Mixing Mobil 1 Sync ATF and Amsoil ATF

[qwikz28]

Hello All-

My local parts store ran out of Amsoil ATF. I have done about 4 drain/fills with Amsoil, but will it be harmful to do a drain/fill or two with Mobil 1 Sync ATF. The car takes Honda Z1, and both are compatible. It is a Saturn Vue V6 with the Honda motor. Thanks guys.

PS- Drain/fill has to happen ASAP. I've been busy and the fluid is cooked. Shifts are sloppy and TC is shuddering. I'd like to use the Mobil 1, but will order Amsoil if I should.

 

[nfs480]

Me personally I don't like mixing ATF, but in reality you should be fine. Amsoil at least is supposed to be fully compatible with other ATFs.

 

[unDummy]

There is no harm in mixing ATFs.

Why is the fluid cooked?

You have issues if you cooked Amsoil ATF.

What are your drain/refill intervals?

 

[tig1]

No harm in mixing the two, but the oil is cooked? What has been your OCI in this transmission? Amsoil makes an outstanding product, perhaps as good as M1 ATF, so I can't see Amsoil ATF being cooked.

 

[GREENDESTINY]

I had 100% Amsoil atf in my 05 Pilot and recently did a drain and fill with the new z1 compatible M1 atf and everything feels fine. In fact the 1st to 2nd shift under load feels smoother.

 

[qwikz28]

My issue is that I drive my car pretty hard. I live in NYC and the car experiences mostly stop/go; and I have a heavy foot. It really is hard to put into words just how hard I am on the car. I use the car for towing also, but haven't in about a year.

I've done only 3 drain/fills on the car thus far, so it is not all Amsoil ATF in there. I don't plan on keeping the car long, so installing a trans cooler is not the most cost effective means. It's been a while since my last drain/fill, and the TC is shuttering and the shifts are getting pretty hard.

I ordered a case of Amsoil, but if it doesn't come in by Saturday, the car is getting the Mobil 1 for this drain/fill. I think Greendestiny eased my nerves about it. Thanks for chiming in man, and for everyone else

OCI used to be every other oil change, but I have just been so swamped with work and school that I haven't done it for about 10k miles. I'm going to go back to every other oil change after 2 drain/fills.

 

[blue94]

You could get a trans cooler for like $75 - maybe less. How would this not be cost effective? Amsoil and M1 fluid are not cheap. If you're going through it this fast, you clearly need extra cooling which is not surprising given the driving conditions. Unless you're ditching the car soon, a cooler would probably pay for itself quickly by helping the fluid last longer.

 

[unDummy]

Originally Posted By: qwikz28
My issue is that I drive my car pretty hard. I live in NYC and the car experiences mostly stop/go; and I have a heavy foot. It really is hard to put into words just how hard I am on the car. I use the car for towing also, but haven't in about a year.


Get back into your good maintenance habit to prevent issues.

Automakers somehow forgot that NYC exists when they do their vehicle testing and maintenance recommendations.

 

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted By: blue94
You could get a trans cooler for like $75 - maybe less. How would this not be cost effective? Amsoil and M1 fluid are not cheap. If you're going through it this fast, you clearly need extra cooling which is not surprising given the driving conditions. Unless you're ditching the car soon, a cooler would probably pay for itself quickly by helping the fluid last longer.


You are 100% correct. My issue is that I simply do not have the time to install it. Also, I'm not sure a cooler will be all that helpful at the slow speeds of NYC traffic. Knowing a shop will likely charge me about $300 to install one in my car (including the cost of , 2 cases of Amsoil is likely to be less costly. By then, I'll have finished school in NYC and hopefully will sell that car. Maybe you are right, and I should just order one and hope to get around it some time before winter. I don't know anymore. I will get around to doing at least two drain/fills in the upcoming month or so though.

 

[blue94]

Originally Posted By: qwikz28
Originally Posted By: blue94
You could get a trans cooler for like $75 - maybe less. How would this not be cost effective? Amsoil and M1 fluid are not cheap. If you're going through it this fast, you clearly need extra cooling which is not surprising given the driving conditions. Unless you're ditching the car soon, a cooler would probably pay for itself quickly by helping the fluid last longer.


You are 100% correct. My issue is that I simply do not have the time to install it. Also, I'm not sure a cooler will be all that helpful at the slow speeds of NYC traffic. Knowing a shop will likely charge me about $300 to install one in my car (including the cost of , 2 cases of Amsoil is likely to be less costly. By then, I'll have finished school in NYC and hopefully will sell that car. Maybe you are right, and I should just order one and hope to get around it some time before winter. I don't know anymore. I will get around to doing at least two drain/fills in the upcoming month or so though.




Well, it's up to you. They're really not that hard to install with a few basic hand tools but if you're a busy student I can understand. (You'll probably need a little extra hose too 'cause the kits never come with enough.) Having a shop do it would certainly not be cost effective. I would try to find the time to do it but that's easy for me to say. Your problems have to be cooling related. Taxis and police cars that are driven like your car have extra cooling and that's what you need. Run the cooler in series with the stock cooler coming after the stock cooler and before the fluid goes back to the pan. If you mount the cooler against the radiator for the air conditioner or in between the rad for the air conditioner and the actual rad, air will be drawn through it by the fan. You will lose some efficiency mounting it in between so just get a bigger cooler. Even if it's not right up against the rad, there's still some air being draw into the area by the fan and it will still radiate off some heat and be better than nothing. Scope out a good spot for easy installation and decent air flow. Even if it's not ideal, dropping the temp just a few degrees makes a big difference. It doesn't have to be perfect.

 

[lexus114]

I have found that mounting a trans cooler right up against the condenser for the A/C affects the cooling of the A/C out put. Probably due to the extra heat from the trans. cooler. I also discovered that giving a small space between the two,is all it needs to function properly.

 

[qwikz28]

I suppose I'll look into it. I recall a thread on a Saturn forum where a guy installed a compact cooler in line with his OEM cooler that didn't cover the Radiator or Condensor. He installed his before the OEM cooler and it sparked a debate about whether its better to install it before or after. I'm by the school that after market always goes after, but for my case, it will likely be whatever is easier. I know concerning my Camaro's power steering cooler, people have seen lower temps by simply deleting the OEM power steering cooler because it actually works to heat the fluid. We shall see though. Thanks for the input guys!

Edit: I was also thinking of doing one of these, since I cannot do a flush and there is likely quite a bit of OEM fluid still in there.
http://www.amazon.com/Wix-58964-Line-Transmission-Filter/dp/B0014BCFC0/ref=pd_sbs_auto_6

 

[unDummy]

ATF cooler efore/after is a bogus debate. BTU's lost won't change.

As long as you have one, your vehicle will benefit.

I also find it easier to shorten maintenance intervals to make up for 'factory defects'.

To pull a grille, bumper.... sometimes is a hassle when you work 50hrs a week and spend another 20hrs in a classroom....
To pay $300 to 'hope' that a shop does a quality install is a risk in itself.

The other options is to increase the sump size. If there is room for a Permcool ATF filter, you might be able to splice it in. It holds a quart and will throw off some heat too. And, 1.5-2qt oil filters are available if you have the room.

http://www.perma-cool.com/Catalog/Cat_page25.html and uses a standard PH8a/FL1a filter size or the oversized PH977a/FL299....or the shorter pint sized PH16 if room is an issue.

 

[dnewton3]

This might come off a bit harsh, and I do not mean to be offensive, but I simply cannot let this pass by.

I fail to understand how a guy that can do so many ATF changes cannot find the time/ability to install a transmission cooler.

Further, just how many ATF changes are you going through? That has GOT to be expensive using Amsoil (or any other brand of PAO, such as Mobil 1).

Perhaps I misread your posts, but I did go back just to make sure and I checked; are you saying you OCI your transmission every other engine OCI? That's nuts.

If your transmission is acting so badly that it's burning up top-end ATF such as Amsoil and Mobil 1 so quickly, then no amount of synthetic is going to put off the inevitible. As a student, just how much driving are you doing, anyway?

I simply find this hard to believe. I don't know what you're studying in school, but perhaps "Where logic and fiscal choice meet" might be the next class you want to sign up for.

 

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted By: dnewton3
This might come off a bit harsh, and I do not mean to be offensive, but I simply cannot let this pass by.

I fail to understand how a guy that can do so many ATF changes cannot find the time/ability to install a transmission cooler.

Further, just how many ATF changes are you going through? That has GOT to be expensive using Amsoil (or any other brand of PAO, such as Mobil 1).

Perhaps I misread your posts, but I did go back just to make sure and I checked; are you saying you OCI your transmission every other engine OCI? That's nuts.

If your transmission is acting so badly that it's burning up top-end ATF such as Amsoil and Mobil 1 so quickly, then no amount of synthetic is going to put off the inevitible. As a student, just how much driving are you doing, anyway?

I simply find this hard to believe. I don't know what you're studying in school, but perhaps "Where logic and fiscal choice meet" might be the next class you want to sign up for.

ha! no offense taken. I'll explain better. I'm actually in law school, and I commute to the school so I end up driving ~20k per year.

I used to do the Amsoil drain/flush every other oil change, so about every 7-8k, but only did that until I finished 3 drain/fills. After that, the car was running fine, so I never bothered to pick up another case. That is, until now, that the car is experiencing TC shudder. The shop I buy my Amsoil from stopped getting shipments of ATF, so I picked up the Mobil 1 instead, which I decided was a bad decision when I got home, and then posted up here.

Now, because I need my car to commute, I am wary about experimenting on it, UNLESS I have time to tow it to the shop if the install goes wrong. I admit, I am an awful mechanic. Since I never did one of these trans coolers before, I will assume the worst and not install it unless I have a few weekdays off. Which I never do. The trans drain/fill takes no extra time to do, because i do it while the car is getting its engine oil changed.

So to sum, I've only so far done 3 drain/fills, and have purchased 5 quarts Mobil 1, and another case of Amsoil which I just ordered online, which should last me until about next summer.

PS- logic, I have taken. where it meets with fiscal choice, definitely not!

 

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted By: unDummy
ATF cooler efore/after is a bogus debate. BTU's lost won't change.

As long as you have one, your vehicle will benefit.

I also find it easier to shorten maintenance intervals to make up for 'factory defects'.

To pull a grille, bumper.... sometimes is a hassle when you work 50hrs a week and spend another 20hrs in a classroom....
To pay $300 to 'hope' that a shop does a quality install is a risk in itself.

The other options is to increase the sump size. If there is room for a Permcool ATF filter, you might be able to splice it in. It holds a quart and will throw off some heat too. And, 1.5-2qt oil filters are available if you have the room.

http://www.perma-cool.com/Catalog/Cat_page25.html and uses a standard PH8a/FL1a filter size or the oversized PH977a/FL299....or the shorter pint sized PH16 if room is an issue.


You are spot on about letting shops work on your car. My car isn't running right now anyway because a shop just messed up my 100k tuneup consisting of Timing Belt/Water Pump/ and plugs.

That Perma-cool seems like a good idea. I hear those filters act to cool fluid as well. It is certainly a possibility. It seems like it would be much easier to install as well.

 

[bimmerdriver]

Originally Posted By: qwikz28
My issue is that I drive my car pretty hard. I live in NYC and the car experiences mostly stop/go; and I have a heavy foot. It really is hard to put into words just how hard I am on the car. I use the car for towing also, but haven't in about a year.

I've done only 3 drain/fills on the car thus far, so it is not all Amsoil ATF in there. I don't plan on keeping the car long, so installing a trans cooler is not the most cost effective means. It's been a while since my last drain/fill, and the TC is shuttering and the shifts are getting pretty hard.
By your own words, you are abusing the transmission, I would say far beyond what it was designed for. Not only do you have a lead foot, but you also use the vehicle for towing. Towing anything beyond a very light trailer is probably the quickest way to kill a transmission because of the heat that is generated. A transmission cooler would probably help, but it is only a band-aid. Cooking transmission fluid as you describe is very uncommon. If it's cooked it should be replaced, but even synthetic oil will not save your transmission. If you don't want to destroy your transmission, you need to change your driving habits.

Your mileage may vary...

 

[qwikz28]

Originally Posted By: bimmerdriver
By your own words, you are abusing the transmission, I would say far beyond what it was designed for. Not only do you have a lead foot, but you also use the vehicle for towing. Towing anything beyond a very light trailer is probably the quickest way to kill a transmission because of the heat that is generated. A transmission cooler would probably help, but it is only a band-aid. Cooking transmission fluid as you describe is very uncommon. If it's cooked it should be replaced, but even synthetic oil will not save your transmission. If you don't want to destroy your transmission, you need to change your driving habits.

Your mileage may vary...


Why? Synthetic oil is working. Fresh drain/fills successfully ceased the torque converter shudder and smoothed my shifts. Can't as for more than that. Granted, I stopped doing drain/fills and that is why my car was driving funny. The trans cooler and filter is a good idea, but we'll see.

Can't change our lives to worry about a transmission. If fresh fluid is working for now, fresh fluid is what she's gonna get.

 

[bimmerdriver]

Originally Posted By: qwikz28
Why? Synthetic oil is working. Fresh drain/fills successfully ceased the torque converter shudder and smoothed my shifts. Can't as for more than that. Granted, I stopped doing drain/fills and that is why my car was driving funny. The trans cooler and filter is a good idea, but we'll see.

Can't change our lives to worry about a transmission. If fresh fluid is working for now, fresh fluid is what she's gonna get.
Whatever you say...

 

[qwikz28]

Different strokes for different folks, bimmerdriver.

2 things:
1. I put the Mobil 1 in my car this weekend. It seemed to be much thinner than the Amsoil. I can tell this because it seemed to flow through my funnel MUCH quicker. Don't know if this is a good thing, or a bad thing, but it is. I'll likely do another drain/fill in 1500 miles, and then resume my 6000 mile schedule.

2. I looked underneath there, and there simply is nowhere to mount a trans cooler besides the radiator or condenser. That is not a possibility as the car already runs pretty hot in stop/go and I like my A/C. The filter is still a possibility though, but I am still mulling whether that will be worth it in the end. I really don't want to keep this car for anymore than another 30-40k miles, which is about how much ATF I have left for.