Where's the camp that says "I don't need any power windows, power seats, power brakes, power steering, fuel injection, catalytic convertors, air conditioning, carpet, door locks"?
Auto Stop Start
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Originally Posted by Ifixyawata
Where's the camp that says "I don't need any power windows, power seats, power brakes, power steering, fuel injection, catalytic convertors, air conditioning, carpet, door locks"?
That's what some have said on the new "Ford Ranger" thread a couple of weeks ago.........
Where's the camp that says "I don't need any power windows, power seats, power brakes, power steering, fuel injection, catalytic convertors, air conditioning, carpet, door locks"?
That's what some have said on the new "Ford Ranger" thread a couple of weeks ago.........
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by buck91
I despise the auto stop/start in our 2018 F150. Not sure how much it saves on the EPA track but many owners have reported no MPG loss when switching off. Myself, I see it as nothing more than a liability. How much sooner will the battery or starter require replacement? What are all those stop/run cycles doing for engine wear? What if it doesn't start when I need it to? Does the extra stress it puts on the battery reflect in shorter alternator life?
If there was a clear, or better yet significant, MPG benefit we could talk... but there isn't.
You may be interested in this device. It appears to be very easy to install, and it automatically defaults the Auto Start / Stop system to OFF, each time the vehicle is started. It deactivates it automatically. But it still can be used if for some reason you decide you want it. It just reverses the way it works. Much less of a PITA.
https://www.autostopeliminator.com/
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
Originally Posted by buck91
I despise the auto stop/start in our 2018 F150. Not sure how much it saves on the EPA track but many owners have reported no MPG loss when switching off. Myself, I see it as nothing more than a liability. How much sooner will the battery or starter require replacement? What are all those stop/run cycles doing for engine wear? What if it doesn't start when I need it to? Does the extra stress it puts on the battery reflect in shorter alternator life?
If there was a clear, or better yet significant, MPG benefit we could talk... but there isn't.
You may be interested in this device. It appears to be very easy to install, and it automatically defaults the Auto Start / Stop system to OFF, each time the vehicle is started. It deactivates it automatically. But it still can be used if for some reason you decide you want it. It just reverses the way it works. Much less of a PITA.
https://www.autostopeliminator.com/
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
Originally Posted by CKN
Originally Posted by Ifixyawata
Where's the camp that says "I don't need any power windows, power seats, power brakes, power steering, fuel injection, catalytic convertors, air conditioning, carpet, door locks"?
That's what some have said on the new "Ford Ranger" thread a couple of weeks ago.........
Yep and as someone who drove a vehicle without any of those features, I am glad I'm driving what I have today. Not everyone want to take a long drive in a Grapes of Wrath truck
Originally Posted by Ifixyawata
Where's the camp that says "I don't need any power windows, power seats, power brakes, power steering, fuel injection, catalytic convertors, air conditioning, carpet, door locks"?
That's what some have said on the new "Ford Ranger" thread a couple of weeks ago.........
Yep and as someone who drove a vehicle without any of those features, I am glad I'm driving what I have today. Not everyone want to take a long drive in a Grapes of Wrath truck
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I'd be concerned about startup wear.
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
What concerns me is people who own a car with the system and another vehicle w/o it, and they get lazy and not actually look because they depend on the system. That's when things can get real bad, for them and people around them.
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
What concerns me is people who own a car with the system and another vehicle w/o it, and they get lazy and not actually look because they depend on the system. That's when things can get real bad, for them and people around them.
Originally Posted by PimTac
Of course on the interweb you can find anything to fit your agenda.
Don't whine at the messenger because you don't like the message.
Of course on the interweb you can find anything to fit your agenda.
Don't whine at the messenger because you don't like the message.
Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
What concerns me is people who own a car with the system and another vehicle w/o it, and they get lazy and not actually look because they depend on the system. That's when things can get real bad, for them and people around them.
There is not much that can be done for those drivers except to be a defensive driver.
Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by rooflessVW
Driver assist systems make ALL drivers safer.
And with this day and age of distracted drivers, I'm all for that. The first "new" car I will buy with will have some of those things. But I'm not looking forward to a $1000+ windshield amongst other things.
Blind spot monitors are worth it with current automotive styling trends and the increase of traffic these days. Some cars and SUVs have bad blind spot visibility. Pre-collsion braking can reduce the severity of an impact.
What concerns me is people who own a car with the system and another vehicle w/o it, and they get lazy and not actually look because they depend on the system. That's when things can get real bad, for them and people around them.
There is not much that can be done for those drivers except to be a defensive driver.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by PimTac
Of course on the interweb you can find anything to fit your agenda.
Don't whine at the messenger because you don't like the message.
Don't try to convince me or others that you are right. You have your opinion and you have stated it numerous time here.
We have to agree to disagree on this point.
Originally Posted by PimTac
Of course on the interweb you can find anything to fit your agenda.
Don't whine at the messenger because you don't like the message.
Don't try to convince me or others that you are right. You have your opinion and you have stated it numerous time here.
We have to agree to disagree on this point.
Originally Posted by demarpaint
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them.
As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them.
As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
Originally Posted by PimTac
Don't try to convince me or others that you are right
I'm not trying to "convince" you, or anyone else of anything. Someone posted their opinion that all of this crap makes for safer drivers. I simply posted several articles that state otherwise. Make of it what you will.
Don't try to convince me or others that you are right
I'm not trying to "convince" you, or anyone else of anything. Someone posted their opinion that all of this crap makes for safer drivers. I simply posted several articles that state otherwise. Make of it what you will.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by demarpaint
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them. As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
I agree! The market is clearly in place for these dongles. There's money to be made disabling the system for those who'd rather not push a button, or those who have no way to disable it. I wonder if start/stop will be around in the next 3-5 years?
Originally Posted by demarpaint
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them. As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
I agree! The market is clearly in place for these dongles. There's money to be made disabling the system for those who'd rather not push a button, or those who have no way to disable it. I wonder if start/stop will be around in the next 3-5 years?
Originally Posted by demarpaint
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by demarpaint
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them. As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
I agree! The market is clearly in place for these dongles. There's money to be made disabling the system for those who'd rather not push a button, or those who have no way to disable it. I wonder if start/stop will be around in the next 3-5 years?
Yep-and there are usually CHECK ENGINE LIGHTS THAT POP UP ON when devices like these come around. The after market has a tendency not to run a whole lot of miles when they R&D these things.
Start/Stop due to the EPA-IMHO is here to stay.
Originally Posted by billt460
Originally Posted by demarpaint
If I liked the vehicle enough to buy it, and I had no other way to disable the stop/start I'd buy the dongle.
I most likely would as well. My guess is there will always be devices sold like this one, that will render these things inactive. There are certainly enough people out there who hate them enough to spur good sales of these contraptions. I suspect as Start / Stop expands to more and more vehicles, there will be places who will both sell and install them. As always, if there is a market for something, someone will provide a product for that market. This one is a no brainer, because you have an all but guaranteed customer base. All one has to do is read this thread to prove that.
I agree! The market is clearly in place for these dongles. There's money to be made disabling the system for those who'd rather not push a button, or those who have no way to disable it. I wonder if start/stop will be around in the next 3-5 years?
Yep-and there are usually CHECK ENGINE LIGHTS THAT POP UP ON when devices like these come around. The after market has a tendency not to run a whole lot of miles when they R&D these things.
Start/Stop due to the EPA-IMHO is here to stay.
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Originally Posted by Dallas69
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
There is no benefit to consumer.
I don't see how anyone can like it.
I don't think that anyone has said that, but if they had, it's a baseless claim.
Things like Start-Stop and driver aids like autonomous braking fall into the same "nanny features" and "let me drive my own dang car" sort of technology. Though one is economy based and one is safety based, they're both getting lumped together because they both take away some control from the driver, or at least it's perceived that way.
The supposed benefit to the consumer is a bit better gas mileage, I don't know if this is actually realized as so many factors can contribute to fuel economy.
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
There is no benefit to consumer.
I don't see how anyone can like it.
I don't think that anyone has said that, but if they had, it's a baseless claim.
Things like Start-Stop and driver aids like autonomous braking fall into the same "nanny features" and "let me drive my own dang car" sort of technology. Though one is economy based and one is safety based, they're both getting lumped together because they both take away some control from the driver, or at least it's perceived that way.
The supposed benefit to the consumer is a bit better gas mileage, I don't know if this is actually realized as so many factors can contribute to fuel economy.
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Originally Posted by Dallas69
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
That's neither what is intended nor claimed. It's designed to reduce fuel consumption. Its effectiveness, and the motives of the car makers in installing it are clearly in dispute.
Originally Posted by Dallas69
There is no benefit to consumer.
Obviously, as reported in this very thread, some users, with the right driving pattern, do see a benefit.
Originally Posted by Dallas69
I don't see how anyone can like it.
Whether you see it or not isn't the issue. Some do; that's their business.
What I don't care for, and this has been well hashed out, above, are the modes and motives involved. If the system could be just as easily turned (and left) on or off, then I'd be OK with it. I don't like the idea of the car maker setting the system up so that even after the customer has bought, and now owns the vehicle, the system is still operating to the benefit of the manufacturer, and quite often, the great irritation, of the owner.
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
That's neither what is intended nor claimed. It's designed to reduce fuel consumption. Its effectiveness, and the motives of the car makers in installing it are clearly in dispute.
Originally Posted by Dallas69
There is no benefit to consumer.
Obviously, as reported in this very thread, some users, with the right driving pattern, do see a benefit.
Originally Posted by Dallas69
I don't see how anyone can like it.
Whether you see it or not isn't the issue. Some do; that's their business.
What I don't care for, and this has been well hashed out, above, are the modes and motives involved. If the system could be just as easily turned (and left) on or off, then I'd be OK with it. I don't like the idea of the car maker setting the system up so that even after the customer has bought, and now owns the vehicle, the system is still operating to the benefit of the manufacturer, and quite often, the great irritation, of the owner.
Originally Posted by aquariuscsm
I'd be concerned about startup wear.
Actually that's a great point. There's a concern that there might be accelerated bearing wear on the on early adoptions. I have read anything anecdotal evidence out of europe (initial adopters) stating widespread bearing failure at 150-200k miles.
I'd be concerned about startup wear.
Actually that's a great point. There's a concern that there might be accelerated bearing wear on the on early adoptions. I have read anything anecdotal evidence out of europe (initial adopters) stating widespread bearing failure at 150-200k miles.
Originally Posted by Dallas69
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
There is no benefit to consumer.
I don't see how anyone can like it.
It's primarily a fuel saving option followed by emissions. There's zero dispute that the systems saves fuel. It's silly to try to even argue that it doesn't. Sure some yo-yo who lives right off the highway and makes maybe 1-2 stops each way may claim that he's not saving fuel, but I would argue that in his case the savings is so small that if falls within the margin of error of his measuring device such as the fact his odometer only reads to 1/10 of a mile). Here are some facts which should be fairly obvious, More cylinders = more fuel saved,Engine which isn't running isn't burning fuel, More urban driving = more fuel saved. I loose 1-2 mpg when I don't use the system which works out to about 6 percent.
Someone explain to me how start-stop makes cars safer.
There is no benefit to consumer.
I don't see how anyone can like it.
It's primarily a fuel saving option followed by emissions. There's zero dispute that the systems saves fuel. It's silly to try to even argue that it doesn't. Sure some yo-yo who lives right off the highway and makes maybe 1-2 stops each way may claim that he's not saving fuel, but I would argue that in his case the savings is so small that if falls within the margin of error of his measuring device such as the fact his odometer only reads to 1/10 of a mile). Here are some facts which should be fairly obvious, More cylinders = more fuel saved,Engine which isn't running isn't burning fuel, More urban driving = more fuel saved. I loose 1-2 mpg when I don't use the system which works out to about 6 percent.
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