2002 Volvo S60 ATF change

[dlundblad]

I have been hem hawing about this roughly as long as I have been a member, but the online horror stories are what have been causing me to put it off. I had planned on doing a drain and fill this summer, but te other day, she told me the transmission wants to slip at times even while it is at temperature. This tells me the fluid needs replaced ASAP.

I am leaning towards a drain and fill since I believe would be about 3.5 quarts as opposed to using 10+ quarts to "cooler line flush" the entire system at once. The car has about 150k on the OD. The ATF doesn't seem charred, burned etc. The spec'd ATF is Mobil 3309, but I am thinking about just using Maxlife.

The only pain IMO is that Volvo doesn't recommend an ATF drain/ fill so the dip stick is about an arms length into the engine. I'll have to get a small funnel and hose for the refill. Might be doing it this weekend so Ill take photos.

 

[demarpaint]

I like to try and get as much fluid out as possible. Either by a line drop or a few extractions, especially for fluid in service a long time.

Smart move on your part. Subscribed for the pics.

 

[pbm]

I have had good luck with Maxlife in several applications including a Toyota that spec'd 3309. I would use it in the Volvo and do a few (maybe 3 or 4) D&Rs a hundred miles apart.
Good luck.

 

[Kira]

Hello, First thing: There is no "life long" fluid on the planet.

I suggest raising the driver's side (left side in No. America) good 'n high. You'll get closer to 4 quarts to drain.
The drain plug is 24mm.
Finding 18mm aluminum washers (drain plug gaskets) locally is difficult.
Order 10 or 12 from eEuroparts.com or FCPeuroparts.com or IPD or RockAuto. Same gasket the oil drain uses.

You said: "I'll have to get a small funnel and hose for the refill". a) Poor baby! b) only kidding a bit! c) One or another style of long, tapered plastic transmission funnel fits well too.

The MaxLife Dex/Merc LV works well. Toyota Type-IV (aka T-IV) is 3309. Amalie/Wolf's Head Super Universal Synthetic Transmission Fluid (from amaliestore.com) is great for these units and ships free. You can't beat it.

After you get the fluid to a clean state I recommend LubeGard (red bottle) in the suggested proportion. That is 1 oz. per quart capacity.

Depending on how dirty the fluid is pbm's suggestion of 3 to 4 drain & fills sounds good.

I'm on my second V70 and have have done this to 6 of these units. Zero problems with MaxLife Dex/Merc LV, Toyota T-IV, the Amalie SUSTF.

Honestly, there's no thinking to be done here. Get the fluid clean. Use NO MACHINES to accomplish this. Kira

 

[Astro14]

I recommend a cooler line fluid exchange. You'll need about 12 quarts. I've bought Mobil 3309 on Amazon for $5/QT. I've used Toyota T-IV bought at the dealer for about the same (case discount plus 10% discount for being a regular customer). I've used Valvoline Import Multi Vehicle (also synthetic, but specifically formulated for imports, particularly T-IV or JWS-3309 spec'd cars). All three fluids have worked well.

I would just get the IPD kit for the fluid exchange. Clear directions (which you can download from this page http://www.ipdusa.com/products/4808/107945-automatic-transmission-flush-hose-kit ) as well as a new clip and o-rings for the hose that you'll disconnect. I wouldn't want to reuse the o-rings, and at your car's age, the clip is likely to break when you remove the line for the flush.

If you just want to do multiple D&F, then the sealing ring on the transmission is the same as the oil drain plug ring. Jack it up as Kira said, and you'll get close to 4.0 QT. Leave it level, and it's closer to 3.5 QT.

I've done a cooler line fluid exchange every 30,000 miles.

There is no real filter for this transmission. Many folks use a 3/8" Magnefine in the return line. That line is tough to cut, by the way, but I recommend a filter. A cooler is a good idea if you want this to last.

If you want to get fancy, you might consider what I've done on the 2002 V70, pictures here: http://www.volvoxc.com/forums/showthread.php?27334-02-XC70-Transmission-Flush-From-Bottom This includes an easily replaceable cartridge, and a cooler with a thermostat.

There are lots of horror stories of the 2002 AW55-50 transmission. Fundamentally, the valve bodies wear out. An aftermarket solution exists from Sonnax, and a good valve body specialist can rebuild it. I've got over 100,000 miles on a rebuilt valve body in my wife's XC, and over 80,000 miles on a rebuilt valve body in the V70. Both shift flawlessly.

After my experience with the valve bodies, I wrote up some notes on how to replace the VB in this transmission. The links may no longer be valid, as this was about 6 years ago.

Your car is identical. If you're interested, they're posted here: http://www.volvoxc.com/0/resources/how-to/pdf/2002-V70-XC-Valve-Body-Replacement-Notes.pdf

Incidentally, while you don't have an XC, the chassis, and most of the systems are the same. The Volvoxc.com forum is quite active and has a wealth of information, you might consider spending some time over there reading...

 

[Lolvoguy]

I don't understand why anyone would drag their heels when considering R&Ring fluids on a car that's anything over 5 years of age. You'll get better performance and longer lifespan from your investment.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: Astro14
I recommend a cooler line fluid exchange. You'll need about 12 quarts. I've bought Mobil 3309 on Amazon for $5/QT. I've used Toyota T-IV bought at the dealer for about the same (case discount plus 10% discount for being a regular customer). I've used Valvoline Import Multi Vehicle (also synthetic, but specifically formulated for imports, particularly T-IV or JWS-3309 spec'd cars). All three fluids have worked well.

I would just get the IPD kit for the fluid exchange. Clear directions (which you can download from this page http://www.ipdusa.com/products/4808/107945-automatic-transmission-flush-hose-kit ) as well as a new clip and o-rings for the hose that you'll disconnect. I wouldn't want to reuse the o-rings, and at your car's age, the clip is likely to break when you remove the line for the flush.

If you just want to do multiple D&F, then the sealing ring on the transmission is the same as the oil drain plug ring. Jack it up as Kira said, and you'll get close to 4.0 QT. Leave it level, and it's closer to 3.5 QT.

I've done a cooler line fluid exchange every 30,000 miles.

There is no real filter for this transmission. Many folks use a 3/8" Magnefine in the return line. That line is tough to cut, by the way, but I recommend a filter. A cooler is a good idea if you want this to last.

If you want to get fancy, you might consider what I've done on the 2002 V70, pictures here: http://www.volvoxc.com/forums/showthread.php?27334-02-XC70-Transmission-Flush-From-Bottom This includes an easily replaceable cartridge, and a cooler with a thermostat.

There are lots of horror stories of the 2002 AW55-50 transmission. Fundamentally, the valve bodies wear out. An aftermarket solution exists from Sonnax, and a good valve body specialist can rebuild it. I've got over 100,000 miles on a rebuilt valve body in my wife's XC, and over 80,000 miles on a rebuilt valve body in the V70. Both shift flawlessly.

After my experience with the valve bodies, I wrote up some notes on how to replace the VB in this transmission. The links may no longer be valid, as this was about 6 years ago.

Your car is identical. If you're interested, they're posted here: http://www.volvoxc.com/0/resources/how-to/pdf/2002-V70-XC-Valve-Body-Replacement-Notes.pdf

Incidentally, while you don't have an XC, the chassis, and most of the systems are the same. The Volvoxc.com forum is quite active and has a wealth of information, you might consider spending some time over there reading...


Thanks for the thinks.

Any reason why you prefer a cooler line flush over the drain and fill?

 

[Astro14]

The D&F gets roughly 40% of the fluid out. So, even if you do it several times, you aren't getting close to 100% new fluid. The cooler line exchange gets you close to 100% in one operation. There are a lot of old wives' tales about changing fluid. I don't buy them.

But each time you D&F, you're going to have to get the level right. Since there is only 200ml from top to bottom of the acceptable range, and the trans has to be at 80C for it to be an accurate check, and you'll likely burn your arm on hot components while reaching deep down in the engine bay for that tiny yellow dipstick, I prefer to do that operation just once every few years as well.

 

[Ignatz]

I recently bought a 2002 V70 and did drain and refills on mine. I used the 3309 from Amazon.com, and after all the drain and fills...took it to the dealer to check for programing updates and they need to tell the transmission that "new" oil was entered.
My independent Volvo site wanted to do a flush, but I opted for the slower drain and fills. I have calibrated lab containers that let me measure my drain and refills.
My trans shifts fine and will do a drain and fill once a year as maintenance. Hopefully new fluid will straighten yours out.

 

[SatinSilver]

On a car that's 2-3 years old with about 30k miles a cooler line flush would probably be my top choice. But with an older car with around 100k miles that still has the factory fill in it I'd definitely be doing a series of drain and fills. Spaced out at least 500-1000 miles apart to get some slow, gentle cleaning.

It's what Honda recommended when they were having transmission issues, doing drain/fills instead of flushes. To avoid something clogging up one of the many small internal passages of the transmission.

 

[dlundblad]

Originally Posted By: Ignatz
I recently bought a 2002 V70 and did drain and refills on mine. I used the 3309 from Amazon.com, and after all the drain and fills...took it to the dealer to check for programing updates and they need to tell the transmission that "new" oil was entered.
My independent Volvo site wanted to do a flush, but I opted for the slower drain and fills. I have calibrated lab containers that let me measure my drain and refills.
My trans shifts fine and will do a drain and fill once a year as maintenance. Hopefully new fluid will straighten yours out.


I've never heard of having to tell the transmission it had new fluid. How did it shift prior to reprogramming?

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: Ignatz
I recently bought a 2002 V70 and did drain and refills on mine. I used the 3309 from Amazon.com, and after all the drain and fills...took it to the dealer to check for programing updates and they need to tell the transmission that "new" oil was entered.
My independent Volvo site wanted to do a flush, but I opted for the slower drain and fills. I have calibrated lab containers that let me measure my drain and refills.
My trans shifts fine and will do a drain and fill once a year as maintenance. Hopefully new fluid will straighten yours out.


Unless you had the dealership put the car in adaptation mode, all they did was reset the fluid counter. The fluid counter meansures time vs. temperature and at some value (10 minutes at above 150C is what I've heard anecdotally) it will trigger a DIM (Driver Information Module) message.

Adaptation mode involves a 30-45 minute long drive cycle to learn new shift patterns if new parts, like a valve body, are installed. See the valve body reference linked above for a more complete description.

Adaptation mode is absolutely NOT required for a fluid change. And telling the car that it has new fluid is not required either, it just resets the fluid counter, but in 100,000 miles of driving, I've not set a DIM warning.

Once you've done a complete flush, then you can switch to D&F if you like, but a complete fluid exchange isn't going to hurt the transmission. If that were true, then I would not have made it to over 200,000 miles with an original "troublesome" AW55-50 in my wife's XC, which has seen several fluid exchanges.

 

[dlundblad]

The cooler flush is very tempting, but a drain/ fill looks like a simple way to do it this weekend. Plus I can buy at least 2 gallons of ATF for what that kit costs.. Haha.

If I am wanting to do more than just 4 quarts, how about 1 d/f followed by a 15 minute drive.. then another d/f?

 

[SatinSilver]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
If I am wanting to do more than just 4 quarts, how about 1 d/f followed by a 15 minute drive.. then another d/f?


Drive 500-1000 miles between drain and fills.

 

[Astro14]

15 minutes of driving would ensure thorough mixing of fluid. 500-1000 miles of driving would allow for some adaptation if the fluid materially changed the shifting. If the transmission is shifting fine now, then going the 500+ miles is not really needed.

I've bought the sealing rings in bulk from IPD, 20 or 25 at a pop. Since I've got two of these cars and the rings are good for both crankcase and transmission, they've nearly been used up.

 

[Ignatz]

My local shop told me to take my "new" 2002 V70 back to the dealer where it was serviced since new to have them check if the car had the latest software updates. Resetting the fluid counter is something else that they did, and I know most people don't do this. I was there for about two hours eating bagels and drinking coffee.
It shifts better than it did after first buying the car. I did three D&F's initially in one afternoon. Then three more about two weeks apart. Then I took it to the dealer for a checkup.
My 98 S70T5 automatic and 2001 V70T5 stick shift were both totaled last fall...3 weeks apart. This 2002 is my wife's replacement that's really working great! But I do miss the stick shift T5!

 

[Oro_O]

I have serviced that transmission in my mothers Equinox, same AW55 I believe. I also have a very close cousin of it in a Lexus.

- MaxLife is great here. Gallon jugs from Walmart or Autozone.
- Cooler line flush unless you simply can't fathom how to do it.

I'm w/Astro14; it is really inefficient to keep slowly blending new fluid in with bad, then taking out a mixture of that with subsequent drain/fills. You can simply pull the return hose, put it in a bucket. Pump out 3 qts, stop, add that, repeat.

The silly fill hole is quite annoying but not overly complicated. some 3/8" or similar tubing on the end of a funnel can be snaked down to the hole. Getting it off and then reading the fill was much more challenging than snaking the hose down to actually fill.

You don't need any special kit to do a line flush at it's most basic. Maybe only a hose barb and extra hose to reach from the cooler down to a bucket to avoid a (larger) mess. My mother's AW55 I swapped at 99k. No one had complained about it's behavior, but the difference was dramatic before and after in responsiveness and authority of the shifts. After a line swap, I then generally do a drain/fill every 30k. If you can get the pan off on that (do not recall if that was practical/possible), at that mileage it would be smart to get out the accumulated friction and wear material in the pan and clean the magnets. Otherwise some of it will dirty up the new fluid prematurely.

If it has gone this long, a good thing you can also do is put in some Transtune/SeaFoam (same stuff, use whichever is to hand) in the recommended dosage before draining or flushing. It can clean up some valve body ickiness if present - I have seen it work.

 

[dlundblad]

So even though the transmission wants to slip every now and then, a full cooler line flush would still be more adequate?

 

[Astro14]

Originally Posted By: dlundblad
So even though the transmission wants to slip every now and then, a full cooler line flush would still be more adequate?


Whoa!

It "wants to slip every now and then"? I thought this thing was OK...you didn't mention slipping! It might be well past the point where a fluid flush will help!

Don't go changing 40%. Flush all the fluid. If you're lucky, the increased viscosity will smooth out the shifting.

If that doesn't work, and particularly if you get shift flare on the 3-4 upshift, then change the B4 servo cover. IPD has the kit. It's about $30, takes 10 minutes (well, 10 minutes on the second time, first time will take at least 30 as you struggle with the snap ring while pressing the servo cover into the case).

If that doesn't work, you're looking at a valve body, minimum.

Go read through the valve body replacement notes that I linked earlier.

Fundamentally, this year of the AW55 had problems with bore wear on the SLT solenoid. The SLT solenoid controls line pressure (operating hydraulic pressure) through its duty cycle (time spent on/off). When the bore wears, fluid leaks past the solenoid, and no amount of cycle on/off will build sufficient line pressure.

With low line pressure, the servos (hydraulic actuators) won't be able to engage the clutch for the next gear before the engine begins to apply power again - you get shift flare. Shift flare is when the RPM drops during a change, then the RPM climbs as if in neutral, then drops again as the transmission slips into the next gear. This shift flare beats up the clutches. Flare is generally caused by low line pressure, although the 4th gear servo in this transmission had a defective cover design that caused the servo to be out of position, resulting in flare on the 3-4 shift.

So, flush it. Change the B4 servo cover.

Report back.

 

[Astro14]

Edit: I see that you did mention wanting to slip.

One other point: if it works well cold, that's a sign of low pressure. The colder, more viscous fluid masks the leakage past the solenoid and allows actuators to work more quickly.

Problems generally show up when the fluid is hot, and therefore thin. New fluid should have higher viscosity and may help...

Finally, if it's slow responding to "garage shifts" (P-R-D) that's another sign of low pressure.