Learning the lesson of simpler is better

[cammyfive79]

I must admit that in my short time as an active member here I've drunk from the firehouse of knowledge here and, at times, convinced myself that my daily driver requires a 70 step process prior to an oil change and then another dozen steps every time I drive it. Exaggeration for sure, but I think I went down the rabbit hole too quickly being a bit new. After exchanging a few DMs with Dave at @High Performance Lubricants I am no longer convinced that I HAVE to have the Super Car Series oil for my 2013 Acura TL, haha. It is nice to be told by a company rep that I should save my money and even their standard Passenger Car Oil in 5W30 is way better than my or my wife's car (2021 Mazda CX-9) would need. Plus, I will be running the same HPL PCO 5W30 (Acura suggests 5W20 and I immediately switched to 5W30 when I bought it; wife's car specifies 5W30 with the 2.5T Skyactiv direct injection engine) in both so I can just buy that oil in large quantities.

None of that is to say I don't run thought experiments in my head reading some of the threads with some of you guys do the real work of analyzing oil samples, cutting open filters, and really deep diving into the pool of specs.

 

[simple_gifts]

We understand; it will pass and you will be happy with 507 rated oil in 2 decades.

 

[cammyfive79]

We understand; it will pass and you will be happy with 507 rated oil in 2 decades.

haha

 

[Ausfahrt]

It's easy to overthink sometimes.

 

[The Critic]

It's easy to overthink sometimes.

Exactly. Neither of the OP's engines are known for longevity, he's better off saving up for real repairs.

 

[PontiacHO]

Something that I’ve continually reminded myself…
The average “Joe” doesn’t give two flips about his brand/weight of oil or filter that Jiffy Lube poured/installed. His vehicle will last as long as mine anyway.

 

[cheesepuffs2]

Something that I’ve continually reminded myself…
The average “Joe” doesn’t give two flips about his brand/weight of oil or filter that Jiffy Lube poured/installed. His vehicle will last as long as mine anyway.

Exactly. This site is useful but also tends to get people into an unnecessary whirlwind. Pick a reputable oil but not at the cost of undue stress onto yourself.

 

[Legal Eagles]

Pick a reputable oil but not at the cost of undue stress onto yourself.

Agreed, any reputable oil will work so long as you change it every 3,000 miles... whether it needs it or not!

Better safe than sorry...

 

[cammyfive79]

Exactly. Neither of the OP's engines are known for longevity, he's better off saving up for real repairs.

Granted neither is a naturally aspirated 4 cylinder Honda or Toyota from 30-35 years ago but from my experience and attempting to compile owner experiences I’m fairly confident with quality fuel, oil, and filters both will get us to 100k or round about - our expected ownership cycle - without catastrophic issues. Sure, both could explode tomorrow at 9am but neither are ticking time bombs.

 

[cammyfive79]

As a car guy, I enjoy the discussion and treating our cars to high quality maintenance; it’s why I’m here to learn. My point is that I’m not going to torture myself by thinking that if I use the “standard” HPL engine oils that I’m not taking care of our cars as best as possible because I didn’t use the Supercar series or what not.

 

[The Critic]

Granted neither is a naturally aspirated 4 cylinder Honda or Toyota from 30-35 years ago but from my experience and attempting to compile owner experiences I’m fairly confident with quality fuel, oil, and filters both will get us to 100k or round about - our expected ownership cycle - without catastrophic issues. Sure, both could explode tomorrow at 9am but neither are ticking time bombs.

Depending on the year, J37 has oil consumption issues and sometimes the cylinder walls can get scored, requiring a new short block.

Mazda 2.5T has a history of cracked cylinder heads and bad valve seats, there are multiple TSB's describing those issues. Supposedly all resolved by the 2021MY, but only time will tell.

 

[The Critic]

That comment really stings, it's just nasty. It's as if someone has slammed the door right in the face of a newcomer, first time here in this online forum. It's a real downer and such a disappointing way to make people feel like they don't belong here.

Would you prefer for him to be misled? He owns two engines that do not exactly have a stellar reliability record. It may be wiser to use a less expensive oil and save the money for actual repairs since the longevity of his powertrains may be outside of his control.

 

[cammyfive79]

Would you prefer for him to be misled? He owns two engines that do not exactly have a stellar reliability record. It may be wiser to use a less expensive oil and save the money for actual repairs since the longevity of his powertrains may be outside of his control.

I certainly recognize your name from other threads I’ve started and you’ve certainly answered many questions I’ve had and are quite knowledgeable. With that preface, I certainly do agree with the previous commenter that I initially took your comment as snarky and needlessly derogatory. However, the internet doesn’t do well with me trying to mind read some typed words so I’ll assume it was meant to be candid and helpful.

While I am no means an expert on engine design but I doubt that many engines pass the “no issues/fantastic reliability” test nowadays if you ask 10 different people; a few Toyota products may qualify but even those model specific forums are mixed with users saying that Random Model Engine X is a let down and has issues 1 - 99. Heck, with the proliferation of turbo’ed direct injection 4 cylinders taking over market space a spot free track record may be memories of yesteryear.

My J37 V6 is still young enough (32k miles) that trying to get ahead of any future oil consumption issues is what brought me here; learning to ignore the Maintenance Minder; discovering HPL.

 

[mr_boring]

Many of us have been there. Chasing the magick juice that gets our cars to last as long as Mad Max's beloved Interceptor.

If you take ALL of the VAST wealth of data here and look at it with a very broad view, which is a very good way to analyze a lot of data, you'll find that most any reputable oil in a weight between 0/20 and 5/40 will run most any given vehicle (gas powered street vehicles) until it falls apart. There are, indeed, exceptions.

HPL is some top tier stuff, quite possibly the best on the market today. I say that not because I have any first hand experience with it, I don't use it, but the people that DO use it post some pretty good data.

Will it matter in the long run whether you use HPL extra good or the HPL regular good? It was good of the formulation team to give you some insight there.

As with all things, you be the judge. Most folks on these forums call it something like "peace of mind"

 

[jstert]

Perfect is the enemy of good - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[cammyfive79]

Many of us have been there. Chasing the magick juice that gets our cars to last as long as Mad Max's beloved Interceptor.

If you take ALL of the VAST wealth of data here and look at it with a very broad view, which is a very good way to analyze a lot of data, you'll find that most any reputable oil in a weight between 0/20 and 5/40 will run most any given vehicle (gas powered street vehicles) until it falls apart. There are, indeed, exceptions.

HPL is some top tier stuff, quite possibly the best on the market today. I say that not because I have any first hand experience with it, I don't use it, but the people that DO use it post some pretty good data.

Will it matter in the long run whether you use HPL extra good or the HPL regular good? It was good of the formulation team to give you some insight there.

As with all things, you be the judge. Most folks on these forums call it something like "peace of mind"

Well said. I'm thinking back to when I was a new driver in the 1990s and after watching the Saturday morning infomercials went out and bought a Tornado Air Filter, Splitfire Spark Plugs, and ZMax engine and fuel additive. LOL. Not equating HPL to any of those sham marketing exercises by any means.

Even *if* and that seems to be proven wrong by the data, HPL turns out to be "no better" than Brand X, Y, Z.....I'd probably still be a customer because of their straight forwardness and involvement here in the community.

 

[Nick814]

Well said. I'm thinking back to when I was a new driver in the 1990s and after watching the Saturday morning infomercials went out and bought a Tornado Air Filter, Splitfire Spark Plugs, and ZMax engine and fuel additive. LOL. Not equating HPL to any of those sham marketing exercises by any means.

Even *if* and that seems to be proven wrong by the data, HPL turns out to be "no better" than Brand X, Y, Z.....I'd probably still be a customer because of their straight forwardness and involvement here in the community.

Zmax got me too. Im such an IDIOT

 

[John105]

It's easy to overthink sometimes.

The internet is a dual edged sword. Imagine how self diagnosis has negated the need to go to medical school (not)

 

[dnewton3]

That comment really stings, it's just nasty. It's as if someone has slammed the door right in the face of a newcomer, first time here in this online forum. It's a real downer and such a disappointing way to make people feel like they don't belong here.

The comments from Critic are a valid and an honest assessment of where the prioritization of funds should be placed. It's not rude to tell the truth in a frank manner; it wasn't condescending by any means.

The reality is that the predominant failure modes of these two engines aren't solved by any lube, no matter how much one spends on the product.

The TL: First, some of these applications have VCM; this is known to contribute to engine issues. I'd say spending money on a defeat tool is far more important than oil selection in this regard, if the OPs car has VCM. Next, there's no assurance that the oil choice will stop the problem; it may only deter it to a later date. What concerns me, according to some info I found on this engine, is that the aluminum block also has aluminum cylinder liners (sleeves). So the hard piston rings ride continually on a softer metal surface. The linked article specifically states that even very well maintained engines with high mileage may develop oil consumption issues. I suspect this is because of the alum cylinder bores. The engine is even subject to a class-action settlement.

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The CX-9: As for this engine, no lube is going to stop heads cracking or valve seats failing. Period. Oil can't stop heads warping, cracking, porosity, etc. Nor can it stop valve seats from improper formation or material selection/application/manufacture. So this discussion is moot.

.

 

[buster]

99% of the time we're debating which Band-Aid will work best. What you find in aggregate is good engines produce good results, regardless of brand and bad engines produce not so good results, regardless of brand. That's not to say there aren't differences, but they're often exaggerated and nominal when comparing oils that meet the same specifications. You do get some differentiation under very specific and narrow operating conditions.

I have 36k useless posts and those are my observations.