The only reason you would idle it is to get it nice and warm when you get in.
Other than that it is a waste of gas
Other than that it is a waste of gas
Question about warming up the car in winter
- Thread starter boostedtsiawd
- Start date
- Status
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
Exactly. They last longer but many still fail.
OP leave the car off until you need to go somewhere.
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
Exactly. They last longer but many still fail.
OP leave the car off until you need to go somewhere.
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Good way to keep your exhaust shop in business replacing the pipes yearly!
Mfgr's switched to stainless in the early '90s(at least on most cars), haven't seen rusted out exhaust since...
No I wouldn't run it just because, I do commonly warm mine cause I don't enjoy riding in a cold car...
Really? Guess I spent too much time on ford forms. Aluminized at best
And to think this is an original exhaust! MOST shops don't use SS unless you are willing to pay. So what Mfg's used and switched to when doesn't matter much.
Really!!! I've had no rust outs since my '86 Grand Marquis... That includes '92, '93 Grand Marquis, '95 T-Bird, plus my current '98 & '07 Grand Marquis...
I've seen stuff at my buddies car lot that flanges were in poor condition(no doubt northern refugees), but pipes were fine...
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Good way to keep your exhaust shop in business replacing the pipes yearly!
Mfgr's switched to stainless in the early '90s(at least on most cars), haven't seen rusted out exhaust since...
No I wouldn't run it just because, I do commonly warm mine cause I don't enjoy riding in a cold car...
Really? Guess I spent too much time on ford forms. Aluminized at best
And to think this is an original exhaust! MOST shops don't use SS unless you are willing to pay. So what Mfg's used and switched to when doesn't matter much.
Really!!! I've had no rust outs since my '86 Grand Marquis... That includes '92, '93 Grand Marquis, '95 T-Bird, plus my current '98 & '07 Grand Marquis...
I've seen stuff at my buddies car lot that flanges were in poor condition(no doubt northern refugees), but pipes were fine...
If it's real cold out (below 0) I usually warm the car for a few minutes. Other than that don't mess with it.
Originally Posted By: TFB1
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Good way to keep your exhaust shop in business replacing the pipes yearly!
Mfgr's switched to stainless in the early '90s(at least on most cars), haven't seen rusted out exhaust since...
You haven't lived far enough north then... I see cars with massive exhaust leaks on a daily basis. Either rotted out flex pipes or failed flanges, etc.
Originally Posted By: rsylvstr
Good way to keep your exhaust shop in business replacing the pipes yearly!
Mfgr's switched to stainless in the early '90s(at least on most cars), haven't seen rusted out exhaust since...
You haven't lived far enough north then... I see cars with massive exhaust leaks on a daily basis. Either rotted out flex pipes or failed flanges, etc.
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
DeLorean agrees with you.
It depends on how good the steel is.
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
DeLorean agrees with you.
It depends on how good the steel is.
- Joined
- Oct 28, 2014
- Messages
- 1,187
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
No, there aren't. There are only 5 basic classifications of Stainless: https://app.aws.org/wj/1998/11/kotecki/
The most popular for auto exhaust systems is 409. Any 400 series stainless (any type of stainless beginning with a "4" such as 403, 405, 409, 410, etc., is easy to identify on the car because they are SLIGHTLY magnetic. 400 series will also RUST, but it will take longer than plain old A36 steel. (A500 pipe is structural equivalent of A36 http://msc.aisc.org/globalassets/modern-steel/steelwise/022012_steelwise_spec.pdf See Table 1 on page 2) 400 series stainless is the least expensive stainless. Think Walmart made in China steak knives.
Mr. Delorean used 304 steel. 304 stainless is COMPLETELY nonmagnetic. It is HIGHLY corrosion resistant and used in chemical plants, food processing, medical and dairy equipment. It will hold a high polish and is used for expensive and long lasting exhaust systems: http://www.exhaustvideos.com/faq/stainless-vs-aluminized-steel-exhaust-system/ I disagree with this column; I believe 304 stainless exhaust will outlast any car in any location, even if you wanted to store the car under salt water; the exhaust would be the last thing to succomb.
But going back to the OP question; I warm my car up ALWAYS in the winter. My car spends the night in a heated garage. My morning routine includes warming the car fully up to operating temp of 180-185. I have a 180 thermostat and a driver information center. COLD engine oil pressure is 66-73. I like to wait for the oil pressure to drop to less than 60 at idle, letting me know that the OIL is STARTING to warm. This can take place while I'm drinking coffee and shaving. I do not drive a cold engine, I'm not a tree hugger, nor do I give a **** about wasting a quart of gasoline. I do UOA and I KNOW the internal condition of my engine and oil.
There are boatloads of different stainless steels. Stainless steel doesn't guarantee it doesn't rust.
No, there aren't. There are only 5 basic classifications of Stainless: https://app.aws.org/wj/1998/11/kotecki/
The most popular for auto exhaust systems is 409. Any 400 series stainless (any type of stainless beginning with a "4" such as 403, 405, 409, 410, etc., is easy to identify on the car because they are SLIGHTLY magnetic. 400 series will also RUST, but it will take longer than plain old A36 steel. (A500 pipe is structural equivalent of A36 http://msc.aisc.org/globalassets/modern-steel/steelwise/022012_steelwise_spec.pdf See Table 1 on page 2) 400 series stainless is the least expensive stainless. Think Walmart made in China steak knives.
Mr. Delorean used 304 steel. 304 stainless is COMPLETELY nonmagnetic. It is HIGHLY corrosion resistant and used in chemical plants, food processing, medical and dairy equipment. It will hold a high polish and is used for expensive and long lasting exhaust systems: http://www.exhaustvideos.com/faq/stainless-vs-aluminized-steel-exhaust-system/ I disagree with this column; I believe 304 stainless exhaust will outlast any car in any location, even if you wanted to store the car under salt water; the exhaust would be the last thing to succomb.
But going back to the OP question; I warm my car up ALWAYS in the winter. My car spends the night in a heated garage. My morning routine includes warming the car fully up to operating temp of 180-185. I have a 180 thermostat and a driver information center. COLD engine oil pressure is 66-73. I like to wait for the oil pressure to drop to less than 60 at idle, letting me know that the OIL is STARTING to warm. This can take place while I'm drinking coffee and shaving. I do not drive a cold engine, I'm not a tree hugger, nor do I give a **** about wasting a quart of gasoline. I do UOA and I KNOW the internal condition of my engine and oil.
You'd hate to live in NH, let alone more north. It's more than a quart of gas to get an engine up to temp.
My truck, this morning at 15F, I went 3 miles (one stop, the rest at 40mph) before water temp got above 130F. Which is when I put the heat on low. After another 9 miles (all of which was at 60+) it finally got up to a near-full 180F. So 10 plus minutes of driving, or darn near a full gallon of gas when it's all said and done.
My old Jetta was more like 7 miles to get something akin to heat, 20 to full temp. At 15F that is. At 0F it never reached full temp. Maybe if I drove it hard enough on the highway, but once I slowed down, it'd cool off and I could watch the temp gauge drop.
I'm not sure I care. That Jetta was running just fine at 314k when I sold it; if the engine was worn, well the rest of it was rusted. Uniform wear on everything. I figure, both my Toyota's can take this "abuse" and after 10 years everything will be again uniformly worn out and I won't care.
My truck, this morning at 15F, I went 3 miles (one stop, the rest at 40mph) before water temp got above 130F. Which is when I put the heat on low. After another 9 miles (all of which was at 60+) it finally got up to a near-full 180F. So 10 plus minutes of driving, or darn near a full gallon of gas when it's all said and done.
My old Jetta was more like 7 miles to get something akin to heat, 20 to full temp. At 15F that is. At 0F it never reached full temp. Maybe if I drove it hard enough on the highway, but once I slowed down, it'd cool off and I could watch the temp gauge drop.
I'm not sure I care. That Jetta was running just fine at 314k when I sold it; if the engine was worn, well the rest of it was rusted. Uniform wear on everything. I figure, both my Toyota's can take this "abuse" and after 10 years everything will be again uniformly worn out and I won't care.
Just a couple of days ago the temp was 28 degrees here at 0630. We left the building and drove exactly 2 miles to a gas station. The engine was at full operating temp (205) even with the heat on.
This is with a cooling system supplemented with a couple of gallons of extra coolant for a heat exchanger! Even when idling with the heat on the temp gauge never moves.
How can GM make their engines reach full operating temp so quickly even with extremely large coolant volumes? I really don't know, but I figure it's a key component of our extremely long engine life...
This is with a cooling system supplemented with a couple of gallons of extra coolant for a heat exchanger! Even when idling with the heat on the temp gauge never moves.
How can GM make their engines reach full operating temp so quickly even with extremely large coolant volumes? I really don't know, but I figure it's a key component of our extremely long engine life...
I guess if the thermostat closes quite tightly excluding the rad totally it would warm up quickly. In your climate its no big deal, but a full rad load of -30F coolant into a 205F motor may not be the best.
Cold seizing a two stoke sled is where I've heard about it most.
Similarly one day I poured -15C oil into my nice warm Neon motor and heard a nice crisp cracking sound! No damage done that I could tell, but something in there got a bit of a thermal shock.
Cold seizing a two stoke sled is where I've heard about it most.
Similarly one day I poured -15C oil into my nice warm Neon motor and heard a nice crisp cracking sound! No damage done that I could tell, but something in there got a bit of a thermal shock.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Just a couple of days ago the temp was 28 degrees here at 0630. We left the building and drove exactly 2 miles to a gas station. The engine was at full operating temp (205) even with the heat on.
Interesting, nothing I've ever monitored comes close to being at operating temp, in two miles... Last time I checked(approx two weeks ago) took something like eight minutes and roughly half that time was on interstate at 60+ mph to reach full operating temp(my neighborhood is two miles from I-state on ramp)... That's vs 13 minutes idling the day before... My starting temps? 43 idle & 37*F driving...
Just a couple of days ago the temp was 28 degrees here at 0630. We left the building and drove exactly 2 miles to a gas station. The engine was at full operating temp (205) even with the heat on.
Interesting, nothing I've ever monitored comes close to being at operating temp, in two miles... Last time I checked(approx two weeks ago) took something like eight minutes and roughly half that time was on interstate at 60+ mph to reach full operating temp(my neighborhood is two miles from I-state on ramp)... That's vs 13 minutes idling the day before... My starting temps? 43 idle & 37*F driving...
Originally Posted By: ted s
just kidding
I know a guy who had a work van with a sketchy starter and no desire to have it fixed. One winter he got the bugger to start and that van stayed running for 2 years without shutting down (someone else was paying for gas). He'd pull the dipstick once in a while and top up the oil and keep the tank full.
A deer is what finally killed it for good, motor was still running great at the time.
just kidding
I know a guy who had a work van with a sketchy starter and no desire to have it fixed. One winter he got the bugger to start and that van stayed running for 2 years without shutting down (someone else was paying for gas). He'd pull the dipstick once in a while and top up the oil and keep the tank full.
A deer is what finally killed it for good, motor was still running great at the time.
Originally Posted By: ironman_gq
Originally Posted By: ted s
just kidding
I know a guy who had a work van with a sketchy starter and no desire to have it fixed. One winter he got the bugger to start and that van stayed running for 2 years without shutting down (someone else was paying for gas). He'd pull the dipstick once in a while and top up the oil and keep the tank full.
A deer is what finally killed it for good, motor was still running great at the time.
How do you top up a running engine??? In a V8 or even a I6 there can be as much as two quarts in the upper regions of engine... If reading full, no doubt it's actually at least a quart maybe two over full...
Originally Posted By: ted s
just kidding
I know a guy who had a work van with a sketchy starter and no desire to have it fixed. One winter he got the bugger to start and that van stayed running for 2 years without shutting down (someone else was paying for gas). He'd pull the dipstick once in a while and top up the oil and keep the tank full.
A deer is what finally killed it for good, motor was still running great at the time.
How do you top up a running engine??? In a V8 or even a I6 there can be as much as two quarts in the upper regions of engine... If reading full, no doubt it's actually at least a quart maybe two over full...
doesn't matter if you don't stop the engine, I suppose....
Everyone has already said why it's bad to warm up your car or any car. As long as you are using proper fluid viscosities per the owner's manual there is NO reason to ever warm your car up. Now if you start it and turn on the heat so when you get inside its not cold that's a personal preference. The car doesn't need warmed up but sometimes the driver and passengers do. It's not great for the car but for me it's better than getting into a freezing car. IMHO. I love my remote start key fob for just this reason. Lol. What struck me was your comment your using premium gas. Why? It's just a waste of money---especially in an older car.
Last edited:
I always warm up my vehicles before I go anywhere, especially in the wintertime. I'm not bothered by the little extra fuel I use to do it either.
- Status
