Disturbing trends in education ...

[Astro14]

Public school teachers taught, motovated and recognized me far more than anyone else in my life.
Public school saved my life.

My three kids were all very well served by public schools. You and I have PM’d about their academic trajectories.

But, I think it’s important to recognize that I chose the town in which we lived for its schools.

A great high school attracts good teachers, and attracts parents who care about their children’s education, and it becomes a positive feedback loop. This was the case for my children.

Sadly, the converse is true, where poor high schools lose good teachers, and parents that care pull their children out, and as a result, many public schools are caught in a negative feedback loop. This is, unfortunately, the case for many children.

The town in which I live now, Virginia Beach, spends about a billion dollars a year on education. It’s a lot of money. The schools are good, some are better than others, and the student body is quite diverse. About 70,000 students. About 5,000 teachers. But a shocking number of very highly paid administrators.

While the district as a whole does a good job, the overhead is expensive, and frankly, wasteful. Now that we hit a Billion, for one city, voters are starting to pay attention. Among them, me. I’ve been to school board meetings, have a friend on the board, and support particular candidates for the school board.

I’m a fan of public schools. I’m not a fan of the fraud, waste, and abuse of the taxpayer, that happens in the top layer of public school administration.

 

[bunnspecial]

That may explain the unprecedented failure rate in nursing license exams in Quebec. The licensing body decided to hold the line on what constitutes a pass in spite of an ongoing nursing shortage.

Even at my school, as desperate as we are for enrollment numbers, they've held the line and have not adjusted the pass cut-off.

I'll be interested to see how this current class plays out in two years when they take the licensing exam. One thing that our school does brag about is a near 100% pass rate on licensing, and I think that's because, even though we're "only" a community college and do have open admission just to enroll in the college, nursing is still selective about acceptance into the program.

I didn't mention this in the post you quoted, but when I found out about the low pass rate on the entrance exam, I mentioned it to my wife, who is a nurse. She didn't take that particular entrance exam-her nursing school waived the requirement because she already had a BS(in education). We looked up practice questions for the exam and honestly I think I could walk in, take it, and pass without really even trying. The math was at best at a middle school level, and it permits using a calculator. As she was reading off practice questions while we were eating dinner, I was able to get most of the math correct in my head just by looking at the multiple choice options and picking the one that made the most sense.

 

[Nmr1981]

My wife and I are both public school teachers in NJ, she teaches 1st and I teach High School social studies.

This year has been incredibly challenging with student effort, attention, and parent involvement. In the high school setting students are crippled by their addiction to technology. Cellphones are constantly out and when that’s addressed they jump on their school issued Chromebooks it’s like playing whack a mole.

Students are still suffering from the pandemic hangover from 2 years ago, where relaxed deadlines and loosened standards reigned supreme. I assign work and students will simply procrastinate and miss the due date and happily take the late penalty. It blows my mind.

Lastly parental involvement especially in the younger grades is seriously lacking. My wife sends home a weekly newsletter of events, hw, etc. and students come in unprepared, dressed in slippers, test not signed etc…In this instance you can’t blame a 1st grader for this. If parents can’t take the time to review their children’s folder/newsletter, make sure they are dressed appropriately and have everything they need I bet they aren’t reading to their kids at night either which is one of the most important things you can do to develop a lifelong learner.

Last thing before I end my rant, my son just completed 1st grade (room right next to my wife’s classroom) he loves reading and learning but we have read at least one book to him everyday of his life before bed. Now he reads at a high 3rd grade level and his math scores are in the 98 percentile (didn’t get that from me). He reads a book to me now and I read one to him before bed. It’s more about involvement and fostering learning at least in the younger grades.

in the upper grades next September I will focus on breaking down old habits and getting back to basics and engaging students. In education the pendulum swings and I feel like all this pushing for technology is a step backward. It’s a good to a certain extent but it isn’t a cure all. Thanks for letting me vent.

 

[ET16]

My wife and I are both public school teachers in NJ, she teaches 1st and I teach High School social studies.

This year has been incredibly challenging with student effort, attention, and parent involvement. In the high school setting students are crippled by their addiction to technology. Cellphones are constantly out and when that’s addressed they jump on their school issued Chromebooks it’s like playing whack a mole.

Students are still suffering from the pandemic hangover from 2 years ago, where relaxed deadlines and loosened standards reigned supreme. I assign work and students will simply procrastinate and miss the due date and happily take the late penalty. It blows my mind.

Lastly parental involvement especially in the younger grades is seriously lacking. My wife sends home a weekly newsletter of events, hw, etc. and students come in unprepared, dressed in slippers, test not signed etc…In this instance you can’t blame a 1st grader for this. If parents can’t take the time to review their children’s folder/newsletter, make sure they are dressed appropriately and have everything they need I bet they aren’t reading to their kids at night either which is one of the most important things you can do to develop a lifelong learner.

Last thing before I end my rant, my son just completed 1st grade (room right next to my wife’s classroom) he loves reading and learning but we have read at least one book to him everyday of his life before bed. Now he reads at a high 3rd grade level and his math scores are in the 98 percentile (didn’t get that from me). He reads a book to me now and I read one to him before bed. It’s more about involvement and fostering learning at least in the younger grades.

in the upper grades next September I will focus on breaking down old habits and getting back to basics and engaging students. In education the pendulum swings and I feel like all this pushing for technology is a step backward. It’s a good to a certain extent but it isn’t a cure all. Thanks for letting me vent.

Thanks for sharing this!

 

[PimTac]

@AutoMechanic you speak of a common Mathematics learning experience. We are all geared a little differently. I smoked Math most of my life but hated Geometry. Still do. Ha! My belief is, we all learn differently. I am 100% convinced you could master those subjects if they were approached appropriately. I tutored Math to a few struggling younger students many years ago. Like anything else, it takes what it takes. Seeing that light go on was an incredible reward!

I'll tell you another thing; 99% of what I used in business was Arithmetic. Throw in a little Statistics and that's about it. That was my journey; your's will be different. You use Math every day. Every stinkin' day! Embrace that stuff!

I didn’t know there was a difference between arithmetic and mathematics.

 

[John105]

Has the cost of everything increased exponentially- or has the buying power of the USD changed? If one is buying products/ services with precious metals, the cost of things have not gone up in many aspects.

Imagine if a person were to buy pork chops. They have been $1.99/lb for maybe 3 years. But we make choices, we don't generally want them. Chuck steak, on the other hand, was $0.69/lb when I was in college, and easily $6/lb+ today.

My buddy "house sat" (I said wth is that it's 2022 [last year]) and was told help himself to anything in the fridge. $28/lb. steaks from Publix--that told me his friend and friend's wife didn't pay attention during HS economics. To buy choice steaks for $28/lb. tells me they do not understand the concept of marginal cost. And HS maybe is not responsible for making sure of that, I get it.

True story--my buddy bbq'd all those expensive steaks. The next time he house sat, same offer, only seemed they made sure the expensive stuff was not in the fridge.

 

[John105]

I didn’t know there was a difference between arithmetic and mathematics.

imagine if real life were as happy and wonderful as a Sam Cooke tune...don't know much about algebra, don't know what a slide rule is for....

 

[John105]

My wife and I are both public school teachers in NJ, she teaches 1st and I teach High School social studies.

This year has been incredibly challenging with student effort, attention, and parent involvement. In the high school setting students are crippled by their addiction to technology. Cellphones are constantly out and when that’s addressed they jump on their school issued Chromebooks it’s like playing whack a mole.

Students are still suffering from the pandemic hangover from 2 years ago, where relaxed deadlines and loosened standards reigned supreme. I assign work and students will simply procrastinate and miss the due date and happily take the late penalty. It blows my mind.

Lastly parental involvement especially in the younger grades is seriously lacking. My wife sends home a weekly newsletter of events, hw, etc. and students come in unprepared, dressed in slippers, test not signed etc…In this instance you can’t blame a 1st grader for this. If parents can’t take the time to review their children’s folder/newsletter, make sure they are dressed appropriately and have everything they need I bet they aren’t reading to their kids at night either which is one of the most important things you can do to develop a lifelong learner.

Last thing before I end my rant, my son just completed 1st grade (room right next to my wife’s classroom) he loves reading and learning but we have read at least one book to him everyday of his life before bed. Now he reads at a high 3rd grade level and his math scores are in the 98 percentile (didn’t get that from me). He reads a book to me now and I read one to him before bed. It’s more about involvement and fostering learning at least in the younger grades.

in the upper grades next September I will focus on breaking down old habits and getting back to basics and engaging students. In education the pendulum swings and I feel like all this pushing for technology is a step backward. It’s a good to a certain extent but it isn’t a cure all. Thanks for letting me vent.

My son completed third grade and I admit my wife is more involved (being at a different elementary school) than I am. And 3rd grade is where I'm told the average parent has difficulty helping kids with math. I tried to explain the concept of LCD to my son and he was lost. I contacted his math teacher and she said oh, they don't know that yet, that wasn't the point of the exercise (compare 10/9, 9/10, and 1).

I'm not so sure that chromebooks are the way for them to learn, but again I get it, we have tech so why not use it.

Times seem to have greatly changed. We were sent a video of the entire class cheering for my son, I don't remember that in my elementary school. In fact, I got beat up, and the other parents encouraged it. This stopped in 7th grade--so it makes me wonder, are kids so different today, or, is something suppressed and it comes out another way (social media etc.).

 

[Nmr1981]

My son completed third grade and I admit my wife is more involved (being at a different elementary school) than I am. And 3rd grade is where I'm told the average parent has difficulty helping kids with math. I tried to explain the concept of LCD to my son and he was lost. I contacted his math teacher and she said oh, they don't know that yet, that wasn't the point of the exercise (compare 10/9, 9/10, and 1).

I'm not so sure that chromebooks are the way for them to learn, but again I get it, we have tech so why not use it.

Times seem to have greatly changed. We were sent a video of the entire class cheering for my son, I don't remember that in my elementary school. In fact, I got beat up, and the other parents encouraged it. This stopped in 7th grade--so it makes me wonder, are kids so different today, or, is something suppressed and it comes out another way (social media etc.).

I agree with your statement about kids not being that much different to an extent,and the kids just exhibiting behaviors through technological means. I will say however we are seeing more disturbing things as teachers with the technology. It is more insidious and relentless. This is a big change since I started 18 years ago.

 

[Vil_Riker]

The educators get no respect that's why they are leaving the field. More and more of the burden of raising a child is being put on their shoulders. The teachers try hard because they are in it for having a positive impact but selflessness eventually results in a burnout.

So they leave the field.

 

[Astro14]

My wife and I are both public school teachers in NJ, she teaches 1st and I teach High School social studies.

This year has been incredibly challenging with student effort, attention, and parent involvement. In the high school setting students are crippled by their addiction to technology. Cellphones are constantly out and when that’s addressed they jump on their school issued Chromebooks it’s like playing whack a mole.

Students are still suffering from the pandemic hangover from 2 years ago, where relaxed deadlines and loosened standards reigned supreme. I assign work and students will simply procrastinate and miss the due date and happily take the late penalty. It blows my mind.

Lastly parental involvement especially in the younger grades is seriously lacking. My wife sends home a weekly newsletter of events, hw, etc. and students come in unprepared, dressed in slippers, test not signed etc…In this instance you can’t blame a 1st grader for this. If parents can’t take the time to review their children’s folder/newsletter, make sure they are dressed appropriately and have everything they need I bet they aren’t reading to their kids at night either which is one of the most important things you can do to develop a lifelong learner.

Last thing before I end my rant, my son just completed 1st grade (room right next to my wife’s classroom) he loves reading and learning but we have read at least one book to him everyday of his life before bed. Now he reads at a high 3rd grade level and his math scores are in the 98 percentile (didn’t get that from me). He reads a book to me now and I read one to him before bed. It’s more about involvement and fostering learning at least in the younger grades.

in the upper grades next September I will focus on breaking down old habits and getting back to basics and engaging students. In education the pendulum swings and I feel like all this pushing for technology is a step backward. It’s a good to a certain extent but it isn’t a cure all. Thanks for letting me vent.

You are the kind of teacher that makes a difference.

The kind of teacher that made a difference with my kids, and helped them reach their potential.

The kind of teacher I valued when I was a student, and the kind I value as a parent.

Thank you for what you do.

 

[John105]

You are the kind of teacher that makes a difference.

The kind of teacher that made a difference with my kids, and helped them reach their potential.

The kind of teacher I valued when I was a student, and the kind I value as a parent.

Thank you for what you do.

I think the notion of making a difference hits the nail on the head.

I mentioned it on another thread and wonder if it comes across wrongly....my wife gets so many gift cards left and right, from students' parents. And I said hey my job I think is important, I could only wish to get that type of recognition myself. One parent gave her a certificate for $50 to their nail salon, and when she used it she gave another $20 off. I said you better check if that's ok.

My point is under the right circumstances, teachers love their jobs and in that case they're not necessarily focused on pay, but rather the kids. For context, my wife works in an elementary school. I'm guessing middle and high school is totally different....

 

[John105]

My three kids were all very well served by public schools.

Me too--I graduated from a small class of 400. Just to add color, 7 of our top students went to Williams College. Then, and now, I think that's disproportionate from such a small class.

I had no need to take the SATs more than 1X, thanks to my public school education.

At any rate, I went to college for engineering. When I got there frosh year, I met a ton of kids from Brooklyn Tech, some from Bronx Science. I got a real lesson in what happens when kids come from an elite public HS and are hard workers. My first exam I scored a 29/100, which was good for a C. Suddenly, the kid from the class of 400 got introduced to a real world pecking order....

 

[Astro14]

Me too--I graduated from a small class of 400. Just to add color, 7 of our top students went to Williams College. Then, and now, I think that's disproportionate from such a small class.

I had no need to take the SATs more than 1X, thanks to my public school education.

At any rate, I went to college for engineering. When I got there frosh year, I met a ton of kids from Brooklyn Tech, some from Bronx Science. I got a real lesson in what happens when kids come from an elite public HS and are hard workers. My first exam I scored a 29/100, which was good for a C. Suddenly, the kid from the class of 400 got introduced to a real world pecking order....

Sounds like a great high school.

Clearly, those kids did well in High School. Williams is…well…the best!

The best small liberal arts school in the country. I might be biased in my opinion on that score, but college rankings agree with me...

For those of you unfamiliar: https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-liberal-arts-colleges

For over forty years of those rankings, Williams has been in the no.1 spot, much to the dismay of arch-rival, Amherst...

 

[John105]

Sounds like a great high school.

Clearly, those kids did well in High School. Williams is…well…the best!

The best small liberal arts school in the country. I might be biased in my opinion on that score, but college rankings agree with me...

For those of you unfamiliar: https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-liberal-arts-colleges

For over forty years of those rankings, Williams has been in the no.1 spot.

Yes, I think Swarthmore would be up there, but nobody from my HS went there. And oddly, only 1 to Harvard and 2 to Yale. But 7 to Williams. We sent a ton to PENN but back then, it had a 39% acceptance if you can believe that.

I do realize that educators are not fixated upon a number or rank, but I figure we need something to go by.

Bronx HS is 41, and Brooklyn Tech is 46.

My public school where I graduated is in the low 500s today.

Our HS where I live now is in the low 700's.

Without researching I think there is a public school in Alexandria VA which may be way up in the rankings (I always mix up Alexandria and Arlington, so sorry if I got it wrong and to those in VA!)

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/new-york/districts/new-york-city-public-schools/bronx-high-school-of-science-13207

https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/new-york/districts/new-york-city-public-schools/brooklyn-technical-high-school-13269

p.s. I followed the link and Williams has a 9% acceptance, actually higher than I thought....my wife's aunt's husband works for New Trier HS in IL, and he said it's very unpredictable with college admissions. They obviously have a lot of kids applying to Northwestern each year, and some get in that one would not think they would, and the opposite he says...

 

[SC Maintenance]

I didn’t know there was a difference between arithmetic and mathematics.

Arithmetic is a subset of mathematics.

 

[John105]

Arithmetic is a subset of mathematics.

I once asked my dad, you have a masters in math, so why haven't you discovered some unusual and exciting and amazing new number? He replied my degree is in applied math, not theory.....

 

[John105]

The educators get no respect that's why they are leaving the field. More and more of the burden of raising a child is being put on their shoulders. The teachers try hard because they are in it for having a positive impact but selflessness eventually results in a burnout.

So they leave the field.

That is a shame. I clearly remember liking and admiring at least 3 of my HS teachers....I felt like they really wanted us to succeed (I actually think I did not go as far as they may have thought I would, back then hahahahahahahaha)

 

[LDB]

My mother completed 8th grade. Then she worked to help the family. It was the '30's and the depression. She had a couple of serious jobs, one in charge of payroll for the Shamrock Hilton Hotel and one as assistant administrator of Houston Osteopathic Hospital and eventually married my dad, a doctor, at 31. The IRS typically audits doctors every 6 years on average, or at least did back then. My mom did all his accounting with her 8th grade education. The day comes and my dad gets an audit letter. My mom takes everything the letter required plus a bit more and goes to the audit which the letter says will take 2 days provided they don't find anything to prolong it. She gets home just before lunch. My dad and I (he was on 3-9 that week, his partner doing 9-3) were surprised she got to come home for lunch. She told us she was finished. We asked how. She said the auditor told her she had the most complete and best organized records he'd ever seen and she should go home so he could get on to someone he might find something on. In 39 more years of practicing medicine, with an every 6 years audit average, my dad got called for another zero audits. I don't know, but I firmly believe, that auditor flagged his file saying if Mrs. B has signed as preparer do not issue an audit under any circumstances. All on an 8th grade education. But she went to school when they taught, not indoctrinated. We need to go back to that and make something of our students again.

 

[GSCJR]

My wife and I are both public school teachers in NJ, she teaches 1st and I teach High School social studies.

This year has been incredibly challenging with student effort, attention, and parent involvement. In the high school setting students are crippled by their addiction to technology. Cellphones are constantly out and when that’s addressed they jump on their school issued Chromebooks it’s like playing whack a mole.

Students are still suffering from the pandemic hangover from 2 years ago, where relaxed deadlines and loosened standards reigned supreme. I assign work and students will simply procrastinate and miss the due date and happily take the late penalty. It blows my mind.

Lastly parental involvement especially in the younger grades is seriously lacking. My wife sends home a weekly newsletter of events, hw, etc. and students come in unprepared, dressed in slippers, test not signed etc…In this instance you can’t blame a 1st grader for this. If parents can’t take the time to review their children’s folder/newsletter, make sure they are dressed appropriately and have everything they need I bet they aren’t reading to their kids at night either which is one of the most important things you can do to develop a lifelong learner.

Last thing before I end my rant, my son just completed 1st grade (room right next to my wife’s classroom) he loves reading and learning but we have read at least one book to him everyday of his life before bed. Now he reads at a high 3rd grade level and his math scores are in the 98 percentile (didn’t get that from me). He reads a book to me now and I read one to him before bed. It’s more about involvement and fostering learning at least in the younger grades.

in the upper grades next September I will focus on breaking down old habits and getting back to basics and engaging students. In education the pendulum swings and I feel like all this pushing for technology is a step backward. It’s a good to a certain extent but it isn’t a cure all. Thanks for letting me vent.

Great post!