re: 0w30 problem/question

[runback19]

5/16/05
Monday afternoon - changed oil in 88 Trooper II from Amsoil 10w-30 to Amsoil 0w-30.

Went to work Monday evening in Trooper. Here is what I observed:

1) Engine oil pressure ran 60psi - normal range.

2) Engine running quieter - 60mph - good.

3) When I got to parking lot at work - could hear what I thought was loud lifter noise from engine at idle. Bad thing is, it's overhead cam.
No lifters.

According to former race car mechanic here at work, not enough oil film to lubricate overhead cam lobes - part that works the valves.
Needless to say, this is a bad thing.

Going back to 10w30.

Question: Is it safe to use 0w30 in 2005 Toyota that recommends 5w30?

If I had to guess I would say no at this time.

 

[ToyotaNSaturn]

quote:

---

Originally posted by runback19:

According to former race car mechanic here at work, not enough oil film to lubricate overhead cam lobes - part that works the valves.
Needless to say, this is a bad thing.

Going back to 10w30.

---

I can't comment on the ticking noise, but one thing jumped out at me: just because the guy knows how to fix race cars doens't mean that he knows anything about oil. I worked in a shop environment for years, but wasn't til I found this place did I understand oil. And I'm always learning. No offense to your coworker, but we need to dig deeper here...

The 0w-30 will lubricate BETTER than 10w-30 when cold as it will be thinner at cold startup, thus allowing it to reach the top end quicker than a thicker 10w- oil. How much thicker is the 10w-30 you purchased over the 0w-30 when cold? Hopefully one of the Amsoil guys here can tell us.

Conversely, and oddly, I believe the 0w-30 is actually a thicker oil at temperature. Perhaps that is the difference we're looking at in this situation.

Why the ticking I don't know. But the mechanic's comments only result in more questions rather than offering any substantive answers.

 

[Pablo]

It isn't the oil. The viscosity at 100°C is REALLY close to the same for both oils....if it was enough difference in viscosity to make such a noise, then maybe your engine runs really hot - but I doubt it.

Why is every noise a "lifter" noise and every former mechanic an oil expert?

What kind of oil filter are you using?

 

[runback19]

Oil Filter used.
Pure One from Purolator.

Ticking would be understatement.
Multiple Ticking would be more accurate.


By the way took db reading with UE5000 bearing tester. Use it here at work to test for babbit and roller bearing problems.

At 55db with 0w30 at multiple points on and below valve cover.

Will let you know what reading is after going back to 10w30.

Thx.

 

[Pablo]

I'm still wondering about fill level and flow through the filter. Such noises are usually caused by lack of oil, rather than viscosity of the oil. For example, some cars do fine without noises on an XW-20 oil - which is indeed much thinner at high temps than a 30.

How many miles on the vehicle?

Also, I'm not saying the 0W-30 is the best choice for your Trooper. I wonder how it would do on an XW-40 with the dB meter.

 

[runback19]

88 Trooper about 40k on engine. Bought it shortly after new engine put in.

Have been running 10w30 in winter and 10w40 in summer. Not sure if best practice.

Have had Pure One filter and Amsoil filter both on before. Use Pure One when other isn't available.

Seem have had little difference before this time.

I agree about 5w20.
2003 Mazda van (15k) runs 5w20 with no problem except once it warms up, have a small lifter tap. As a trial, ran M1 5w-30 ep, lifter tap did not show up. Went back to 5w-20 after short experiment. Mostly because of what I learned on BITOG. Living with lifter tap for now.

Thx.

 

[runback19]

re: 88 Trooper.
Previous owner overheated previous motor.

New motor has had nothing but Amsoil since.

 

[Mamala Bay]

If you are going with a high performance oil as with Amsoil 0w-30, you may want to consider the
S3K 5w-30. I think with the type of engine you have that would be a better application.

If cost is an objective, the Amsoil 10w-30 would do very well and also consider the Amsoil 5w-40.

I've used the Amsoil S2K 0w-30 for about 4 years on a Ford Ranger 97 3.0(great performance and mpg increase). It saw but Amsoil 5w-30 for the first 12,000 miles and 10w-30 for the next 3 years. I feel I've reached my limits here in my driving and weather conditions that I am going with the Amsoil 5w-40 on my next run. I should have 100,000+ miles on the engine.

 

[Mamala Bay]

There is no problem with Amsoil 0w-30 on the Toyota. In fact when Ford went with the 5w-20, I did go with the Amsoil 0w-30. I saw no difference with Amsoil 0w-30 as far as I was concern with the Amsoil 10w-30. I just got better performance and better MPG.

 

[Gary Allan]

Are you absolutely sure you don't have lifters? I don't know the Isuzu engine, but I've had quite a few OHC engines with hydraulic cam followers/lifters. Google pukes out enough hydraulic lash adjusters with Isuzus.

 

[labman]

My 77 Isusu with the bow tie on the grill does not have lifters. Call it what you want, but one end of the thingamabob rests on the cam, pivots and pushes the valve down, when the cam pushes it up. The valve end has a mechanical adjustment.

Perhaps what you are hearing is mechanical (lifter) noise. One advantage of hydraulic lifters is the reduction of noise. Mechanical adjusters must have some clearance. See if your owners manual give as sec. for the clearance. As any old TR-4 owner, can tell you, if you can't hear the valves rattling on start up, they are too tight, and will burn. On my TR-4, they seemed to burn no matter what.

 

[Ugly3]

quote:

---

Originally posted by labman:
My 77 Isusu with the bow tie on the grill does not have lifters. Call it what you want, but one end of the thingamabob rests on the cam, pivots and pushes the valve down, when the cam pushes it up. The valve end has a mechanical adjustment.

Perhaps what you are hearing is mechanical (lifter) noise. One advantage of hydraulic lifters is the reduction of noise. Mechanical adjusters must have some clearance. See if your owners manual give as sec. for the clearance. As any old TR-4 owner, can tell you, if you can't hear the valves rattling on start up, they are too tight, and will burn. On my TR-4, they seemed to burn no matter what.

---

The "old saying" was that it was better to hear the valves than to smell them.