Honda AT very dark fluid

[McKittrick]

I would like to see if this is considered common.

I bought a used 96 honda with the 4 speed automatic for my back and forth to work car.

It had 75,000 miles on it. After I had it for a month or two I decided to change the transmission oil. The car seemed pretty good so decided it was a keeper.

Fluid was so dark that when I capture the fluid in a 0.5 liter water bottle no sunshine could penetrate the bottle. It looked as dark as cola.

I had a case of honda fluid z1. so I did the 3 changes in rapid sucession. Then at the next oil change changed out the fluid again, and it was very dark.

I read on here that z1 darkens quickly as reported by some other posters.

Since my transmission is a Dexron II transmission, I decided to run some Mobil 1 ATF multivehicle formula. Did the three rapid changes, and left it in for 10,000 miles. It was as dark as cola when captured in the 0.5 liter water bottle, again no sunlight could penetrate the fluid.

Now trying Maxlife ATF.

No problems with shifting, no slippage. I added an auxiliary cooler when the radiator went out.

The amount of magnetic grey paste on the drain plug magnet is less now than at the initial change, but I am still wondering about the dark color. The fluid does not smell burnt.

Any thoughts??

 

[benjamming]

It's actually a Dex III not Dex II transmission isn't it? Anyway, you can use any Dex III fluid as you have done.

I wouldn't worry about the color so much. Honda has stated in one of their Service News that color is not a reason to be alarmed.

Does the car really only have 75k miles? That's around 7k/year. Grandma driven to church 2x/week?

The magnetic drain plug is one key area to hone in on though.

Did you add any filtering capability when you added the aux cooler?

 

[McKittrick]

I did one of the carfax checks prior to buying it, showed no problems, and bought from the friendly local Honda dealer.

No additional filtering capacity was added with the cooler.

And what seems odd to me is the color on the dipstick when checked will still be pink, but when collected as it drains in the bottle will be very dark.

I will see how the Maxlife does. So far I have felt no changes in shift feel with either Z1, Mobil 1, or Maxlife. Owner's manual states to use DEXRON II or Honda Fluid, but based on some other posts here at BITOG for older Hondas I am trying different fluids.

Car gets about 3 mpg better than EPA highway on my commute to and from work, it is mostly highway.

I have had the car for a little over 2 years now and it has 120,000 miles.

 

[PT1]

No issue if it's dark. My daughters CRV darkens the z1 fluid more rapidly than any of our other vehicles and I drain out 1/3 every 15000 miles. Who cares if it runs fine keep changing it regularly.

 

[BuickGN]

For what it's worth, with the addition of Amsoil, inline filter, and a cooler, my fluid doesn't change color, not in the 20K miles or so that it's been running like that. Mine was very dark with the factory fill by 15K.

 

[Donald]

You say you got the car with 75K miles. Do you have a service history? If not you need to pull the pan and replace the filter (if there is one). The pan could be filled with crud on the bottom and filter half clogged.

Multiple fluid changes are fine, but need to start with a known filter and pan history.

New fluid has cleaned up crud in more than one transmission and let it be caught (and clog) the filter.

75K miles would be low to have this happen, but better to be on the safe side.

 

[The Critic]

Hondas don't have pan, and neither do they have a traditional filter. They just have a coarse screen that is essentially a "rock stopper."

 

[chrome]

Fresh ATF is by itself a fairly dark red, so it's not surprising that 10K will significantly darken it.

 

[McKittrick]

Donald

I did not have a service history, so I did the ARX on the engine, and changed the transmission fluid Used up the case of Z1 first, then a case of mobil 1 atf. Just has a drain plug on the case like The Critic said, so I cannot do a filter change.

Chrome

I did put some fresh ATF in the same size bottle and get a nice cherry red sun visible through the 0.5 liter water bottle. And after the third flush and fill it is only slightly discolored but definitely can see the sun through the bottle. But after 10,000 miles totally obscured.

 

[benjamming]

You might try half a bottle of ARX to help.

 

[06VtecV6]

I did my ATF D&F at 31,500 miles and am at 41,xxx now. The fluid was very dark and I noticed improved shoft smoothness right afterwards and still feel as if it was REAL BENEFICIAL *even after 10k miles*! I am going to do another D&F at 46-47k probably *after* I do my second oil change after the one coming up. Not sure if the filter will be done at this time or closer to 60k. If I could DIY or get minor help to do it free or close to it, I would love to get the filter out. Anyone in Houston want to help me remove a ATF filter from Accord? I would pay for your inconvenience! If not, I will just do another D&f and wait till 60k do do yet another D&F and install the new ATF filter. So goes the life of a V6 AT Accord owner.. hi ho hi ho, it's off to do a D&F I go..

 

[ARB1977]

As long as its not burnt youll be fine. I had my wifes 97 Jetta fuild changed for the first time (85K) very dirty but not burnt.

 

[Steelhead]

looking at used ATF is like looking at and deviling used motor oil, all witchcraft and mumbo jumbo. anyone read used baby diapers?

send in a used ATF sample for analysis, get a TAN for acids and a particle count for friction material buildup.
also tells you what wear metals levels are and after several tests on a rig, one has a wear trend

 

[unDummy]

Too late now. Multiple drain/refills have cleaned up the transmission.
Knowing what you had, via ATF UOA, prior to starting would've been interesting.
Pick a fluid, pick a maintenance interval, and keep on driving.

If you're unhappy with the visual condition of your fluid after 10k miles, then definitely UOA it.

A temp gauge would be worth looking into. If the average temp is high, improved cooling via ATF kit should be looked into. Aftermarket filtration(permacool/magnefine) will keep the fluid clean if UOA shows excessive particles.

Also, I hope that your intitial '3 rapid' changes included 10minute+ rides in between. Otherwise you simply sent fre$h fluid through the dipstick and out the drainplug without doing anything.

 

[McKittrick]

unDummy

my rapid changes are drain and fill, drive to work the next day, and drain and fill. Not real rapid but does get it run a bit.

Steelhead, I have seen a few diapers, and normally did not want to read them

 

[dorkiedoode]

to flush transmission, can we use cheap transmission fluid for d&r before we put in the fluid of our liking.

 

[benjamming]

The thing with using a "cheap" fluid for d&r multiple times is that you will have quite a lot of "cheap" fluid left in there with a little bit of "better" fluid. It doesn't compute for me. Just use the fluid of your liking from the beginning and do d&r.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: benjamming
The thing with using a "cheap" fluid for d&r multiple times is that you will have quite a lot of "cheap" fluid left in there with a little bit of "better" fluid. It doesn't compute for me. Just use the fluid of your liking from the beginning and do d&r.


Truth. It certain does not apply to the average BITOGer AT with 10-20K drain and replace plans. But....if the current fluid of a newly acquired car is really nasty and you are just as thorough at flushing out the cheapie fluid with the good juice this plan of attack has it's place. It's better to have a little clean low cost fluid mixed in with the good stuff vs. some nasty old stuff mixed in with the good stuff.

 

[dorkiedoode]

thanks for the info. actually i was planning to use my 3 bottles of left over Z-1 then maxlife to finish off the flush and then put in amsoil.

 

[harry j]

I purchased a 1996 Accord two months ago. I was horrified to see the condition of the transmission fluid as it was draining out. It smelled like a sewer and looked worse. After 5 changes with Amsoil (3 qts per change) It now runs cherry red. I am still getting a fair amount of metalic paste on the neodymium drain plug, probably the gunk that is being flushed out. The transmission shifted well and didn't slip with the slime that was originally in it. It has smoothened out noticeably with the Amsoil