Jack, great pics of the 1942 engine!
thanks
thanks
Harley Syn3 or Amsoil
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KB -
As to the other oil(s) that you mentioned, I haven't tried them. As to blistering engines, I don't. RPM's do not hurt. It's the manner in which you attain them. I built a bike, back in the mid to late 70's, to run on the Bonneville Salt Flats. Built it to the same close tolerances that I build street engines. Never ran on the Flats. Went out there as a spectator in '88. What an experience. Anyway, my plan was to get some runtime on the engine, in a street machine. Then, when I felt that I had enough break-in to open it up, I would put the engine back in the speed chassis, and make plans for the run. I still have the engine, transmission, and frame. The other components are long gone. My point is that I have found that Amsoil suits all the needs that I can find, to preserve the old machines that I put back on the road. And, can take care of all the lubrication issues that will likely ever come up. I build mostly for others. I drop-ship the first oil change to the owners, and leave it up to them to continue the use of it.
As a side note. I am planning a Flathead 45 project, mated to a Big Twin 4-speed. Will need to build a custom frame to put them together. Don't know when it will all transpire, but I have all the necessary drive components on hand. Just need to do some fabrication. Then, a trip to Maxton, NC, to work out the bugs. And, on to the Flats. No great speed achievement with this one. That can be done with any of the modern street choppers, or road rockets. Just building with old technology, and achieving an old speed goal that the speed nuts of old tried to reach. But, this time, I'm tending toward letting a younger/lighter fellow do the driving. Here's a pic of the first engine:
www.terra-glide.net/images/Bonneville4.JPG
I keep it tucked under a shelf of other vintage goodies, these days.
Jack
As to the other oil(s) that you mentioned, I haven't tried them. As to blistering engines, I don't. RPM's do not hurt. It's the manner in which you attain them. I built a bike, back in the mid to late 70's, to run on the Bonneville Salt Flats. Built it to the same close tolerances that I build street engines. Never ran on the Flats. Went out there as a spectator in '88. What an experience. Anyway, my plan was to get some runtime on the engine, in a street machine. Then, when I felt that I had enough break-in to open it up, I would put the engine back in the speed chassis, and make plans for the run. I still have the engine, transmission, and frame. The other components are long gone. My point is that I have found that Amsoil suits all the needs that I can find, to preserve the old machines that I put back on the road. And, can take care of all the lubrication issues that will likely ever come up. I build mostly for others. I drop-ship the first oil change to the owners, and leave it up to them to continue the use of it.
As a side note. I am planning a Flathead 45 project, mated to a Big Twin 4-speed. Will need to build a custom frame to put them together. Don't know when it will all transpire, but I have all the necessary drive components on hand. Just need to do some fabrication. Then, a trip to Maxton, NC, to work out the bugs. And, on to the Flats. No great speed achievement with this one. That can be done with any of the modern street choppers, or road rockets. Just building with old technology, and achieving an old speed goal that the speed nuts of old tried to reach. But, this time, I'm tending toward letting a younger/lighter fellow do the driving. Here's a pic of the first engine:
www.terra-glide.net/images/Bonneville4.JPG
I keep it tucked under a shelf of other vintage goodies, these days.
Jack
Thanks, Steve -
To me, the old machines run just as good as any of the new ones. Just requires a bit of owner TLC to keep them happy. Never an inconvenience. Just an act of love. I just posted a link to another engine, that was very new for the time that I built it. It had all the latest in technology for speed. But now, it falls into the ranks of all the other vintage stuff that people crave. Also, it you like the 42 engine, you'll like the 45" racer that I plan for the future. Again, nothing fast, by today's standards. But, achieving the same speed goal, that people were after in it's time.
Jack
To me, the old machines run just as good as any of the new ones. Just requires a bit of owner TLC to keep them happy. Never an inconvenience. Just an act of love. I just posted a link to another engine, that was very new for the time that I built it. It had all the latest in technology for speed. But now, it falls into the ranks of all the other vintage stuff that people crave. Also, it you like the 42 engine, you'll like the 45" racer that I plan for the future. Again, nothing fast, by today's standards. But, achieving the same speed goal, that people were after in it's time.
Jack
>Then I called one of my friends who is anengineer >for the main HD engine component supplier and he >checked with this test R&D group and they said use >Syn3 or any of the other Vtwin rated synthetics
Did your friend admit HD Syn3 is not really a syn
oil but a hydocracked blend ?
Did your friend admit HD Syn3 is not really a syn
oil but a hydocracked blend ?
Yes, he said the real issue was OCI never over 5000 but recommended 3000-4000 tops. He also said that in the analysis he would only use Mobil1Vtwin or Syn3 in the engine & primary and Redline Shockproof Heavy or Mobil1 75w90 synthetic gear lube in the trans. I chose the SYn3 & Redline combination. He said to make sure that any oil used in the primary has zero moly which will cause clutch issues and that Mobil1Vtwin & Syn3 had none and both were excellent for engine and primary. BTW, the Redline is excellent and the trans shifts very quietly & smoothly. I am very pleased with this combination.
Ive run both, and I liked the amsoil better. As for break-in I dont have the patiance to do that. Id love to but I ended up doing 75-80 mph on I-95 trying not to get run over.
Interesting ideas on break-in.
I've built a number of older Japanese motors, and used both "book" break-in and MotoMan's braek-in, and my experience has been that breaking in a motor hard and fast increases compression and reduces blow-by. This is confirmed by teardowns of a number of these engines at varying points after the rebuilds.
http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/future_horsepower.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/the_factory_superbike.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/the_need_for_speed.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/circular_logic.htm
I've built a number of older Japanese motors, and used both "book" break-in and MotoMan's braek-in, and my experience has been that breaking in a motor hard and fast increases compression and reduces blow-by. This is confirmed by teardowns of a number of these engines at varying points after the rebuilds.
http://mototuneusa.com/break_in_secrets.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/future_horsepower.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/the_factory_superbike.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/the_need_for_speed.htm
http://mototuneusa.com/circular_logic.htm
I have read these as well and that seems to be one guys opinion and all my "techie" friends pretty much agree that more than just rings get broken in on a new motor and running a green motor hard is not good all those other things like bearings, valvetrain etc. Plus, I don't have the courage to go take my brand new $16,000 motorcycle out and run the **** out of it when all the dealer wrenches tell me not to just because some greasy looking guy is making a point on his website. Just not enough real concrete evidence for me. I have broken in many new engines and if you plan to keep them long term, a careful break-in is real east to do and very inexpensive insurance for a good experience IMHO.
Like my buddy said..."Is Motoman gonna rebuild your blown motor for you?"
You have a Harley, that sounds like your problem. I've owned many a Japanese motorcycle and broken them in hard. I'm getting 110 rwhp when others are getting about 104-105. Also I ride probably 4-5x as many miles as the average Hardley rider, er should I say biker. If your blowing any modern engine it sounds like you should considering buying something else.
I remember John Britten would rev the h*** out of an engine right after he started it. He basically said that if it's not stout enough to stand up to that then it's basically worthless. It's my understanding the H-D's have huge design flaws. I just think it's stupid that you have to watch every little thing and baby a $16,000 motorcycle. For that money it should be tough as nails. Also I'd rather be riding than doing contant maintenence, but for people who ride for 1 hour and polish chrome for 3 it fits, I suppose.
I did Motoman break-in on the ZX-10R. Runs great a 10,000 miles.
I grew up in a motorcycle family and have ridden everything there is. My brother still has an old 1976 FXE. I'll admit that when I ride it a lot of people check it out. Unfortunatly more guys than girls. I also know many a Harley guy that won't own anything post evolution. They call it a poseur mobile. Which may be partly true. Harley meant some different in the 60's and 70's than it does now. FWIW, I've had plently of chicks no matter what I've ridden, why not have both ?? I ws simply pointing out there's better engine designs that not only make more hp but are easier to maintain. Also most argue that if you don't like Harleys you just can't afford them and are jealous, well I have plenty of toys all paid in full.
Ninja: Well maybe you are right about the 60' and 70's thing but I doubt you were around then. Plus there are a lot of guys out there who still like a rotary dial phone but most of them are referring to the 1860's and 70's and are busy fillin their depends right now. SO, now that we have strayed off topic all the way
I just gotta tell ya that if you are going to call everybody who rides a post evo Harley a poser the #1 learn to spell it correctly and #2 there are millions of us posers out there. So tell me: when did you get your first Kawasaki tatoo?.
Starting in 1975, I've owned, in order: Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, BMW, BMW, BMW, Harley, Harley, Harley, Kawasaki. Loved them all for what they were. Well, I didn't love the Yamaha, it broke down on me...just an electrical problem, but, one that I couldn't fix. I rode one of the Harleys from South to North, across Canada, and back home. Really liked it. But, my current Kawasaki is a better highway bike...bigger, more powerful, and more stable than my Road King...at half the price. THAT opinion doesn't take ANYTHING away from people that love Harley, nor does it grant any special place in my heart for people that have a Kawasaki like mine.
Motorcyclists have enough to worry about with dodging road hazards and people in cages, we don't need to argue among ourselves so much. Harley has benefitted from the Japanese reliability competition, the Japanese have benefitted from the Harley style. Each are better because of the competition from the other.
BTW, I broke all of them in the Hard but Sane method. Never had a mechanical issue that stranded me, only an electrical one.
Motorcyclists have enough to worry about with dodging road hazards and people in cages, we don't need to argue among ourselves so much. Harley has benefitted from the Japanese reliability competition, the Japanese have benefitted from the Harley style. Each are better because of the competition from the other.
BTW, I broke all of them in the Hard but Sane method. Never had a mechanical issue that stranded me, only an electrical one.
Titan: I hear you! I really loved my Yamahas and they were 100% reliable but not for cruising. Talk about iron butt OUCH! My Harley is a better cruiser and that's most of the riding I do. That said...if I have problems with this bike it's bye bye Harley and hello metric because I'm also into reliability more than brand name loyalty. But you'll never catch me on a crotch rocket. Most likely a Vegas or Boulevard. But this Harley seems to be put together well. Now will the moderator please lock this thread because we are way way off topic. Thanks!
Well actually it was pretty nice discussing that. Most Harley guys I talk to are Kool-Aid drinkers so it's good to hear someone that can see both sides of the issue and understand why someone rides something different than they do.
Back on topic...
FWIW I don't think you can go wrong with Amsoil. Out of everyone here I can't remember ever hearing a bad word about it. And I'll agree that the 1st 100 miles the oil looks horrible, it looks like glitter.
Back on topic...
FWIW I don't think you can go wrong with Amsoil. Out of everyone here I can't remember ever hearing a bad word about it. And I'll agree that the 1st 100 miles the oil looks horrible, it looks like glitter.
Ninjaracer, Its not right to bash harleys or the people who ride them when you own everything kawasaki makes. You must like Kaw the same as
I do harley but that somehow makes me a poser? Im 25 and ride an Electraglide grandpa bike because its what I like. As for KBFXDLI's comment on motoman fixing a blown engine on a $16,000 bike, no he won't but I work for harley and we will.
Remimber the two year warrenty you got.
I do harley but that somehow makes me a poser? Im 25 and ride an Electraglide grandpa bike because its what I like. As for KBFXDLI's comment on motoman fixing a blown engine on a $16,000 bike, no he won't but I work for harley and we will.
Remimber the two year warrenty you got.
I know but my new TC88 is running so well that I think it would be a sin to have to tear it apart. I am taking the advice from Jack Hester to run it in break in mode with frequent oil changes until 2500. I switched to synthetics at 100 then I'll change at 500, 1000 and 2500 miles then I'm done. Small price to pay. I don't baby the engine but not beating it either ( nothing over 3500 rpm like the book says). This engine starts perfectly and runs quiet & smooth. I am very impressed. My Sportster was definitely rougher running.
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