1994 Pontiac Grand Am 3.1L AMSOIL 0W30 12,504 miles

[benjamming]

1994 Pontiac Grand Am 3.1L V6 automatic
AMSOIL Series 2000 0W30
3/4 Highway driving
SDF-29 oil filter
AMSOIL TS110 air filter cleaned at ~140k miles
Sample taken dec-12-2004
Added 0.5 quart of AMSOIL 5W30 at filter change - 7,474 miles into OCI.
12,504 miles on oil - 7 months
145,198 miles on car
Oil Analyzers, Inc. did the UOA

1st number: 12,504 milles (current)
2nd #: 18,331 miles S2K 0W30
3rd #: 2,920 miles S2K 0W30

Iron - 37/44/26
Chromium - 2/3/2
Lead - 21/23/6
Copper - 20/17/7
Tin - 0/0/0
Aluminum - 12/12/10
Nickel - 0/0/0
Silver - 0/0/0
Silicon - 76/144 abnormal/94
Boron - 31/25/5
Sodium - 245 abnormal/74 abnormal/216 abnormal
Magnesium - 874/457/162
Calcium - 2804/1796/1932
Barium - 0/0/0
Phosphorus - 1071/882/917
Zinc - 1224/1268/1322
Molybdenum - 14/13/38
Titanium - 0/0/0
Vanadium - 0/0/0
Potassium - 35 abnormal/55 abnormal/39 abnormal
Fuel 17.87 cst abnormal /16.80 cSt - abnormal/10.31
Water - 0/0%/0%
Soot/solids - N/A
Glycol - NEG/NEG/NEG
TBN - 3.38/3.02/6.31
Oxidation - 13.0/14.0/5.0
Nitration - 10.0/12.0/7.0

Oil was drained & oil filter changed when sample was taken. I added a bottle of AutoRX to the new GM 5W30 oil & will be doing a two bottle treatment. AC Delco oil filter will be used for the 1st couple of intervals.

My mpg had been suffering which I usually have with winter gas. However, I think it's due to the 50W oil in the crankcase!

Iron was 3.0/1000 miles.
Lead was 1.7/1000 miles.
Copper was 2.1/1000 miles.
Aluminum 1.0/1000 miles.
Silicon 6.1/1000 miles.

It would appear that I have yet another coolant leak? Did I get a bad intake manifold gasket?
The oil had tested positive for a coolant leak in what would be the 4th sample. The 3rd sample is right after I fixed the coolant leak.

I believe my silicon was lowered b/c the air filter was cleaned at 140,841 miles. It had 29,398 miles since it was installed new. I forgot to write it down to clean it & I forgot!

I usually add 1oz of Redline Fuel System Cleaner at every fill-up. Spark plugs were replaced during this interval. The coolant was flushed during this interval when the heater core failed.

I will be consulting Terry on this one as well.

UOA history: newest to oldest
Castrol GTX http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=3;t=001379
http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=001378#000002
http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=3&t=001377#000000

Ideas besides not going more than 7500 miles (after the ARX) on an OCI? I will probably go to AMSOIL 5W30 & quit using the expensive AMSOIL 0W30. I may be ruining this engine by trying to do something that can't be done in this particular car. At least I gave it a good shot!

 

[pitzel]

The wear metals aren't really all that bad in this sample, all other things considered. Viscosity thickening and your high Si levels are the two main issues here, the antifreeze ingress issue aside.

I think you'd be well advised to ditch the Amsoil air filter for a couple OCI's and see if the Silicon improves. When you had your intake manifold gasket changed, was the oxygen sensor also changed at the same time? Coolant combustion byproducts will destroy an O2 sensor, causing rich operation of the engine, which could be one of the reasons behind the excessive oil thickening. Just something to consider. I am sure Terry will have some ideas for you as well, but I think you have issues far beyond what simple use of FP/LC could easily resolve insofar as the Amsoil thickening is concerned.

 

[Al]

Well..High Lead+high viscosity+high silicon+high sodium+high potassium= Intake leak.

I would get Terry to confirm that with a good writeup so that you will have ammunition-especially since the report doesn't show positive for antifreeze.

We need to round up the design team for the 3.1 engine and drive them over a cliff, so they are never heard from again

 

[Drew99GT]

quote:

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Originally posted by Al:

We need to round up the design team for the 3.1 engine and drive them over a cliff, so they are never heard from again

---

I'll pay for the gas

 

[Gary Allan]

I kinda agree with pitzel. This isn't all that bad. It ain't something to boast about ..but you've gone further than many here and lived to tell about it. I had Fe numbers twice as high on my jeep with M1 over a 10k OCI ..and that was with over a 9 quart sump. I was void of the sodium and potassium however.

I'm beginning to think that the trick to some Amsoil products is to start at the bare minimum viscosity that you can get away with and then just change it out when you've figured out that it's turning to jello. I'm still convinced that this is a design feature that they bank on for extended OCI. The stuff has got to have some volitile in it that "time releases" itself from the oil. Do they make a 0w or 5w-20?

I wouldn't throw in the towel on 6 month OCIs. You may not find a suitable oil in the Amsoil line however. You've got the ideal situation for extended OCIs ..lots of mileage accumulated over a relatively short span of time. After you correct your intake problem ..it's merely a search and aquire mission on the correct oil.

 

[benjamming]

Thanks for the responses so far.
I had noticed that it doesn't appear that the uptake of additives wasn't as much as it has been. Is that a correct statement? I'm still learning here.

The O2 sensor was replaced at 91,346 miles on Oct-11-2002. The intake manifold gasket was replaced at 113,475 miles on Jul-28-2003. It only has 1 sensor. It was replaced with a Bosch the one time only. The coolant & plugs were changed with the gasket though.

 

[Pablo]

For sure bag the 0W-30. Bag the 5W-30.

Use either the 5W-40 Euro oil or the 10W-30.

It's hard to evaluate any oil with mechanical issues. The Na level alone signals issues.

 

[Gene K]

I would run short-intervals (3000 mi) with a cheap dino 5W-30 that tends to thin. Should offset some of the thickening. I would stay away from any kind of extended drain until the problem is solved.

Gene

[ January 01, 2005, 02:59 PM: Message edited by: Gene K ]

 

[pbm]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al:

We need to round up the design team for the 3.1 engine and drive them over a cliff, so they are never heard from again

[/QB]

---

Is the 3.1 / 3.4 an inherently flawed design or is the gasket material or fastening method flawed or has this problem only showed up since Dexcool has come on the scene. Does anybody have any tips on properly replacing the gasket (such as using loctite etc..) to prevent reoccurence of the problem. Any factual info would be appreciated.
Maybe this should be a new thread in the mechanical tips section.

 

[REDDOG]

I second Gene k.'s advice-the best oil on the planet isn't going to perform well with coolant in the oil.

 

[Drew99GT]

quote:

---

Originally posted by pbm:

quote:

---

Originally posted by Al:

We need to round up the design team for the 3.1 engine and drive them over a cliff, so they are never heard from again

---

Is the 3.1 / 3.4 an inherently flawed design or is the gasket material or fastening method flawed or has this problem only showed up since Dexcool has come on the scene. Does anybody have any tips on properly replacing the gasket (such as using loctite etc..) to prevent reoccurence of the problem. Any factual info would be appreciated.
Maybe this should be a new thread in the mechanical tips section. [/QB]

---

Locttite?

Glue the gaskets to the cylinder heads PERFECTLY with Good RTV, ALL THE WAY AROUND EVERY port, and let it set over night before you drop the manifold back onto the engine. That way, the gasket won't move when your positioning the manifold in place and getting the bolts threaded in without damaging the gasket (usually from it being misaligned slightly from disturbing the gasket while positioning the manifold). I'm now convinced that's one of the reasons that the gaskets end up failing again after replacement. Most techs are more concerned about exceeding "flate rate", then doing a perfect job that will last the life of the engine.