Fram Orange Can O' Delight PH3614 Cut Open @ 5385 Miles

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: Motorking
Yep, what he said above.
Honestly not even sure why the fram haters are so stuck. Seven out of the top ten selling cars sold in the USA left the factory with our filters. Why? because they take dirt out of the oil and isnt that what its supposed to do? Sometimes we wonder of sales would go up if we stuffed the can with plain cellulose media at maybe 60+ pleats, went to steel end caps and 60 efficiency and a fancy paint job if sales would go up. By many "filter experts" logic, they would. Filter efficiency and capacity per square inch of media is all that matters, all media is far from being equal

Comparing filter media of Fram Extra Guard with Tough Guard of a same model such as 7317 for most Honda, which one has more area ? I know that Tough Guard has better media(more synthetic) than Extra Guard.

The worst part of Fram Extra Guard is not adequate filter media, while the Tough Guard and Ultra have good amount.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
The worst part of Fram Extra Guard is not adequate filter media, while the Tough Guard and Ultra have good amount.


What really defines "adequate"? I've seen filters for 5.0L high HP V8s have less media area than one for a 2.4L 4-cylinder.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: MrQuackers

This side has adequate media.

This side does not. This is 1 of the reasons I don't like to use Extra Guard in my cars anymore, I had many Fram Extra Guard oil filters in my previous and current cars, but I stop using it few years ago because of some pictures like this popped up on internet.
Originally Posted By: MrQuackers

 

[ZeeOSix]

^^^ When I hear the term "adequate" I think of things like media efficiency, area and holding capacity. Pleat spacing is a different issue IMO. You could have plenty of media area, but the pleat spacing might not be even as you've shown in the photos above.

 

[MrQuackers]

I do not see the issue. This is a mass produced product that retails for less than $5 that after 5000+ miles is fully intact with no damage. Even spacing, how would that have a measurable difference in the efficiency over the FCI?

 

[KCJeep]

Originally Posted By: MrQuackers
Even spacing, how would that have a measurable difference in the efficiency over the FCI?


None, it's entirely a "visual" issue and has no more bearing on actual performance than a Puro with wavy pleats does. The silly hate over the endcaps is the same thing, "visual" aversion as opposed to real understanding of function and performance.

JMO.

 

[webfors]

Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Originally Posted By: MrQuackers
Even spacing, how would that have a measurable difference in the efficiency over the FCI?


None, it's entirely a "visual" issue and has no more bearing on actual performance than a Puro with wavy pleats does. The silly hate over the endcaps is the same thing, "visual" aversion as opposed to real understanding of function and performance.

JMO.


I disagree. A filter with wide pleat spacing and/or uneven pleat spacing is perfectly adequate until it's not. Meaning, a filter's media strength has much to do with tight even pleating. The majority of failures I've seen with respect to media is a direct result of this "inadequacy". I can guarantee you the filter above has one side that is much stronger than the other as a result of this uneven pleating.

I have no problem with the fiber end caps, the ecore plastic center cage, or any other design. As long as the media is strong as a result of straight, even and plenty of pleating.

 

[KCJeep]

Originally Posted By: webfors


I have no problem with the fiber end caps, the ecore plastic center cage, or any other design. As long as the media is strong as a result of straight, even and plenty of pleating.


Even pleats and lots of pleats certainly are a good thing. Especially if the media is weak. But not all media is created equal. Fram's is unusually strong, which is how they get away with less of it. Not very visually impressive though, on that we can agree!

 

[webfors]

Originally Posted By: KCJeep
Originally Posted By: webfors


I have no problem with the fiber end caps, the ecore plastic center cage, or any other design. As long as the media is strong as a result of straight, even and plenty of pleating.


Even pleats and lots of pleats certainly are a good thing. Especially if the media is weak. But not all media is created equal. Fram's is unusually strong, which is how they get away with less of it. Not very visually impressive though, on that we can agree!



I'll give you that... even the cheapest FRAM media has little bend to it. If Purolator used FRAM's OCOD media, they wouldn't be having their tearing epidemic.

Regardless, I still want more pleats LOL

 

[MrQuackers]

My first video posting here.

View My Video

I hope it worked. Can't tell from this Droid device.

 

[dlundblad]

It was a video of a guy holding an oil filter and talking about our shady guberment?

 

[HerrStig]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
I used the orange can as a matter of preference for years after CR published an oil filter comparo back in the eighties.
The Fram showed impressive filtering efficiency and it was available everywhere for cheap.
I began lurking here eight or ten years ago and switched to Purolators based upon what I read here. The P1, introduced later, was cheap after AAP coupon code when on sale and has filtering efficiency few oil filters can match at any price tier, at least until the media tears.
I've got six Ultras that I got on deals lined up for the '12 Accord and a number of TGs and EGs picked up cheaply from Lowes for various other applications.
Question for you.
How long should the basic orange can be left in service in months and miles?
Not trying to pin you down on this, but I'd really like to know what Fram's recommendation is.
The 5.4K filter shown in this thread still looks good, with nice straight pleats and no tears.
How much longer would be reasonable?
Fram has changed hands about three times since the 80s.

 

[SilverC6]

A wide pleat spacing would have to put an inordinately larger pressure load on that segment of the filter than the tighter pleats adjacent to it.

So, everything else being equal, give me tight, evenly spaced pleats every time.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: SilverC6
A wide pleat spacing would have to put an inordinately larger pressure load on that segment of the filter than the tighter pleats adjacent to it.


And if the media was weak, it probably would have torn.

 

[CT8]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Originally Posted By: MrQuackers

The only thing I don't like much about Extra Guard is lack of filter media as shown in this picture. If they increase filter media by about 1/3 then it is okay.
Then it is a Tough guard

 

[webfors]

Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: SilverC6
A wide pleat spacing would have to put an inordinately larger pressure load on that segment of the filter than the tighter pleats adjacent to it.


And if the media was weak, it probably would have torn.


Bingo.

There's simply no excuse for the sloppy pleating. Almost every cartridge filter I've seen has straight, even, and plenty of pleating.

 

[highlifter]

Originally Posted By: Motorking
Yep, what he said above.
Honestly not even sure why the fram haters are so stuck. Seven out of the top ten selling cars sold in the USA left the factory with our filters. Why? because they take dirt out of the oil and isnt that what its supposed to do?


Are you for real? Car makers care about one thing: protect the bottom line. If a part is even 1 penny cheaper they will select it over another. And big surprise Fram wins the bid as the cheapest supplier and they are the poorest quality filter available. Sometimes correlation does equal causation. People aren't "stuck", they're educated.

 

[David1]

Originally Posted By: MrQuackers
Installed on an SL2 engine. Initial fill was ~3.6 quarts of Pennzoil Platinum 5w-20 and 0.4 quart Valvoline NGMLHM 10w-40. 4 quarts top-off: 2.5 quarts of VNGML 10w-40, 0.5 quart Valvoline VR1 SAE60, 1 quart Rislone Engine Treatment. On oil change day (1/31) I performed a flush using Chemtool B-12. After 20 minutes of idling I drained the oil and refilled the sump with some MS5K and some MMO leaving the PH3614 in place. I then took a short drive and then drained again and installed a FL-400S and refilled with 1.5 quarts PP 5w-20 & 2.5 quarts of PP 5w-30. So this filter put up with a lot for its entry level status.

Filter was base down for 5 days before I cut it.

Here is the total that was still trapped after cutting

Looks pretty good all around

Here is a shot of the dome end to see the impression from the relief valve

I think I paid $1.59 for this at Lowes. The media was rock solid all around. The ADBV was amazingly soft. I think I may have got my money's worth on this filter.




was this for a car or motorcyle or lawnmower???

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: highlifter
Originally Posted By: Motorking
Yep, what he said above.
Honestly not even sure why the fram haters are so stuck. Seven out of the top ten selling cars sold in the USA left the factory with our filters. Why? because they take dirt out of the oil and isnt that what its supposed to do?


Are you for real? Car makers care about one thing: protect the bottom line. If a part is even 1 penny cheaper they will select it over another. And big surprise Fram wins the bid as the cheapest supplier and they are the poorest quality filter available. Sometimes correlation does equal causation. People aren't "stuck", they're educated.


Car manufacturers aren't going to use parts that are going to jeopardize their product in terms of warranty claims, etc, no matter how much cheaper they are in cost. The Frams that leave on cars coming out of the factory might not be built to the same specs as other over-the-counter Frams, but to the specs of the auto manufacturer using them on the assembly lines.

 

[Nate1979]

Originally Posted By: highlifter
Originally Posted By: Motorking
Yep, what he said above.
Honestly not even sure why the fram haters are so stuck. Seven out of the top ten selling cars sold in the USA left the factory with our filters. Why? because they take dirt out of the oil and isnt that what its supposed to do?


Are you for real? Car makers care about one thing: protect the bottom line. If a part is even 1 penny cheaper they will select it over another. And big surprise Fram wins the bid as the cheapest supplier and they are the poorest quality filter available. Sometimes correlation does equal causation. People aren't "stuck", they're educated.


Wow, 5 posts and most are bashing Fram and especially Motorking.