrafts to Purolators though hah hah.
Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Have you seen this?
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Oil_Filter_Cutaway_Comparison.pdf
Nice link, thanks! They "forgot" to compare Motorcrafts to Purolators though hah hah.
The Bosch = P1
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Have you seen this?
http://www.ford-trucks.com/ford-manuals/Oil_Filter_Cutaway_Comparison.pdf
Nice link, thanks! They "forgot" to compare Motorcrafts to Purolators though hah hah.
The Bosch = P1
Originally Posted By: Hannibal
Just for the record...
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
Yes I knew that.
Now is the "Champ" filter in the comparison the same filter or a different one?
I wonder what Ford's reasoning is. Is it supply chain related or break in related?
Just for the record...
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
Yes I knew that.
Now is the "Champ" filter in the comparison the same filter or a different one?
I wonder what Ford's reasoning is. Is it supply chain related or break in related?
The only reasoning behind the use of Champ made filters from the factory is price. Champ must give Ford a great deal on those filters that are installed at the factory.
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Originally Posted By: Hannibal
Just for the record...
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
Yes I knew that.
Now is the "Champ" filter in the comparison the same filter or a different one?
I wonder what Ford's reasoning is. Is it supply chain related or break in related?
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Originally Posted By: Hannibal
Just for the record...
While that little PowerPoint is nice...Motorcraft themselves are technically "aftermarket." Motorcraft is not the first fit filter from the plant...shocker...Champ is. Champ is the largest first fit supplier in the industry right now.
Motorcraft does handle all of the Ford OES business though.
Yes I knew that.
Now is the "Champ" filter in the comparison the same filter or a different one?
I wonder what Ford's reasoning is. Is it supply chain related or break in related?
Has anyone ever opened the factory Champ filter?
Originally Posted By: JasonC
The only reasoning behind the use of Champ made filters from the factory is price. Champ must give Ford a great deal on those filters that are installed at the factory.
Sorry that doesn't make sense because then that great price would translate into a bigger margin on the Motorcraft product so it doesn't make sense they also retail a Purolator that makes less money for them when they could get a "great price" on a Champ and retail that instead.
I understand that once upon a time Champ used to supply the Motorcraft part.
My guess is that it is supply chain related. If I'm correct, Champion supply other parts to Ford. Ford must have consolidated the number of suppliers to the factories to simplify things, receive less shipments, and the location and set up of Champion likely gives them an advantage for JIT production.
The only reasoning behind the use of Champ made filters from the factory is price. Champ must give Ford a great deal on those filters that are installed at the factory.
Sorry that doesn't make sense because then that great price would translate into a bigger margin on the Motorcraft product so it doesn't make sense they also retail a Purolator that makes less money for them when they could get a "great price" on a Champ and retail that instead.
I understand that once upon a time Champ used to supply the Motorcraft part.
My guess is that it is supply chain related. If I'm correct, Champion supply other parts to Ford. Ford must have consolidated the number of suppliers to the factories to simplify things, receive less shipments, and the location and set up of Champion likely gives them an advantage for JIT production.
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Has anyone ever opened the factory Champ filter?
Yes Nick R, looks similar to a K&N.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2060838
And the Motorcraft link has been posted here previously in a discussion of the Wix application shown using a unique silicone combo valve on the rather than the Wix thread end bypass. It now appears that is out of date because the most recent pics/info of the NG shows a dome end bypass instead, in that application.
And yes the Bosch Prem. shown would likely be identical in interior construction to the P1.
Has anyone ever opened the factory Champ filter?
Yes Nick R, looks similar to a K&N.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2060838
And the Motorcraft link has been posted here previously in a discussion of the Wix application shown using a unique silicone combo valve on the rather than the Wix thread end bypass. It now appears that is out of date because the most recent pics/info of the NG shows a dome end bypass instead, in that application.
And yes the Bosch Prem. shown would likely be identical in interior construction to the P1.
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