Am I wasting $12 on M1 filters?
- Thread starter 00firebird
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+1 on running Pure One's. Really good filters for the price.
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Originally Posted By: 00firebird
it had the typical GM 3.8L gasket problem so it might not look as great as it should. with that said i'm still glad it runs before it ran into a coolant hydrolock issue or some other disaster. If we completely ignore price for a moment, how much better is the mobil 1 compared to the wix/P1? what internal parts are different? any test numbers to look at?
That Engine doesnt look that great to me. Here is a pick of my Lancer Evo with about 60K miles and mind you MANY of those 60K miles where on the dyno WOT and on the track WOT. I used Redline 5w30 and look at the inside of the head of the car. I realize its not a block pic, but I think it still is a good comparo. I realize you have more miles on your car, but I guarantee my car has been at redline WWWAAAYYY longer than yours ever had. This is also pushing 26psi of boost as well.
Evo 9 Block 60K miles
Additionally, I am not sure what your "gasket" problem is, but I am assuming a head gasket? Rumored years ago was M1 when mixed with Antifreeze/water would foam like a Mutha, so not sure if that is happening or not here. Im not impressed by M1 with these photos. But thats just me.
Jeff
it had the typical GM 3.8L gasket problem so it might not look as great as it should. with that said i'm still glad it runs before it ran into a coolant hydrolock issue or some other disaster. If we completely ignore price for a moment, how much better is the mobil 1 compared to the wix/P1? what internal parts are different? any test numbers to look at?
That Engine doesnt look that great to me. Here is a pick of my Lancer Evo with about 60K miles and mind you MANY of those 60K miles where on the dyno WOT and on the track WOT. I used Redline 5w30 and look at the inside of the head of the car. I realize its not a block pic, but I think it still is a good comparo. I realize you have more miles on your car, but I guarantee my car has been at redline WWWAAAYYY longer than yours ever had. This is also pushing 26psi of boost as well.
Evo 9 Block 60K miles
Additionally, I am not sure what your "gasket" problem is, but I am assuming a head gasket? Rumored years ago was M1 when mixed with Antifreeze/water would foam like a Mutha, so not sure if that is happening or not here. Im not impressed by M1 with these photos. But thats just me.
Jeff
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Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I'm not suggesting anything, I'm STATING that Kreen isn't going to be able to clean what it can't touch sir. Unless you are of the mind that tiny leprechauns jump around inside the engine with tiny Kreen-soaked brushes cleaning off the surfaces that receive no actual lubrication and simply accrue deposits due to oil and deposit laden crankcase gasses floating around and condensing on them, then I think we are probably in agreement.
Put down the giant Kreen foam finger for a second, I'm not attacking the product, simply making a statement based on a fair amount of experience with these fancy things we call internal combustion engines.
Kreen is actually quite volatile and will indeed clean other areas of the engine that it did not touch while in liquid form.
Not everything, but some of it.
I'm not suggesting anything, I'm STATING that Kreen isn't going to be able to clean what it can't touch sir. Unless you are of the mind that tiny leprechauns jump around inside the engine with tiny Kreen-soaked brushes cleaning off the surfaces that receive no actual lubrication and simply accrue deposits due to oil and deposit laden crankcase gasses floating around and condensing on them, then I think we are probably in agreement.
Put down the giant Kreen foam finger for a second, I'm not attacking the product, simply making a statement based on a fair amount of experience with these fancy things we call internal combustion engines.
Kreen is actually quite volatile and will indeed clean other areas of the engine that it did not touch while in liquid form.
Not everything, but some of it.
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Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I'm not suggesting anything, I'm STATING that Kreen isn't going to be able to clean what it can't touch sir. Unless you are of the mind that tiny leprechauns jump around inside the engine with tiny Kreen-soaked brushes cleaning off the surfaces that receive no actual lubrication and simply accrue deposits due to oil and deposit laden crankcase gasses floating around and condensing on them, then I think we are probably in agreement.
Put down the giant Kreen foam finger for a second, I'm not attacking the product, simply making a statement based on a fair amount of experience with these fancy things we call internal combustion engines.
Kreen is actually quite volatile and will indeed clean other areas of the engine that it did not touch while in liquid form.
Not everything, but some of it.
Steve:
I have no doubt that when in gaseous form, it will clean vent tubes and the like that it ends up going through, but you would need a significant quantity of it to touch all the no-flow areas that are currently caked with varnish in order for it to have any real effect.
If those areas were attacked with a toothbrush and some Kreen while the engine is open, well that's a completely different story!
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
I'm not suggesting anything, I'm STATING that Kreen isn't going to be able to clean what it can't touch sir. Unless you are of the mind that tiny leprechauns jump around inside the engine with tiny Kreen-soaked brushes cleaning off the surfaces that receive no actual lubrication and simply accrue deposits due to oil and deposit laden crankcase gasses floating around and condensing on them, then I think we are probably in agreement.
Put down the giant Kreen foam finger for a second, I'm not attacking the product, simply making a statement based on a fair amount of experience with these fancy things we call internal combustion engines.
Kreen is actually quite volatile and will indeed clean other areas of the engine that it did not touch while in liquid form.
Not everything, but some of it.
Steve:
I have no doubt that when in gaseous form, it will clean vent tubes and the like that it ends up going through, but you would need a significant quantity of it to touch all the no-flow areas that are currently caked with varnish in order for it to have any real effect.
If those areas were attacked with a toothbrush and some Kreen while the engine is open, well that's a completely different story!
Looks like a balance shaft...
does filter barn not sell wix?
Unless the filter goes into bypass or is defective, its not going to do much either way with respect to cleaning your engine or letting it get dirty. That is the oil's job.
You are using Mobil 1 and doing 5000 mile OCIs. Your engine does seem to have some varnish but definitely not a filthy engine by any means. I will bet you could have gone 10,000 mile OCIs and seen the same internals.
IMO oil is the key factor for clean non varnished engines, filters a re very far second behind the oil. At 5000 mile OCI about any filter will do. Please don't take this the wrong way but you are spending too much on oil and filters and not using them to their fullest
IMO oil is the key factor for clean non varnished engines, filters a re very far second behind the oil. At 5000 mile OCI about any filter will do. Please don't take this the wrong way but you are spending too much on oil and filters and not using them to their fullest
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Originally Posted By: Spector
You are using Mobil 1 and doing 5000 mile OCIs. Your engine does seem to have some varnish but definitely not a filthy engine by any means. I will bet you could have gone 10,000 mile OCIs and seen the same internals.
IMO oil is the key factor for clean non varnished engines, filters a re very far second behind the oil. At 5000 mile OCI about any filter will do. Please don't take this the wrong way but you are spending too much on oil and filters and not using them to their fullest
+1....Agree....A waste of time, $$$, and resources. An 8000 mile OCI would be conservative IMO.
You are using Mobil 1 and doing 5000 mile OCIs. Your engine does seem to have some varnish but definitely not a filthy engine by any means. I will bet you could have gone 10,000 mile OCIs and seen the same internals.
IMO oil is the key factor for clean non varnished engines, filters a re very far second behind the oil. At 5000 mile OCI about any filter will do. Please don't take this the wrong way but you are spending too much on oil and filters and not using them to their fullest
+1....Agree....A waste of time, $$$, and resources. An 8000 mile OCI would be conservative IMO.
M1 filters are 15K filters. When they are used to that interval they are cost effective. I stockpile when they are on sale at a local small box store for $8.00. Many BITOG'rs go into spasms if they do not change the filter during an OC. I am spasm free.
That being said, I would not extend the OCI on 3.1 or 3.8 GM motors unless accompanied by a UOA. In this circumstance low OCI with Supertech oil/filters might have mitigated the situation better than a premium filter filtering premium oil for an extended run; This is why a UOA allows a person to make an informed decision on how to proceed.
JMO
That being said, I would not extend the OCI on 3.1 or 3.8 GM motors unless accompanied by a UOA. In this circumstance low OCI with Supertech oil/filters might have mitigated the situation better than a premium filter filtering premium oil for an extended run; This is why a UOA allows a person to make an informed decision on how to proceed.
JMO
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According to New oil filter study, Framm XG filter is better than M1 and marginaly cheaper at least in Canada. BTW, M1 on their website claims that " any quality filter can go 15k miles".
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Who's oil filter study?
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Originally Posted By: xnighter
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
Thanks!
Looks like a really well setup test!
I'm hoping he doesn't mind me linking the images to show what you are talking about:
1. AC Delco:
2. Purolator PureONE:
3. K&N:
4. Mobil 1:
5. Fram XG:
6. Royal Purple:
7. AMSOIL EaO:
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
Thanks!
Looks like a really well setup test!
I'm hoping he doesn't mind me linking the images to show what you are talking about:
1. AC Delco:
2. Purolator PureONE:
3. K&N:
4. Mobil 1:
5. Fram XG:
6. Royal Purple:
7. AMSOIL EaO:
Originally Posted By: xnighter
According to New oil filter study, Framm XG filter is better than M1 and marginaly cheaper at least in Canada. BTW, M1 on their website claims that " any quality filter can go 15k miles".
That test seems extremely subjective. I, personally, don't feel that price should have any weight in a graded test like that. It isn't a true factor when looking at the real efficiency of a filter. I'm not trying to discredit his findings, but the addition of the cost as a grade is unnecessary and skews the results.
It does, however, add something when looking at a value proposition, but that add in alone gives me hesitation.
According to New oil filter study, Framm XG filter is better than M1 and marginaly cheaper at least in Canada. BTW, M1 on their website claims that " any quality filter can go 15k miles".
That test seems extremely subjective. I, personally, don't feel that price should have any weight in a graded test like that. It isn't a true factor when looking at the real efficiency of a filter. I'm not trying to discredit his findings, but the addition of the cost as a grade is unnecessary and skews the results.
It does, however, add something when looking at a value proposition, but that add in alone gives me hesitation.
Quote:
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
This filter evaluation has been posted here before (see below) . Upon closer inspection it was noted here that filters with the same media ie., the Fram orange can and high mileage also the Wix and Napa Gold showed different filtering results.
Also the Puro Classic showed better results in the patch test efficiency than the Pure One and Napa Pro Select better than Gold. I'm going believe the testing done in a lab (ISO) in controlled conditions, over a test like this done in some guy's basement.
Curiously, in his recent similar air filter test posted on the AF board, the Classic results also bettered the P1.
So imo, a nice effort with good dissection pics, patch test efficiency results, not so much.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2181590&page=1
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
This filter evaluation has been posted here before (see below) . Upon closer inspection it was noted here that filters with the same media ie., the Fram orange can and high mileage also the Wix and Napa Gold showed different filtering results.
Also the Puro Classic showed better results in the patch test efficiency than the Pure One and Napa Pro Select better than Gold. I'm going believe the testing done in a lab (ISO) in controlled conditions, over a test like this done in some guy's basement.
Curiously, in his recent similar air filter test posted on the AF board, the Classic results also bettered the P1.
So imo, a nice effort with good dissection pics, patch test efficiency results, not so much.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2181590&page=1
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Quote:
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
This filter evaluation has been posted here before (see below) . Upon closer inspection it was noted here that filters with the same media ie., the Fram orange can and high mileage also the Wix and Napa Gold showed different filtering results.
Also the Puro Classic showed better results in the patch test efficiency than the Pure One and Napa Pro Select better than Gold. I'm going believe the testing done in a lab (ISO) in controlled conditions, over a test like this done in some guy's basement.
Curiously, in his recent similar air filter test posted on the AF board, the Classic results also bettered the P1.
So imo, a nice effort with good dissection pics, patch test efficiency results, not so much.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2181590&page=1
+1 ... I recall that study and the old thread you referenced. That test didn't seem to add up correctly.
Quote:
http://www.gmtruckcentral.com/articles/oilfilterstudy.html
This filter evaluation has been posted here before (see below) . Upon closer inspection it was noted here that filters with the same media ie., the Fram orange can and high mileage also the Wix and Napa Gold showed different filtering results.
Also the Puro Classic showed better results in the patch test efficiency than the Pure One and Napa Pro Select better than Gold. I'm going believe the testing done in a lab (ISO) in controlled conditions, over a test like this done in some guy's basement.
Curiously, in his recent similar air filter test posted on the AF board, the Classic results also bettered the P1.
So imo, a nice effort with good dissection pics, patch test efficiency results, not so much.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2181590&page=1
+1 ... I recall that study and the old thread you referenced. That test didn't seem to add up correctly.
When did you last change the PCV?
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