Extended OCI while under warranty?
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Originally Posted By: turtlevette
You seem to very concerned about dealer "rights". The guys that are constantly acting in questionable ways toward the car owner. You're calling someone dishonest. I bet you saw a lot of dishonest at your work and I bet it wasn't coming from the customers.
I'm no fan of dealers and agree with your point that OCIs won't prevent a dealer from being dishonest. On the other hand, NHHEMI's point is well taken. The dealer "screwing" people isn't a valid excuse for me "screwing" the dealer.
We extended OCIs on the taxis, irrespective of warranty. But that's a different situation from someone with their own personal car who doesn't have a shop full of tools to do a rebuild or other repairs himself if the dealer waffles.
You seem to very concerned about dealer "rights". The guys that are constantly acting in questionable ways toward the car owner. You're calling someone dishonest. I bet you saw a lot of dishonest at your work and I bet it wasn't coming from the customers.
I'm no fan of dealers and agree with your point that OCIs won't prevent a dealer from being dishonest. On the other hand, NHHEMI's point is well taken. The dealer "screwing" people isn't a valid excuse for me "screwing" the dealer.
We extended OCIs on the taxis, irrespective of warranty. But that's a different situation from someone with their own personal car who doesn't have a shop full of tools to do a rebuild or other repairs himself if the dealer waffles.
Originally Posted By: turtlevette
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
The car mfg has a right to set certain requirements the consumer must adhere to for the factory warranty to remain in effect. That is reasonable IMO.
You seem to very concerned about dealer "rights". The guys that are constantly acting in questionable ways toward the car owner. You're calling someone dishonest. I bet you saw a lot of dishonest at your work and I bet it wasn't coming from the customers.
A head gasket has absolutely nothing to do with OCIs. Its a shame people are not more educated on automotive issues.
A person could make a good case for extended OCIs in court. Using a high quality synthetic oil, arguing that service was mild, and making a case that you're being environmentally friendly are all very good arguments. We're trying to save the planet here not just being irresponsible with maintenance. The big piggish polluting car manufs need to be punished.
The oil companies warrant the use of their high end oils for 15K+ miles being another big argument.
1st of all it isn't about "dealer rights". The dealer doesn't provide the warranty the car mfg does. I am not really concerned about the car mfg's right either but rather my rights as a consumer. MY rights as a consumer are in large part based on adhering to warranty policy from the car mfg though. Car mfg's have the right to set terms the consumer must follow in order to preserve the factory warranty on the new car they just bought. If I as the consumer don't follow those terms "I" just voided my warranty not the car mfg.
You, like so many, seem to group all dealerships and all dealer employees into a whole and that is just not right. And for the record TONS of people come to the dealer and lie like a rug to try and get something THEY did fixed under warranty. Yes, lots of dealerships/dealership employees are dishonest. However, many customers are as well.
Not all dealerships are dishonest nor are all the dealer employees employee's crooked or stupid. I was very honest as were the parts and service folks I worked with. I made it a point to be educated on the vehicles we serviced. I actually questioned( as much as I could )any questionable policies we had. The issues where I worked stemmed from the owner who was not overly ethical at times. The service manager, parts manager, and myself( assistant parts manager - also worked the service counter a LOT )did what we could to be honest/ethical but you can't argue with the owner and keep your job.
When did I, or anyone else, say anything about a head gasket failure and OCI's? I went out of my way to specifically state that OCI would only come into play in specific engine failure cases. Kind of exaggerating for effect there a bit are we?
I hope you never go to court in a case like this topic is about. Seriously? You would argue saving the planet as a valid and LEGAL defense for exceeding the mfg's OCI limits? Wow. The only thing that matters in any case is the law. In a car warranty dispute involving the OCI did the owner follow the OCI limits that are clearly stated by the car mfg in the owner's manual( or a service manual or some kind of addendum/TSB )is all that will matter. That is IT! Did you follow those requirements( within reason - as said earlier 2 weeks and/or 500 miles over is ok but 6 months and 5K+ over is not ). Your "impassioned" argument to the judge about saving the planet, punishing the evil car mfg, synthetics are better, etc... are really meaningless. LEGAL reasons will determine the outcome not emotional ones or even technically accurate ones if they go against the warranty contract.
What the oil company warrants their oil for mileage wise is irrelevant if you are talking about the car mfg's factory warranty and a court case. Means nothing. The only way it comes into play is if the car mfg says no you can then try and get the oil mfg who has a 15K warranty to cover it( best of luck ).
I don't want to get into a huge "who's manhood is bigger" contest here with you. I am simply giving my answer to the OP's question based on experience dealing with this not only as a consumer who had to have an engine replaced under warranty( actually my Sister's 06 Impala - but I handled it all for her )but also as someone who has worked dealer service and dealt with warranty in cases like this. If you think different that is your right. I know that I will never mess with the warranty unless I am fully prepared to pay the consequences if something happens. I follow the warranty requirements. I use the brands( parts and fluids )I want but I make sure they meet all spec's and I do the maintenance within the mfg's allowed for timeline. They are happy, I am happy, and if something goes wrong it gets fixed with no hassle.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
The car mfg has a right to set certain requirements the consumer must adhere to for the factory warranty to remain in effect. That is reasonable IMO.
You seem to very concerned about dealer "rights". The guys that are constantly acting in questionable ways toward the car owner. You're calling someone dishonest. I bet you saw a lot of dishonest at your work and I bet it wasn't coming from the customers.
A head gasket has absolutely nothing to do with OCIs. Its a shame people are not more educated on automotive issues.
A person could make a good case for extended OCIs in court. Using a high quality synthetic oil, arguing that service was mild, and making a case that you're being environmentally friendly are all very good arguments. We're trying to save the planet here not just being irresponsible with maintenance. The big piggish polluting car manufs need to be punished.
The oil companies warrant the use of their high end oils for 15K+ miles being another big argument.
1st of all it isn't about "dealer rights". The dealer doesn't provide the warranty the car mfg does. I am not really concerned about the car mfg's right either but rather my rights as a consumer. MY rights as a consumer are in large part based on adhering to warranty policy from the car mfg though. Car mfg's have the right to set terms the consumer must follow in order to preserve the factory warranty on the new car they just bought. If I as the consumer don't follow those terms "I" just voided my warranty not the car mfg.
You, like so many, seem to group all dealerships and all dealer employees into a whole and that is just not right. And for the record TONS of people come to the dealer and lie like a rug to try and get something THEY did fixed under warranty. Yes, lots of dealerships/dealership employees are dishonest. However, many customers are as well.
Not all dealerships are dishonest nor are all the dealer employees employee's crooked or stupid. I was very honest as were the parts and service folks I worked with. I made it a point to be educated on the vehicles we serviced. I actually questioned( as much as I could )any questionable policies we had. The issues where I worked stemmed from the owner who was not overly ethical at times. The service manager, parts manager, and myself( assistant parts manager - also worked the service counter a LOT )did what we could to be honest/ethical but you can't argue with the owner and keep your job.
When did I, or anyone else, say anything about a head gasket failure and OCI's? I went out of my way to specifically state that OCI would only come into play in specific engine failure cases. Kind of exaggerating for effect there a bit are we?
I hope you never go to court in a case like this topic is about. Seriously? You would argue saving the planet as a valid and LEGAL defense for exceeding the mfg's OCI limits? Wow. The only thing that matters in any case is the law. In a car warranty dispute involving the OCI did the owner follow the OCI limits that are clearly stated by the car mfg in the owner's manual( or a service manual or some kind of addendum/TSB )is all that will matter. That is IT! Did you follow those requirements( within reason - as said earlier 2 weeks and/or 500 miles over is ok but 6 months and 5K+ over is not ). Your "impassioned" argument to the judge about saving the planet, punishing the evil car mfg, synthetics are better, etc... are really meaningless. LEGAL reasons will determine the outcome not emotional ones or even technically accurate ones if they go against the warranty contract.
What the oil company warrants their oil for mileage wise is irrelevant if you are talking about the car mfg's factory warranty and a court case. Means nothing. The only way it comes into play is if the car mfg says no you can then try and get the oil mfg who has a 15K warranty to cover it( best of luck ).
I don't want to get into a huge "who's manhood is bigger" contest here with you. I am simply giving my answer to the OP's question based on experience dealing with this not only as a consumer who had to have an engine replaced under warranty( actually my Sister's 06 Impala - but I handled it all for her )but also as someone who has worked dealer service and dealt with warranty in cases like this. If you think different that is your right. I know that I will never mess with the warranty unless I am fully prepared to pay the consequences if something happens. I follow the warranty requirements. I use the brands( parts and fluids )I want but I make sure they meet all spec's and I do the maintenance within the mfg's allowed for timeline. They are happy, I am happy, and if something goes wrong it gets fixed with no hassle.
Originally Posted By: wemay
I have always gone by the manufacturers recommendation while under warranty but...
How many of you have gone counter your Owner's Manual recommendation and used Extended OCI while under powertrain warranty? If the risk of engine issues due to oil is so small...is the risk worth it?
I ask because Mobil1 offers their guarantee/warranty for 15,000 miles or your manufacturers recommended interval, which ever is longer.
https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-1-ep-oil-warranty
What the period of coverage is
The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 15,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer.
I have extended OCI's on many cars that I've owned. However, I should say that I've never owned a car with a DI engine or turbo, and have also had the fortune of owning cars with "sound" mechanicals that were not known for having internal engine problems (other problems, sure, but not internal engine related stuff).
My last new car before my current one was purchased brand new (2005 Altima 3.5L V6). The Nissan manual was clear about 6000 km (3750 mile) OCI's for severe service, and 12,000 km (7500 mile) OCI's for normal service. While I did drive mostly highway and mostly long trips, I can't say that I was a perfect "normal" service customer. Some of my driving did fall under the severe category. But, I upgraded from a conventional oil to a top tier synthetic and always went by the "normal" service guidelines. So, I was still within warranty compliance for the most part, and the only thing I'd have to argue about was the fact that my driving was normal...
And after driving that car for 220,000 km and selling it, I never did have any kind of drivetrain issue whatsoever (not even the dreaded timing chain issues that the VQ was known for, although they may have been starting to show their heads at that point). Also, within the first two years of ownership, my warranty was up anyway (4 years for the powertrain warranty) due to my yearly mileage accumulation at the time.
With my current car, this is something I do not have to worry about anymore... Benz specs 20,000 km (13,000 mile) OCI's or one year, whichever comes first (and the car will tell me in either case when the service is coming up, and exactly what needs to be done from oil changes to air filters to spark plugs to brake fluid flushes)... Couldn't be any easier than that.
I have always gone by the manufacturers recommendation while under warranty but...
How many of you have gone counter your Owner's Manual recommendation and used Extended OCI while under powertrain warranty? If the risk of engine issues due to oil is so small...is the risk worth it?
I ask because Mobil1 offers their guarantee/warranty for 15,000 miles or your manufacturers recommended interval, which ever is longer.
https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-1-ep-oil-warranty
What the period of coverage is
The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 15,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer.
I have extended OCI's on many cars that I've owned. However, I should say that I've never owned a car with a DI engine or turbo, and have also had the fortune of owning cars with "sound" mechanicals that were not known for having internal engine problems (other problems, sure, but not internal engine related stuff).
My last new car before my current one was purchased brand new (2005 Altima 3.5L V6). The Nissan manual was clear about 6000 km (3750 mile) OCI's for severe service, and 12,000 km (7500 mile) OCI's for normal service. While I did drive mostly highway and mostly long trips, I can't say that I was a perfect "normal" service customer. Some of my driving did fall under the severe category. But, I upgraded from a conventional oil to a top tier synthetic and always went by the "normal" service guidelines. So, I was still within warranty compliance for the most part, and the only thing I'd have to argue about was the fact that my driving was normal...
And after driving that car for 220,000 km and selling it, I never did have any kind of drivetrain issue whatsoever (not even the dreaded timing chain issues that the VQ was known for, although they may have been starting to show their heads at that point). Also, within the first two years of ownership, my warranty was up anyway (4 years for the powertrain warranty) due to my yearly mileage accumulation at the time.
With my current car, this is something I do not have to worry about anymore... Benz specs 20,000 km (13,000 mile) OCI's or one year, whichever comes first (and the car will tell me in either case when the service is coming up, and exactly what needs to be done from oil changes to air filters to spark plugs to brake fluid flushes)... Couldn't be any easier than that.
Originally Posted By: il_signore97
Originally Posted By: wemay
I have always gone by the manufacturers recommendation while under warranty but...
How many of you have gone counter your Owner's Manual recommendation and used Extended OCI while under powertrain warranty? If the risk of engine issues due to oil is so small...is the risk worth it?
I ask because Mobil1 offers their guarantee/warranty for 15,000 miles or your manufacturers recommended interval, which ever is longer.
https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-1-ep-oil-warranty
What the period of coverage is
The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 15,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer.
I have extended OCI's on many cars that I've owned. However, I should say that I've never owned a car with a DI engine or turbo, and have also had the fortune of owning cars with "sound" mechanicals that were not known for having internal engine problems (other problems, sure, but not internal engine related stuff).
My last new car before my current one was purchased brand new (2005 Altima 3.5L V6). The Nissan manual was clear about 6000 km (3750 mile) OCI's for severe service, and 12,000 km (7500 mile) OCI's for normal service. While I did drive mostly highway and mostly long trips, I can't say that I was a perfect "normal" service customer. Some of my driving did fall under the severe category. But, I upgraded from a conventional oil to a top tier synthetic and always went by the "normal" service guidelines. So, I was still within warranty compliance for the most part, and the only thing I'd have to argue about was the fact that my driving was normal...
And after driving that car for 220,000 km and selling it, I never did have any kind of drivetrain issue whatsoever (not even the dreaded timing chain issues that the VQ was known for, although they may have been starting to show their heads at that point). Also, within the first two years of ownership, my warranty was up anyway (4 years for the powertrain warranty) due to my yearly mileage accumulation at the time.
With my current car, this is something I do not have to worry about anymore... Benz specs 20,000 km (13,000 mile) OCI's or one year, whichever comes first (and the car will tell me in either case when the service is coming up, and exactly what needs to be done from oil changes to air filters to spark plugs to brake fluid flushes)... Couldn't be any easier than that.
If a MB breaks it BREAKS BAD!
From experience
Originally Posted By: wemay
I have always gone by the manufacturers recommendation while under warranty but...
How many of you have gone counter your Owner's Manual recommendation and used Extended OCI while under powertrain warranty? If the risk of engine issues due to oil is so small...is the risk worth it?
I ask because Mobil1 offers their guarantee/warranty for 15,000 miles or your manufacturers recommended interval, which ever is longer.
https://mobiloil.com/en/article/warranties/limited-warranty/mobil-1-ep-oil-warranty
What the period of coverage is
The Mobil 1 Extended Performance limited warranty is valid for 15,000 miles or your vehicle’s OEM recommended oil change interval, whichever is longer.
I have extended OCI's on many cars that I've owned. However, I should say that I've never owned a car with a DI engine or turbo, and have also had the fortune of owning cars with "sound" mechanicals that were not known for having internal engine problems (other problems, sure, but not internal engine related stuff).
My last new car before my current one was purchased brand new (2005 Altima 3.5L V6). The Nissan manual was clear about 6000 km (3750 mile) OCI's for severe service, and 12,000 km (7500 mile) OCI's for normal service. While I did drive mostly highway and mostly long trips, I can't say that I was a perfect "normal" service customer. Some of my driving did fall under the severe category. But, I upgraded from a conventional oil to a top tier synthetic and always went by the "normal" service guidelines. So, I was still within warranty compliance for the most part, and the only thing I'd have to argue about was the fact that my driving was normal...
And after driving that car for 220,000 km and selling it, I never did have any kind of drivetrain issue whatsoever (not even the dreaded timing chain issues that the VQ was known for, although they may have been starting to show their heads at that point). Also, within the first two years of ownership, my warranty was up anyway (4 years for the powertrain warranty) due to my yearly mileage accumulation at the time.
With my current car, this is something I do not have to worry about anymore... Benz specs 20,000 km (13,000 mile) OCI's or one year, whichever comes first (and the car will tell me in either case when the service is coming up, and exactly what needs to be done from oil changes to air filters to spark plugs to brake fluid flushes)... Couldn't be any easier than that.
If a MB breaks it BREAKS BAD!
From experience
Originally Posted By: IveBeenRued
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
Oil Analysis will prove the oil is fine.
Originally Posted By: zpinch
Oil Analysis will prove the oil is fine.
Assuming you actually get the old oil before it is drained off and disposed of/contaminated you can have it tested or the car mfg can. Unfortunately, it isn't always obvious the engine is toasted/seriously damaged( I mean what is wrong )and the oil is drained and not always into a clean and separate container so it actually can be tested. If you suspect catastrophic damage you best make sure they get a sample for testing if this is the route you choose to go.
It also assumes a judge will listen, understand, and give a hoot when you tell him "I know I went 6 months and 5000+ more than allowed but the oil is still good".
Oil Analysis will prove the oil is fine.
Assuming you actually get the old oil before it is drained off and disposed of/contaminated you can have it tested or the car mfg can. Unfortunately, it isn't always obvious the engine is toasted/seriously damaged( I mean what is wrong )and the oil is drained and not always into a clean and separate container so it actually can be tested. If you suspect catastrophic damage you best make sure they get a sample for testing if this is the route you choose to go.
It also assumes a judge will listen, understand, and give a hoot when you tell him "I know I went 6 months and 5000+ more than allowed but the oil is still good".
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: IveBeenRued
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
demarpaint;
I understand your point and I apologize if my comment offended you. While I would not do what you did I can certainly see why you would want to with just 6 months and 2000 miles on your synthetic OC.
I am talking more about those who have say an allowed for 6/7500 OCI who go 12+/10-15K+ before changing it and make up false change points to fool the car mfg if warranty arises.
Your situation is more common sense while the other is what I would call dishonest.
Originally Posted By: IveBeenRued
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
demarpaint;
I understand your point and I apologize if my comment offended you. While I would not do what you did I can certainly see why you would want to with just 6 months and 2000 miles on your synthetic OC.
I am talking more about those who have say an allowed for 6/7500 OCI who go 12+/10-15K+ before changing it and make up false change points to fool the car mfg if warranty arises.
Your situation is more common sense while the other is what I would call dishonest.
wemay
Site Donor 2023
You make fair balanced points NHHEMI. I will just stick to my Owner's Manual recommendation of 7500 miles for the 2.4 and 5000 for the 2.0T. I preach peace-of-mind on here often. I'm going to follow that edict.
Originally Posted By: NHHEMI
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: IveBeenRued
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
demarpaint;
I understand your point and I apologize if my comment offended you. While I would not do what you did I can certainly see why you would want to with just 6 months and 2000 miles on your synthetic OC.
I am talking more about those who have say an allowed for 6/7500 OCI who go 12+/10-15K+ before changing it and make up false change points to fool the car mfg if warranty arises.
Your situation is more common sense while the other is what I would call dishonest.
No problem. If I had 4 or 5K miles on the oil in 6 months out if would go. A good synthetic or not while under warranty, which stipulates 6 months/7,500 miles IIRC. 2,000 miles and I'll fake it.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: IveBeenRued
Just buy enough oil for multiple oil changes and keep the receipts. If something happens just produce the receipts as evidence that you purchased enough oil for 2, 3, 4... oil changes and make up the "dates" of the phantom oil changes even if you only do one or two extended oil change intervals. There is no way that they will be able to tell that you racked up 10K miles when you were supposed to change it at 7.5K. It would be your word and with documentation, against them.
That's how I did my virtual oil changes. Some might say that's dishonest, oh well. I wasn't about to dump good synthetic oil that was in the sump for 6 months with 1,500-2,000 miles on it. No warranty claims either so it paid off.
demarpaint;
I understand your point and I apologize if my comment offended you. While I would not do what you did I can certainly see why you would want to with just 6 months and 2000 miles on your synthetic OC.
I am talking more about those who have say an allowed for 6/7500 OCI who go 12+/10-15K+ before changing it and make up false change points to fool the car mfg if warranty arises.
Your situation is more common sense while the other is what I would call dishonest.
No problem. If I had 4 or 5K miles on the oil in 6 months out if would go. A good synthetic or not while under warranty, which stipulates 6 months/7,500 miles IIRC. 2,000 miles and I'll fake it.
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