Mobil 1 Extended Performance More Engine Wear

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The two companies aren't even in the same league. Amsoil cannot and will never be an OEM spec'd fluid. Even if they could swing the deal, they would never be able to handle the aftermarket volume to supply any sizable usage.

XOM does that because they can. Every dime of R&D working with OEM's PAYS IN SPADES. You MAKE SURE you're on the leading edge and all others have to pay tribute to you to participate.

How much aftermarket business is factory fill going to bring them? Multi-millions? Is it REALLY any wonder why they are what they are? They create many of the ante's that others must pay to participate.

It's a David and Goliath story ..'cept Goliath holds most of the cards because he can afford to carry them ..they're printing a few of them on their own.


None of what I just said reflects in anyway to capability or quality of either product. It's simply a matter of keeping the ball in your court ..since you own the arena.
 
Originally Posted By: cjhepburn
Originally Posted By: Liquid_Turbo
It's kind of like that Sham-wow product. It's really hard to believe claims that come from the company that makes the product.

Ya but come on, everyone knows the Germans make good stuff, and who doesn't need a slap-chop?


You obviously haven't work with another German engineer. They think they make great stuff, but whether they really are great is another matter.
 
I don't know it all, but as far as I know:

- The pressure between a cam and a valve rises and falls (4-ball = constant pressure)
- Oil is actively circulated through the valvetrain (4-ball = lubricant bath)
 
XOM is fully aware of what the 4-ball wear test is. They use it for other fluids. If they felt it was necessary, they would use it for their PCMO's.

It's used as a pre-screen to test additives. Even Ashland doesn't use it as a legitimate test. Don't you think by now they would have made their oils so that they score well on the 4-ball wear test, since it's been 5 years Mobil 1 has been shown to produce a higher scar based on Amsoil's testing? Don't you think that of all the thousands of vehicles rolling off the lot with Mobil 1 would have shown to have engine problems by now? Where are the problems?

4-ball wear = MARKETING.

Does anyone see the 4-ball wear test on the list below?

https://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Synthetics/Mobil_1_Industry_Specifications.aspx
 
Buster you are right. XM no doubt does as much R&D on their oil as anyone, and I'm sure if EP additives would improve their oil they would use it. No secret there. The 4 ball wear test is a sales pitch to highten the senses. with the WOW factor.
 
It's only used by Amsoil peddlers. I like Amsoil, but their use of this test is lame.
 
Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Doesn't plain chlorine bleach do rather well in the 4 ball test?


Prell is the best for washing the balls.
 
Originally Posted By: Liquid_Turbo
Can someone explain the difference between the 4ball test and say, contact points between cams and valves?


1) 4 ball test lack combustion byproduct
2) 4 ball test wasn't done in the temperature a typical engine runs - varying temperature and viscosity
3) 4 ball test doesn't run with an oil filter
 
The 4 ball test is s good consumer demonstration prop.

Don't confuse that with a blender NOT regarding comparative wear scars in their formulations.
 
I think the "Best Oil" question is a Red Herring use to justify higher prices and profits. Look at all the cars that have gone 250k on old style oils over the last 30 years.
 
Being the competition has been steadily increasing over the years, maybe XOM should spend the extra $ and make sure they have a good 4-ball scar. This would cover them against those that are that naive in believing the test is a true indicator of engine wear. Seems to be working for some companies.
 
Lol. I do think the the tests are interesting,I just think any of the mid line synthetics will get a motor to 250k with good care and maintenance.
 
Most if not all people who visit Amsoils site have no idea the 4 ball thingy doesn't really pertain to oil/engines in real life. So from a phsychological point, it works and persuades them to buy Amsoils product, no doubt it works for Amsoil and sales.
 
If the test is meaningless (which it probably is) why doesn't someone call Amsoil out on it?
 
Originally Posted By: cjhepburn
Is the RP scar test the same concept as the 4 ball test?

Same as in, irrelevant to engine oils but possibly useful for gear oils? Pretty much.

Same as in, a repeatable industry standard test with good controls and widely recognized value? Not so much.
wink.gif
 
Originally Posted By: ADFD1
If the test is meaningless (which it probably is) why doesn't someone call Amsoil out on it?
I'm assuming you mean "call out" as in what BP did to Royal Purple. Correct me if I'm wrong.

No one can do that because Amsoil never explicitly makes the claim that the test corresponds to engine wear. They just say "Here's this test. Our oils do better on it. Also, they can protect your engine." Nothing false or misleading there, at least as far as the lawyers are concerned...
 
Snake oil salesmen love this stuff! (This does not mean Amsoil salesmen are snake oil salesmen. fyi)
 
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