What do you gain by UOA and extended drain interval?

[CheezWhiz]

A UOA from Blackstone cost $35 bucks, about the same as an oil change using a PF-48 and Supertech 5w-30 from Walmart. My 2016 2500HD has a 6.0 vortec and usually the OLM tells me to change the oil at around 6500 miles.

If I want to extend my drain interval, I'd assume I'd go with a more expensive oil and filter, and then at 6500 miles or so send off a sample to be tested. But if I used Supertech and the PF-48, I could just change the oil for that price. So I guess I don't see really what I stand to gain - changing the oil isn't much more work than pulling a sample. Once I put on work clothes, pull the truck into the garage, and get my tools out, I feel like I may as well change the oil?

If I had to guess, maybe the benefits start to accrue after you do the first UOA. Assuming I used a premium oil and filter and the first UOA told me I could go another 6500 miles, then on the second OCI I don't bother to do a UOA - I just drive 13k miles straight without ever crawling under the truck.

Is that the theory behind UOA's and extended drain intervals, that once you do the first UOA you can safely extend the drain interval without doing another UOA for a while (say 50k miles)?

 

[thastinger]

Back pre woohan, when the Wife was driving way more. I did some UOAs to, first test a couple of oils against each other, and to see if I could stretch the change intervals out long enough that I didn't have to be changing oil in the Winter months. I found a couple of oils that could go to 10K in the 5.6 in her Armada (RP HPS 5/30 & M1 E 0/40). I never took them that far though, I change it at 6K, but it was nice to know that I COULD wait for a little better weather if I needed to, or if she had to drive it a few hundred miles for business trips that I didn't need to hustle outside to do an oil change before she left.

 

[Pelican]

That has always been my stand too on cars!
UOA begin to make sense in commercial fleets and industrial/agricultural equipment where the oil capacity is in 10s of gallons and the use & OCI are similar, so one UOA can speak for all more or less. In this situation there is a ROI that's good. Other than that it's an exercise in knowledge, nothing more and some people take pleasure-pride in that.

 

[72C10]

The main benefit I get from UOA is knowing what's going on with an Engine. Setting good OCI based on what I learned is just an extra benefit.

I did a UOA not long ago and found that dirt was getting past my air filter, which is something I wouldn't have known had I not had it tested.

But I keep vehicles forever so it not make much sense for you.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

I’d say follow your regular routine and submit one sample for UOA, just to make sure the oil is still in grade and there’s no contamination. Then, if everything was good, maintain that OCI and submit one sample every 2-3 years unless you notice a significant change in how the vehicle is running.

Mystery coolant loss, significant increase in oil usage, etc should have a UOA done immediately since this will help identify if it’s leaking out of the engine or into it.

In fleets it makes more sense to be proactive, but generally speaking the customer that the fleet is servicing is paying said company to perform those UOAs, whereas you have to pay for your own.

 

[OVERKILL]

If you followed @wwillson and his Durango adventures in extending his OCI, yes, that's essentially how he's using them, to determine how long he can safely run that oil.

Other folks, like myself, aren't really interested in greatly extending the drain interval, often due to operating a piece of equipment that isn't conducive to that, and so the UOA is performed as part of the oil change (rolled into the cost) as a means to establish and maintain a health record trend.

From a money saving perspective, it makes more sense with large pieces of very expensive equipment that hold a lot of oil. You are going to have a hard time getting the same ROI with a passenger vehicle.

There is also, as I'm sure you are aware, a history of the misuse of UOA's by some forum members, trying to use them as an oil performance comparison tool, which is well outside their scope and resolution.

 

[billt460]

I don't run my oil long enough to care or benefit from a UOA. My thinking is, if I feel the need to get it tested, I must be doing something wrong, or else trying to get away with something that warrants getting it tested the first place.

A bit like a diabetic constantly monitoring his or her A1C, because they keep going to Baskin Robbins...... The first rule in Italian driving is, what's behind you, is none of your concern.

The first rule in frequent oil changes is, what you dump into the big tank at Autozone, I don't waste time worrying about.

 

[CheezWhiz]

Yeah this all makes sense. And honestly I'm not putting the miles on my 2500HD that I used to, working from home and driving an old 4.0 TJ whenever I can these days. So maybe just do a UOA as a sanity check and for some fun banter in that section of the forum, see if I learn anything, but not try to use it as a tool to change my current maintenance regimen.

As for how long I'll keep the truck, it's got 100k very easy miles on it. I'd guess I'll put another 100k on it over the next decade before the kids start moving out and I'll see what new vehicles are available at that time. Just hard to predict, I mean my income tends to fluctuate but for now the 2500HD is a perfect fit so want to just keep it running.

 

[wpod]

Back in the early 1980s a friend sold Amsoil so to support a friend I did the Amsoil bypass filter and uoas etc. I was familiar with the bypass filters mon the semi trucks at work and I was interested in seeing the results and after about 7 years realized it was a waste and changing the oil regularly is a better option with how I operate my vehicles. Clean oil is happy oil.

 

[VTECOverRated]

UOA helped me with my two turbo GDI honda's. I have about 5 UOA's each, setting a trend/formula for fuel dilution, of 1% per 1000 miles. If I want to keep it at 5% or bellow, I change at 4-5k miles. The UOA's were to confirm consistency. Worth the money to keep a car on the road.

 

[Ihatetochangeoil]

It all depends upon what your expectations are. UOA isn't going to make an engine last longer, but back in the day, my wife, my son and I were all 3 driving vehicles with the GM 3800 engines in them; bulletproof engines, notorious for intake gasket failure. It was at least twice, maybe 3 times, I can't remember....I sent off UOA with ~7500 miles on the oil (being Amsoil SS, I would run 12-15K OCI), and I would get back from the lab 3-4-500ppm sodium; gee, I've got a coolant leak into the oil, and there's not a Mr. Goodwrench mechanic in the nation that would look at that "honey" on the dipstick and diagnose a coolant leak.
Yes, I'm sure that UOA saved me 2-3 hydrolocked or otherwise ruined engines.

 

[cptbarkey]

After listening to several blackstone labs podcasts, they have talked about how they have many fleet and municipalities as customers. The use case of monitoring is fairly straightforward. cost savings further up the chain are probably an easy sell when you are making big money decisions with data. @Spike555 might have some insight for us pedestrians.

As a residential owner (like myself) it’s mostly self education and enjoyment.

 

[tnt_motorsports]

FWIW, I kind of look at it this way. I go to the doctor so he can evaluate my health and possible changes I need to maintain myself for a long time to come. I don't say meh no doctor because it will be $100 for the visit...

I have spent a lot of money on vehicles, and keep them for years and thousands of miles so it is like the doctors appointment for them. As an example, I found that using 5w40 in my Ram was not good. The oil was shearing to a 30 weight. I switched it to 15w40 and this problem went away. My wife's T&C has been sampled a couple times and my 2005 Jeep after an overheating incident. All to try and gain insight.

Just my $0.02

 

[CheezWhiz]

I completely understand the value of UOA for the purpose of getting some additional insight into your engine's condition. I'm just saying that, for the purpose of extending the drain interval, it doesn't seem to make a ton of sense to me unless you are using one UOA to project several subsequent OCI's.

 

[Pablo]

No need at all to do UOA every OCI. Not sure where that started.

Extended of course depends on defining the term. Some people here freak out unnecessarily if a person goes from 3000 miles to 6000 miles, which some engines and oils can easily do, with zero consequences and less time on your back removing and reinstalling the belly pan with 10 fasteners.

I just change the oil on our two personal vehicles once a year. The engines will be just fine and if I do a UOA now it's just to prove to someone here there is no fuel dilution.

 

[oil pan 4]

I leaned that short tripping a gdi hybrid is exceptionally bad especially in the winter and 7,000 mile oil changes are not a good idea.
In winter it loads the oil up with gas and that gdi engines shear away your viscosity.
Gasoline in the oil plus shear makes the oil into a 0 weight oil around 3,000 miles.
Knowing that I can develop countermeasures.

 

[Spike555]

After listening to several blackstone labs podcasts, they have talked about how they have many fleet and municipalities as customers. The use case of monitoring is fairly straightforward. cost savings further up the chain are probably an easy sell when you are making big money decisions with data. @Spike555 might have some insight for us pedestrians.

As a residential owner (like myself) it’s mostly self education and enjoyment.

In fleets it is essential to do SOS (service oil samples), that is the only true way of knowing if your service intervals are harming the fleet and shortening service life, if you're wasting money by changing oil to soon, or if you need to use a different motor oil all together.
I have a fleet of 50 delivery trucks, mostly gasoline, some diesels.
I change oil every 10,000 miles on everything and use 15w-40 diesel oil in everything, including my gasoline engines.
Blackstone Labs is who I use, they tell me that in my gasoline trucks I could go another 2,000 miles if I wanted, I still do every 10k, this gives me some wiggle room.
When it comes to fleets, maximizing the life of the equipment as cheaply as possible is how you improve profits. Using to cheap of an oil shortens equipment life and increases oil consumption, oil burning is literally money going up in smoke.
Using to expensive of a oil may not net any significant life in the equipment, I need my trucks to last 20yrs, at the end of 20yrs they are going to be worth scrap value, I can't have a engine with 5 more years of life left going for scrap, that's wasted money, plus you need to be under the truck every so often to check things out, to long between services and things go unnoticed which causes safety concerns as well as preventable break downs.
You also have to factor in how often the equipment gets serviced in weeks of time, I can't be changing the oil on a different truck everyday. That's a waste of time.
All fleets and heavy equipment owners do SOS on their equipment, no need to do it in all of the units, I do a SOS on a Ford gas engine and a GM gas engine, no need to do every Ford or every GM in my fleet.
I am wiling to answer questions if anyone has any.

 

[mr_boring]

A UOA from Blackstone cost $35 bucks, about the same as an oil change using a PF-48 and Supertech 5w-30 from Walmart. My 2016 2500HD has a 6.0 vortec and usually the OLM tells me to change the oil at around 6500 miles.

If I want to extend my drain interval, I'd assume I'd go with a more expensive oil and filter, and then at 6500 miles or so send off a sample to be tested. But if I used Supertech and the PF-48, I could just change the oil for that price. So I guess I don't see really what I stand to gain - changing the oil isn't much more work than pulling a sample. Once I put on work clothes, pull the truck into the garage, and get my tools out, I feel like I may as well change the oil?

If I had to guess, maybe the benefits start to accrue after you do the first UOA. Assuming I used a premium oil and filter and the first UOA told me I could go another 6500 miles, then on the second OCI I don't bother to do a UOA - I just drive 13k miles straight without ever crawling under the truck.

Is that the theory behind UOA's and extended drain intervals, that once you do the first UOA you can safely extend the drain interval without doing another UOA for a while (say 50k miles)?

"LOOK AT ME, I'm one of YOU" rights on BITOG!

That's what you gain

Spike555 has a VERY valid reason.

 

[himemsys]

A UOA from Blackstone cost $35 bucks, about the same as an oil change using a PF-48 and Supertech 5w-30 from Walmart. My 2016 2500HD has a 6.0 vortec and usually the OLM tells me to change the oil at around 6500 miles.

If I want to extend my drain interval, I'd assume I'd go with a more expensive oil and filter, and then at 6500 miles or so send off a sample to be tested. But if I used Supertech and the PF-48, I could just change the oil for that price. So I guess I don't see really what I stand to gain - changing the oil isn't much more work than pulling a sample. Once I put on work clothes, pull the truck into the garage, and get my tools out, I feel like I may as well change the oil?

If I had to guess, maybe the benefits start to accrue after you do the first UOA. Assuming I used a premium oil and filter and the first UOA told me I could go another 6500 miles, then on the second OCI I don't bother to do a UOA - I just drive 13k miles straight without ever crawling under the truck.

Is that the theory behind UOA's and extended drain intervals, that once you do the first UOA you can safely extend the drain interval without doing another UOA for a while (say 50k miles)?

Personally, I don't use UOAs to extend drain intervals. It started off as a curiosity. Then one time it detected a coolant leak (head gasket) early and I got it fixed. Then it sort of morphed into a hobby. Most of us have hobbies that technically are a waste of money, but we get some value from that hobby that justifies the cost. This is me with UOAs and VOAs. I have spreadsheets for each of my vehicles where I track UOAs. No, I'm not saving money (except for the time I caught the head gasket leak), but it's entertaining enough for me that it's worth the money I spend on them.

 

[Bill7]

UOA's are useless as they dont measure sludge / varnish accumulation due to extended oil changes.

I prefer short oil change intervals with a full synthetic that ìs GM Dexos 1 Gen 3 certified,
as it will have better protection against sludge and varnish causing deposits than a regular API SP oil.