It's true... additive fallout is REAL!

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Originally Posted By: danez_yoda
I thought someone did a VOA on oil that sat. I don't recall the result but tend to think it was not dramatic. Otherwise I'd have a note over my stash to shake bottles periodically or store them upside down.


IIRC Blackstone did VOAs in the not so distant past on oils dating back to API SE possibly even older. They found the oils tested were just as good as the day they were bottled. I think we tend to worry a little too much over nothing. Somewhere on this site and theirs is the article.

Edit to add: I found the article https://www.blackstone-labs.com/Newsletters/Gas-Diesel/April-1-2012.php

They tested oil even older than I thought.
 
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I have heard from an insider at a blending facility that they had problems with their Dexos oil separating. The additives they were having problems with were actually floating, so no problem for us in bottles. They had to install constant stirring devices on all their tanks with that oil.

He said something like a few days or hours to correct a failing dexo cert test or they would loose the license?

Wonder how that works in bulk tanks that shops use if additives separate readily?
 
Originally Posted By: Eddie
Years ago General Motors put out a notice to their garages. The notice stated to not store engine oil in containers larger than 15 months of oil use due to separation. I forgot the exact wording but it suggested that oil additives separated and therefor some engines might not get the full additive package if oil was dispensed from extra large containers. Ed

The large bulk containers that the dealerships use and dispense into cars is the reason I bring my own oil (well shaken) to have put in my car. Plus I don't want to play "oil roulette" with what weight and brand I'm going to get!
 
Originally Posted By: Snagglefoot
Sorry guys. These additives are miscible with oil.They don’t seperate. Go poor a sample in a glass jar. Photograph it. Check 6 months later. Let’s stop this internet nonsense.

Then what's the slime at the bottom of Pennzoil jugs?
 
Originally Posted By: cmlind
I have heard from an insider at a blending facility that they had problems with their Dexos oil separating. The additives they were having problems with were actually floating, so no problem for us in bottles. They had to install constant stirring devices on all their tanks with that oil.

He said something like a few days or hours to correct a failing dexo cert test or they would loose the license?

Wonder how that works in bulk tanks that shops use if additives separate readily?


I don't buy this third party nonsense.
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I used to shake the oil a lot before using back in the 70's & 80's.

Since I now use full synthetic oil, the amount of settling is way less.

UOA shows my additives are far less depleted then I thought!
 
Originally Posted By: hallstevenson
Originally Posted By: ZZman
Also maybe a good idea not to keep a huge stash that can sit for a long time.

Let's see if this gets any traction. If it does, a bunch of BITOGers will be in a panic, not knowing what to do with their stash of hundreds of quarts of oil. Why they think it was necessary in the first place is beyond me too.... Of course, you'll have those that say it's not true and those that say it is. Who to believe ?
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All they have to do is read the Blackstone article I linked to earlier and they won't panic anymore.
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Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I found the article https://www.blackstone-labs.com/Newsletters/Gas-Diesel/April-1-2012.php


Their shaken vs not shaken test is inconclusive. Just shipping the cans (causing movement of the oil inside the can) could have shaken them up enough to make the test inconclusive. Plus, the additive package back in 1968 isn't the same as they use today so who knows how that might change the way anything might settle out of suspension or not.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I found the article https://www.blackstone-labs.com/Newsletters/Gas-Diesel/April-1-2012.php


Their shaken vs not shaken test is inconclusive. Just shipping the cans (causing movement of the oil inside the can) could have shaken them up enough to make the test inconclusive. Plus, the additive package back in 1968 isn't the same as they use today so who knows how that might change the way anything might settle out of suspension or not.


True, and I'm still not going to lose any sleep over using oil a few years old. Their oil from 1968 was still considered good as far as they were concerned. If anything the ad packs and based stocks of today are way better. As you say if the oil got shaken enough during shipping to skew the results, imagine what shaking it with the intent of mixing it up can do. I just shake it up and pour it in, now well over 40 years of doing just that. Besides no one here is using oil from 1968 in anything they treasure, I hope.
wink.gif


FTR I've seen "fall out" it in fresh off the shelf Mobil 1, Pennzoil, Castrol, Havoline, Valvoline, etc. products over the years.
 
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If the majors weren’t so insistent on NOT using esters and/or alkylated napthalene, additive solubility would be improved, as would performance. It would cost more and their game is to make the cheapest product that meets the specs.
 
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
I know a local place near me that still has Castrol RS 10W-60, the red stuff that was said to smell great when burned, i wonder how much, if any additive fallout they must have.


I had 4 ltr jugs of that stuff from the mid 90's and was still using it in 05, no problem and I didn't loose any sleep over it. Shake the bottle and move on.
 
Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: FordCapriDriver
I know a local place near me that still has Castrol RS 10W-60, the red stuff that was said to smell great when burned, i wonder how much, if any additive fallout they must have.


I had 4 ltr jugs of that stuff from the mid 90's and was still using it in 05, no problem and I didn't loose any sleep over it. Shake the bottle and move on.


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Many years ago, "Spectro" brand motorcycle oil would always have some fine black crud (additives?) settled out at the bottom of the 1 qt bottles. Not sure about today, as I haven't used it in many years.
 
Originally Posted By: MolaKule


We don't know that anything such as overbasing is the cause here.



Where?

Look, I KNOW I've already said this, but I also know hardly anyone actually reads anything on here. Maybe its considered un-American, dunno.

That article (apart from the usual unsupported editorialising) is actually about additive "crystallising out" in an operating engine, NOT additive drop-out in storage.

So most of this discussion is actually irrelevent re-treading of old obsessions.
 
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I found the article https://www.blackstone-labs.com/Newsletters/Gas-Diesel/April-1-2012.php


Their shaken vs not shaken test is inconclusive. Just shipping the cans (causing movement of the oil inside the can) could have shaken them up enough to make the test inconclusive. Plus, the additive package back in 1968 isn't the same as they use today so who knows how that might change the way anything might settle out of suspension or not.


Centrifugation could address the shake-state variable
 
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