Mobil 1 0W-40 vs Amsoil 5W-40 Euro Formula
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Is that the 2.0T engine?
Purely out of curiosity, and because I believe nobody asked about it, what oil requirements does the manual mention?
Sorry not to have made the engine clear. Yes it is the gas engine. Its the new 2.0T FSI engine from VW/Audi.
Interesting range of comments so far! I use 5,000 mile OCI at the moment.
My first oil check at Blackstone was OK but they did have some concern with the iron at 42 and a trace of gas in the oil. Said something about a possible injector leakage, and this possibly causing cylinder wash down and hence the higher iron reading. If I remember correctly I saw another member post their findings with the same engine and they also had a higher iron readings. Perhaps it is a charactor of this engine? Comments?
This was with 5,300 miles on the oil. Car ran from 3,000 miles to 8,300 miles with zero make up oil. In fact oil level did not drop at all.
David
Interesting range of comments so far! I use 5,000 mile OCI at the moment.
My first oil check at Blackstone was OK but they did have some concern with the iron at 42 and a trace of gas in the oil. Said something about a possible injector leakage, and this possibly causing cylinder wash down and hence the higher iron reading. If I remember correctly I saw another member post their findings with the same engine and they also had a higher iron readings. Perhaps it is a charactor of this engine? Comments?
This was with 5,300 miles on the oil. Car ran from 3,000 miles to 8,300 miles with zero make up oil. In fact oil level did not drop at all.
David
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Yes, sure, but what's the manual say about oil? In Europe they want you to use VW 504, but in the US import version they want you to use VW 502 as far as I know.
I wouldn't worry too much about metals at this point as the engine is so young. Just make sure the trend goes down. Did you post your UOA in the BiTOG UOA forum?
I'm with mori on wanted to know what VWoA is asking for in the OM. (It's always mixed up and interesting with them!!)
I'm with mori on wanted to know what VWoA is asking for in the OM. (It's always mixed up and interesting with them!!)
David,
Let me make a general comment....
I've noticed that the various versions of Audis direct injection gas engines seem prone to fuel dilution. So in retrospect, I'd probably go slightly heavier on the oil to compensate for this. That means an SAE 5w-40/10w-40 that's formulated more like an HDEO in terms of high temp, high shear viscosity.
Mobil Delvac 1 provides excellent results in older versions of the 1.8L, VW/Audi turbo and it would be my choice here if you wanted to use a Mobil product. It does not explicitly meet the Vw 502.00 spec,since the main application is for HD diesels. However I've yet to see a turbocharged application where it didn't work better than the 0w-40.
I'm not sure the Amsoil 0w-30 or Series 3000, 5w-30 would be thick enough to compensate for the fuel dilution. I'd be more prone to use their 10w-40/AMO, or perhaps their new 10w-30, four stroke marine oil (HT/HS of 3.64 Cp).
I'd actually expect the Mobil 1, 0w-40 to last a bit longer than the new Amsoil 5w-40, since the 5w-40/AFL has been formulated to meet stricter chemical limits on sulfated ash and has a 8 TBN as a result. I'd give the Amsoil 5w-40 the edge on shear stability and most likely on oil consumption and wear rates. I do think you can do better than 42 ppm of Fe in only 5000 miles of use. I've been seeing 12-17 ppm of Fe after 10,000 miles of use in my 2002 Audi and I've tested five different Amsoil formulations so far.
TS
Let me make a general comment....
I've noticed that the various versions of Audis direct injection gas engines seem prone to fuel dilution. So in retrospect, I'd probably go slightly heavier on the oil to compensate for this. That means an SAE 5w-40/10w-40 that's formulated more like an HDEO in terms of high temp, high shear viscosity.
Mobil Delvac 1 provides excellent results in older versions of the 1.8L, VW/Audi turbo and it would be my choice here if you wanted to use a Mobil product. It does not explicitly meet the Vw 502.00 spec,since the main application is for HD diesels. However I've yet to see a turbocharged application where it didn't work better than the 0w-40.
I'm not sure the Amsoil 0w-30 or Series 3000, 5w-30 would be thick enough to compensate for the fuel dilution. I'd be more prone to use their 10w-40/AMO, or perhaps their new 10w-30, four stroke marine oil (HT/HS of 3.64 Cp).
I'd actually expect the Mobil 1, 0w-40 to last a bit longer than the new Amsoil 5w-40, since the 5w-40/AFL has been formulated to meet stricter chemical limits on sulfated ash and has a 8 TBN as a result. I'd give the Amsoil 5w-40 the edge on shear stability and most likely on oil consumption and wear rates. I do think you can do better than 42 ppm of Fe in only 5000 miles of use. I've been seeing 12-17 ppm of Fe after 10,000 miles of use in my 2002 Audi and I've tested five different Amsoil formulations so far.
TS
Not sure if the manual says VW 502 or 504 (I think it's 502), but the viscosity for the 2.0t engine is 5W-40
I agree with TS on this one now that we have fuel dillution in the mix. M1 0W40 would not be a good choice at all under those conditions!You definately need a thicker oil. If you are going to look at 5W40's and 10W40 add Redline and Rotella-T synthetic to the list as well. If you are going to stick with short sub 9000 mile OCI I would have to try the Rotella-T synthetic based on cost and viscosity alone.
I'd take Delvac 1, Rotella T, Schaeffers 9000 or GC over either of these oils in this application.
The M1 0W-40 needs a very large sump to hold up over longer runs. This is not one of those instances. And especially not when you add a turbo to the equation.
The M1 0W-40 needs a very large sump to hold up over longer runs. This is not one of those instances. And especially not when you add a turbo to the equation.
Volvo head I did a close to 10,000 mile OCI with it in a 3.9 quart sump and wear numbers looked good and it had strong TBN as well. It also had 8 onces of SX-UP in the mix.I did not have fuel dillution issue though.
Not trying to be a butthead - but I'm usually the guy getting mugged for recommending high ZDDP oils for new cars. I have no doubt those oils would work, and would have great wear numbers. Shouldn't we stay within "the parameters"?
The manual calls for a 502 spec oil in a 5W-40. As for the 504 spec mentioned what oils meet that?
I would like to go with a 5W-40 next time. So maybe I will go with the Delvac as it is a 5W-40. Where does one find it as Walmart does not carry the 5W-40 SUV M1 any more?
I wonder if the direct injection results in the higher fuel dilution of the oil? With BMW now fitting this technology to the latest engines it will be interesting to see how the oil checks out.
David
I would like to go with a 5W-40 next time. So maybe I will go with the Delvac as it is a 5W-40. Where does one find it as Walmart does not carry the 5W-40 SUV M1 any more?
I wonder if the direct injection results in the higher fuel dilution of the oil? With BMW now fitting this technology to the latest engines it will be interesting to see how the oil checks out.
David
In no particular order:
1. Amsoil oils that TooSlick recommended sound great
2. Valvoline Synpower 5W-40 from Napa (part # VV966; must order usually)
3. Delvac 1 (or equivalent; if you can find it)
4. Lubromoly 0W-40 (a thin 40 weight but it's plenty thick enough) or 5W-40
5. Pentosin 5W-40 (it shears but gives great wear #'s in UOAs, unlike M1 0W-40)
6. Mix of M1 XW-30 (not-so-hot) and some M1 15W-50 EP (helps make up for not-so-hot M1 xW-30 with viscosity and anti-wear additives)
7. Rotella T 5W-40 (love the additive package and basestocks hold their own)
8. Any VW 505.01 oil (if all else fails)
Don't buy: M1 0W-40 (good at marathons (TBN retention) but not much else) or Syntec 5W-40 (burned in my VW 1.8T engine while others did not) or GC (oh the sin for me saying that!; 2.0T owners report oil consumption with it and so-so UOAs)
1. Amsoil oils that TooSlick recommended sound great
2. Valvoline Synpower 5W-40 from Napa (part # VV966; must order usually)
3. Delvac 1 (or equivalent; if you can find it)
4. Lubromoly 0W-40 (a thin 40 weight but it's plenty thick enough) or 5W-40
5. Pentosin 5W-40 (it shears but gives great wear #'s in UOAs, unlike M1 0W-40)
6. Mix of M1 XW-30 (not-so-hot) and some M1 15W-50 EP (helps make up for not-so-hot M1 xW-30 with viscosity and anti-wear additives)
7. Rotella T 5W-40 (love the additive package and basestocks hold their own)
8. Any VW 505.01 oil (if all else fails)
Don't buy: M1 0W-40 (good at marathons (TBN retention) but not much else) or Syntec 5W-40 (burned in my VW 1.8T engine while others did not) or GC (oh the sin for me saying that!; 2.0T owners report oil consumption with it and so-so UOAs)
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Your US import version doesn't require VW 504 oil. However you may use it. Here's a list of VW 504/507 oils. Some are available in the US:
Addinol Addinol Mega Light MV0539 LE SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Agip Agip 7008 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Agip Autol Carrera Longlife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Aral Aral SuperTronic LongLife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Astris Astris Matro L-3 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Avia Aviasynth 5W-30 LongLife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
BP BP Visco 7000 Longlife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Bucher AG Motorex Profile V-XL SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Castrol Castrol Edge SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Castrol Castrol SLX LongLife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Castrol Castrol TXT 507 00 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Castrol Castrol LongLife III Hochleistungsmotorenöl SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Castrol Castrol SLX Longlife III Topup SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Cepsa Cepsa Star TDI Synth SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Chevron Havoline Ultra V SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Elf Elf Solaris LLX SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Eurol Eurol Syntence Longlife SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Fuchs Fuchs TITAN GT1 Longlife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Galp Energia Galp Formula Longlife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Gamaparts Energia Gamaparts Super Longlife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Liqui Moly Top Tec 4200 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Meguin Megol Motorenöl Compatible SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Mobil Mobil 1 ESP Formula SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Mol MOL Dynamic Gold Longlife SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Panolin Panolin Avanis SV-X SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Pentosin Pento Super Performance III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Repsol Repsol Elite Longlife 50700/50400 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Shell Shell Helix Ultra VX SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Slovnaft Madit Gold Longlife SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
SRS Schmierstoff Vertrieb Wintershall ViVA1 SLV plus SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Statoil Statoil LazerWay LL SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Techno Tecar Motorenöl 504 00 / 507 00 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Total Total Quartz Ineo 504-507 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Valvoline Statoil LazerWay LL SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
VAPS Vapsoil 507 00 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Volkswagen Volkswagen LongLife III SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Zeller+Gmelin Divinol Syntholight 03 SAE 5W-30 504 00 / 507 00
Oh yeah, all VW 504/507 oils are 5W-30 (but with HTHS=/>3,5), so far.
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I just posted my UOA of German Castrol compared to M1 0W 40. The M1 seemed to due better and is definitely a long drain oil
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