Motor Oil University by AE Haas

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I just finished reading this article for the second time and it really changed the way that I think about oil. I was on the right track in some ways, but still part of the vast majority of people that don't understand how oil really functions. I don't claim to fully understand it know, but think I'm a lot closer than I was.

It appears that the difference in viscosity of motor oils at normal operating temperatures are very similar, but the difference in viscosity of motor oils at startup temperatures is significant. Startup wear is significant on engines so it only make sense to choose an oil that will minimize startup wear.

My new-to-me 2008 Honda Civic is rated for 5w-20 so it'll be an easy choice to go for synthetic 0w-20 as long as the OLM allows me to go far enough to justify the extra cost compared to a conventional 5w-20.

My 2004 Sequoia is rated for 5w30 and I'm now considering going with a 5w-20 since it will be driven a lot less now that we have the Civic. Continuing with synthetics doesn't make financial sense at this point so will likely make the same choice that AE Haas did with his SUV.

Is there anyone that has read and understood this article and still thinks that thicker oil is better? If so, I'm really interested to hear from you. What is your justification? Obviously, AE Haas gave a few specific situations where thicker can be better, but it sure sounds like thinner is better in general.
 
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
Startup wear is significant on engines so it only make sense to choose an oil that will minimize startup wear.


Please show me the evidence that oil choice has any impact on start up wear.
 
Thin as possible, thick as necessary.

It's why I try to keep my oils right around my minimum required HTHS of 3.5.
 
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
..... it'll be an easy choice to go for synthetic 0w-20 as long as the OLM allows me to go far enough to justify the extra cost compared to a conventional 5w-20.


Will the OLM alter it's recommendations if you put synthetic 0w20 in instead of conventional 5w20? I don't think so, so you'll get the same mileage "allowance" from the OLM.
 
Thick as possible, thin as necessary.
Gimmick is what he calls a thin oil is not actually thin. An advanced oil with low kV and high HTHS is not quite thin.
 
Originally Posted By: dparm
Thin as possible, thick as necessary.

It's why I try to keep my oils right around my minimum required HTHS of 3.5.

I agree. You don't want an oil that is thicker than necessary at normal operating temperature. That why oil pressure and temperature gauges are needed to track cars.
 
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
Is there anyone that has read and understood this article and still thinks that thicker oil is better


It just all depends.
 
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
I just finished reading this article for the second time and it really changed the way that I think about oil.


Got a link to the article?

Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
Obviously, AE Haas gave a few specific situations where thicker can be better, but it sure sounds like thinner is better in general.


Wear protection is all about film strength, which is somewhat dependent on viscosity ... but full synthetic oil film strength seems to be better than conventional oils even if the synthetic's viscosity is less. I always stay with the OEM's recommended viscosity ... they specified it for a reason.

http://www.lemd.com/motorsport/previous.cfm?id=21

Nice long and detailed thread from long ago.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=4353
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
I just finished reading this article for the second time and it really changed the way that I think about oil.


Got a link to the article?


You have almost 2000 posts here and you don't know where to find the article?
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
My new-to-me 2008 Honda Civic is rated for 5w-20 so it'll be an easy choice to go for synthetic 0w-20 as long as the OLM allows me to go far enough to justify the extra cost compared to a conventional 5w-20.

You'd better call your Honda dealership and make sure your engine will handle 0W-20. Not all Honda engines that are rated for 5W-20 can use 0W-20 without damage. I believe the '08 non-Hybrid Civic cannot use 0W-20 without damage.

Honda has produced what they call a "job aid" that lists the various 5W-20 engines and their compatibility with 0W-20. All dealers were sent this "job aid", whether they bother to use it or not.

If you get "huh?"-type responses from your Service Advisor, ask him to read the Honda Service News article from January 2010 (page 2). If he can't find that issue, have him call Tech Line, or check ISIS.
 
Originally Posted By: Tegger

You'd better call your Honda dealership and make sure your engine will handle 0W-20. Not all Honda engines that are rated for 5W-20 can use 0W-20 without damage. I believe the '08 non-Hybrid Civic cannot use 0W-20 without damage.



Although I know what you are referring to, I have yet to read the technician explanation of why 0w-20 will cause damage in any 5w-20 application.
 
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
I just finished reading this article for the second time and it really changed the way that I think about oil.


Got a link to the article?


You have almost 2000 posts here and you don't know where to find the article?


Maybe others that only have a few posts don't (I know were it is, and have read it). Open your mind, and don't be rude or you'll likely get another permanent vacation.
 
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
Startup wear is significant on engines so it only make sense to choose an oil that will minimize startup wear.


Please show me the evidence that oil choice has any impact on start up wear.


Sequence IV A ?
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: blackdiamond
I just finished reading this article for the second time and it really changed the way that I think about oil.


Got a link to the article?


You have almost 2000 posts here and you don't know where to find the article?


Maybe others that only have a few posts don't (I know were it is, and have read it).


If you know "were" it is, why didn't you post the link for the others you were so concerned about instead of asking someone else to do it?

LOL
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: RedCorvette

If you know "were" it is, why didn't you post the link for the others you were so concerned about instead of asking someone else to do it?

LOL


Thin ice ...
eek.gif
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek

Please show me the evidence that oil choice has any impact on start up wear.


Sequence IV A ?


If so, then Castrol Edge is the only way to go as it "provides 8X better wear protection than Mobil 1 5w30" citing the Sequence IVA test.

But seriously, I was actually thinking about ring/liner wear (where the bulk of start up wear resides) and not cam wear. My bad.
 
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