One camshaft comparo does not a superior oil make
Royal Purple?
- Thread starter Keith Z
- Start date
- Status
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
One camshaft comparo does not a superior oil make
No kidding..
One camshaft comparo does not a superior oil make
No kidding..
Originally Posted By: deven
Sure it shears and shows high wear on UOA's but I have learned UOA's don't tell you the whole story sometimes.
Neither do one-off pictures of camshafts...
without micrometer readings or any real supporting data...
from a largely unknown and obviously non-scientific source...
representing only one product from each brand...
in only one application...
in only one part of the engine...
when the products are arguably not even comparable because they're made to different specs.
Yes, pictures do speak louder than words -- not just sometimes, but always. Please remember that loudness has nothing to do with truth or value.
Sure it shears and shows high wear on UOA's but I have learned UOA's don't tell you the whole story sometimes.
Neither do one-off pictures of camshafts...
without micrometer readings or any real supporting data...
from a largely unknown and obviously non-scientific source...
representing only one product from each brand...
in only one application...
in only one part of the engine...
when the products are arguably not even comparable because they're made to different specs.
Yes, pictures do speak louder than words -- not just sometimes, but always. Please remember that loudness has nothing to do with truth or value.
Originally Posted By: daman
You haven't found allot because it's nothing special, for that kind of money there's better choices out there..
+1
Almost $8 a quart for RP.
$1 a quart for Pennz Plat, Valvoline SynP, or Q-Ult Durability with a rebate.
You haven't found allot because it's nothing special, for that kind of money there's better choices out there..
+1
Almost $8 a quart for RP.
$1 a quart for Pennz Plat, Valvoline SynP, or Q-Ult Durability with a rebate.
I thought I saw something last year or early this year where Royal Purple was forced to remove their claims on HP gains from their bottles. Am I correct?
Royal Purple is a good-solid synthetic but nowadays basically every synthetic is, at a cheaper price too. NHHEMI I saw the O'Reilly's deal for 39.99 I believe in June but they were also selling several solid synthetics with good filters for 29.99 and I got Mobil EP with a Mobil filter for 32.99 from that same ad.
Royal Purple is a good-solid synthetic but nowadays basically every synthetic is, at a cheaper price too. NHHEMI I saw the O'Reilly's deal for 39.99 I believe in June but they were also selling several solid synthetics with good filters for 29.99 and I got Mobil EP with a Mobil filter for 32.99 from that same ad.
Originally Posted By: Capa
I thought I saw something last year or early this year where Royal Purple was forced to remove their claims on HP gains from their bottles. Am I correct?
Something like that.
http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_article001398592.cfm
I thought I saw something last year or early this year where Royal Purple was forced to remove their claims on HP gains from their bottles. Am I correct?
Something like that.
http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_article001398592.cfm
People sure do come out of the woodwork to defend this stuff. RP employees? 
- Joined
- Dec 30, 2006
- Messages
- 29,558
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
I laugh at comments like this. RP can be had for the same or even less than individual qt bottles of name brand synthetics( M1, PP, PU, QS, VVL, etc... )if you shop around. I pay no more than $7 a qt for it here locally and can get it for less than $6 a qt if I order far enough ahead through another local dealer. The average price I pay is $6.25 a qt.
^^2nd on Hemi`s comment. RP is the cheapest PAO oil I`ve seen. I get it for $6 a quart. Even at auto parts chains` $8.99 a quart it`s still cheaper than the other PAO oils. Plus you don`t have to pay to have it shipped to you. Shipping oil is ridiculously expensive.
I laugh at comments like this. RP can be had for the same or even less than individual qt bottles of name brand synthetics( M1, PP, PU, QS, VVL, etc... )if you shop around. I pay no more than $7 a qt for it here locally and can get it for less than $6 a qt if I order far enough ahead through another local dealer. The average price I pay is $6.25 a qt.
^^2nd on Hemi`s comment. RP is the cheapest PAO oil I`ve seen. I get it for $6 a quart. Even at auto parts chains` $8.99 a quart it`s still cheaper than the other PAO oils. Plus you don`t have to pay to have it shipped to you. Shipping oil is ridiculously expensive.
Another over-hyped oil. Despite the claimed advantages of Grp. IV oil, real-world experience with the Group III hydrocracked oils show they seem to perform just as well (or better in some cases). If extreme cold starting or extreme long change intervals are important I can see some small advantage. Thanks but I'll stick with my SOPUS Group III synthetics and call it a day.
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: Keith Z
I am intrigued that dyno tests show a horsepower improvement.
Absolute, unmitigated hogwash -- not just for Royal Purple, but for any oil.
+1
Quaker State had an advertisement campain that claimed something like: "no oil gives your engine more horsepower than Q-Horsepower." Their advertisement was a play on words. No modern oil, syn or dino, will give you more (noticeable) horsepower than another oil of the same grade, so no oil could give you more power than Q-Horsey. There might be a 0.01% increase in a lab, but other factors could also account for the slight increase in power.
The HP claim by RP was a setup. They ran a thicker oil (10W-40) as a base test, then used a lighter grade of RP (5W-20).
Originally Posted By: Keith Z
I am intrigued that dyno tests show a horsepower improvement.
Absolute, unmitigated hogwash -- not just for Royal Purple, but for any oil.
+1
Quaker State had an advertisement campain that claimed something like: "no oil gives your engine more horsepower than Q-Horsepower." Their advertisement was a play on words. No modern oil, syn or dino, will give you more (noticeable) horsepower than another oil of the same grade, so no oil could give you more power than Q-Horsey. There might be a 0.01% increase in a lab, but other factors could also account for the slight increase in power.
The HP claim by RP was a setup. They ran a thicker oil (10W-40) as a base test, then used a lighter grade of RP (5W-20).
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
^^2nd on Hemi`s comment. RP is the cheapest PAO oil I`ve seen. I get it for $6 a quart. Even at auto parts chains` $8.99 a quart it`s still cheaper than the other PAO oils. Plus you don`t have to pay to have it shipped to you. Shipping oil is ridiculously expensive.
M1 HM 10w-30 SL is 4.19/at at wallmart by the jug. M1 AFE is at least 75% PAO. I can prove thats a PAO oil. Prove that RP is at least 75% PAO base - not that thats GOOD for the motor mind you ... The big deal with RP is its a faux syn with high-ish ZDDP. 0.18%-.2% ZDDP give you a smooth running motor. You want that type of oil CHEAP, then go to Lowes and buy some of the White/Yardman 5w-30 winter snowthrower oil. Ive run it. S-m-o-o-t-h. I bet a VOA and UOA of the Yardman would walk all over the RP. Then it would be RiP RP.
^^2nd on Hemi`s comment. RP is the cheapest PAO oil I`ve seen. I get it for $6 a quart. Even at auto parts chains` $8.99 a quart it`s still cheaper than the other PAO oils. Plus you don`t have to pay to have it shipped to you. Shipping oil is ridiculously expensive.
M1 HM 10w-30 SL is 4.19/at at wallmart by the jug. M1 AFE is at least 75% PAO. I can prove thats a PAO oil. Prove that RP is at least 75% PAO base - not that thats GOOD for the motor mind you ... The big deal with RP is its a faux syn with high-ish ZDDP. 0.18%-.2% ZDDP give you a smooth running motor. You want that type of oil CHEAP, then go to Lowes and buy some of the White/Yardman 5w-30 winter snowthrower oil. Ive run it. S-m-o-o-t-h. I bet a VOA and UOA of the Yardman would walk all over the RP. Then it would be RiP RP.
Last edited:
Energy conserving SM/GF-4 oils MUST show a marked improvement in fuel mileage to get the GF-4 EC rating over a std SM rated say 10w-30. This is all using standardised procedure and test regimen. You guys ever read API certification standards? You know the API application only cost $1,500. bucks(!?)
2.6 Sequence VIB ASTM D6837 SAE 0W-20 and 5W-20 viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 2.3 / 2.0 min
(Required for ILSAC GF-4 only) SAE 0W-30 and 5W-30 viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 1.8 / 1.5 min
SAE 10W-30 and all other viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 1.1 / 0.8 min
Limits for
2.6 Sequence VIB ASTM D6837 SAE 0W-20 and 5W-20 viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 2.3 / 2.0 min
(Required for ILSAC GF-4 only) SAE 0W-30 and 5W-30 viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 1.8 / 1.5 min
SAE 10W-30 and all other viscosity grades % FEI1/%FEI2 1.1 / 0.8 min
Limits for
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
deven said:without micrometer readings or any real supporting data...
Yes, pictures do speak louder than words -- not just sometimes, but always. Please remember that loudness has nothing to do with truth or value.
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: daman
at $6 that's a deal for sure,,load up.
come here to my CarQuest(the only place local for me) you'll fall off your chair!! lol
I don't have to stock up. It never costs me more than $6.25-7 a qt to just walk into a local store( couple local speed shops ). If I can order it ahead by a few days I can get it for $5.75-$6 a qt.
Now, none of the following is meant to be personally offensive. I have no issues with you at all and actually respect you on this board on the whole. I am simply using your comments that you only have a local CarQuest that sells RP and the way you have based your price comments on that one place. This is what I mean by people don't actually look for it and price shop. I can guarantee even without being there and personally visiting the other stores near you that sell RP( or can get it at least )you can get it for far less than $12-$14 a qt.
** Note to Mod's/Administrator - I am not an RP dealer nor an employee of the company. I am not affiliated with them in any way at all. The following info is gathered from their online dealer locator. ***
RP dealers in Bad Axe, MI( besides CarQuest ):
Huron Auto Parts (this is my CQ)
203 South Port Crescent
Bad Axe, MI 48413
(989) 269-9755
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Advance Auto Parts(Last i looked they had none on hand)
815 NORTH VAN DYKE ROAD
BAD AXE, MI 48413
989-269-9800
Products Stocked
Motor Oils: 5W20, 5W30, 10W30
Gear Oils: 75W140
Other: Max ATF
RP dealers within 25 miles of Bad Axe, MI:
Ubly Auto Supply (can only order it,you have freight cost and they only carry limited)2002 Main Street
Ubly, MI 48475
(989) 658-8331
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Ty's Auto Parts & Service (same as above)
7294 Michigan Ave.
Pigeon, MI 48755
(989) 453-3285
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Varty's Napa Auto (have some old stock on hand $12 bucks!!!)147 State St.
Harbor Beach, MI 48441
989-479-3345
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Quality Auto Parts (again would have to order,plus freight cost,rip off)6497 Main
Cass City, MI 48726
(989) 872-3210
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Sebewaing Auto Value (same as above)
8801 S. Unionville Rd.
Sebewaing, MI 48759
(989) 883-9330
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
There is a HUGE list of RP dealers in MI on the whole as well. So it is available "local" to you even if you had to drive 30-40 minutes for it.
http://royalpurple.findlocation.com/
You also have a TON of O'Reilly auto parts in MI according to their web site and they sell RP. They recently had a 5QTS RP w/ filter deal( K&N or RP filter can't recall )for just $39.99. Take out the $10 bucks for the filter( and that is a low ball # )and the oil is $5.99 a qt.
Currently on E-Bay you can get RP by the case or 6qts shipped for approx $7 a qt. Tons of auctions right now for it.
Again, no offense meant. Just pointing out you do have options for it if you chose to use it. It is your right obviously to use what you want. Just pointing out those who say it is too expensive seldom if ever actually shop around. RP is almost always available to people in that $7+/- a qt range. It costs me $6.97 a qt( individual bottle )for name brand Grp III synthetics at Wal-Mart so $7 for RP is hardly too expensive.
see red^^^^
Hemi i know all them places,,a year ago i researched and priced this oil and either 1, i had to order it in witch was crazy money in the end, or 2 they didn't have what i wanted or 3 i wasn't driving that far to get it.
if it was as easy to buy OTC like M1 i would maybe try it,but i'm not going outa my way like above to get a oil,,no oil..
no offence taken man,,next time i'll right a book for ya!!!
Non-sponsors who compete directly w/advertizers shouldn't be listed on the forum.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: daman
at $6 that's a deal for sure,,load up.
come here to my CarQuest(the only place local for me) you'll fall off your chair!! lol
I don't have to stock up. It never costs me more than $6.25-7 a qt to just walk into a local store( couple local speed shops ). If I can order it ahead by a few days I can get it for $5.75-$6 a qt.
Now, none of the following is meant to be personally offensive. I have no issues with you at all and actually respect you on this board on the whole. I am simply using your comments that you only have a local CarQuest that sells RP and the way you have based your price comments on that one place. This is what I mean by people don't actually look for it and price shop. I can guarantee even without being there and personally visiting the other stores near you that sell RP( or can get it at least )you can get it for far less than $12-$14 a qt.
** Note to Mod's/Administrator - I am not an RP dealer nor an employee of the company. I am not affiliated with them in any way at all. The following info is gathered from their online dealer locator. ***
RP dealers in Bad Axe, MI( besides CarQuest ):
Huron Auto Parts (this is my CQ)
203 South Port Crescent
Bad Axe, MI 48413
(989) 269-9755
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Advance Auto Parts(Last i looked they had none on hand)
815 NORTH VAN DYKE ROAD
BAD AXE, MI 48413
989-269-9800
Products Stocked
Motor Oils: 5W20, 5W30, 10W30
Gear Oils: 75W140
Other: Max ATF
RP dealers within 25 miles of Bad Axe, MI:
Ubly Auto Supply (can only order it,you have freight cost and they only carry limited)2002 Main Street
Ubly, MI 48475
(989) 658-8331
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Ty's Auto Parts & Service (same as above)
7294 Michigan Ave.
Pigeon, MI 48755
(989) 453-3285
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Varty's Napa Auto (have some old stock on hand $12 bucks!!!)147 State St.
Harbor Beach, MI 48441
989-479-3345
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Quality Auto Parts (again would have to order,plus freight cost,rip off)6497 Main
Cass City, MI 48726
(989) 872-3210
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
Sebewaing Auto Value (same as above)
8801 S. Unionville Rd.
Sebewaing, MI 48759
(989) 883-9330
Products Stocked
Stocked product information not currently available. Call dealer for more info.
There is a HUGE list of RP dealers in MI on the whole as well. So it is available "local" to you even if you had to drive 30-40 minutes for it.
http://royalpurple.findlocation.com/
You also have a TON of O'Reilly auto parts in MI according to their web site and they sell RP. They recently had a 5QTS RP w/ filter deal( K&N or RP filter can't recall )for just $39.99. Take out the $10 bucks for the filter( and that is a low ball # )and the oil is $5.99 a qt.
Currently on E-Bay you can get RP by the case or 6qts shipped for approx $7 a qt. Tons of auctions right now for it.
Again, no offense meant. Just pointing out you do have options for it if you chose to use it. It is your right obviously to use what you want. Just pointing out those who say it is too expensive seldom if ever actually shop around. RP is almost always available to people in that $7+/- a qt range. It costs me $6.97 a qt( individual bottle )for name brand Grp III synthetics at Wal-Mart so $7 for RP is hardly too expensive.
see red^^^^
Hemi i know all them places,,a year ago i researched and priced this oil and either 1, i had to order it in witch was crazy money in the end, or 2 they didn't have what i wanted or 3 i wasn't driving that far to get it.
if it was as easy to buy OTC like M1 i would maybe try it,but i'm not going outa my way like above to get a oil,,no oil..
no offence taken man,,next time i'll right a book for ya!!!
Non-sponsors who compete directly w/advertizers shouldn't be listed on the forum.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: deven
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: d00df00d
deven said:without micrometer readings or any real supporting data...
Yes, pictures do speak louder than words -- not just sometimes, but always. Please remember that loudness has nothing to do with truth or value.
Unfortunately, due to variances in machining, cams coming out of two separate engines with different production dates don't tell us much.
You'd need before/after measurements of the same cams. Measurements at 0-miles then after measurements to compare the "wear" to draw any sort of conclusion.
There was an interesting picture posted by buster quite some time ago of one of the SEQ tests that is used for camshaft wear. The was a cam with "tracks" on it shown as "pass", whilst there was another that looked polished and shiny and was marked as "fail".
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
There was an interesting picture posted by buster quite some time ago of one of the SEQ tests that is used for camshaft wear. The was a cam with "tracks" on it shown as "pass", whilst there was another that looked polished and shiny and was marked as "fail".
I believe that was me in the original RP cam thread. Sequence IVA pass fail:
Pass:
Fail:
http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/gastests/ivatest/default.htm
There was an interesting picture posted by buster quite some time ago of one of the SEQ tests that is used for camshaft wear. The was a cam with "tracks" on it shown as "pass", whilst there was another that looked polished and shiny and was marked as "fail".
I believe that was me in the original RP cam thread. Sequence IVA pass fail:
Pass:
Fail:
http://www.swri.org/4org/d08/gastests/ivatest/default.htm
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Yes, sorry, that was you Ben. My sincerest apologies!
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Yes, sorry, that was you Ben. My sincerest apologies!
Haha, no apology required bro.
Really does show that without actual before/after measurements, that what one can glean from pictures is quite limited however.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Yes, sorry, that was you Ben. My sincerest apologies!
Haha, no apology required bro.
Really does show that without actual before/after measurements, that what one can glean from pictures is quite limited however.
- Status