OIL OPINIONS FOR NEW MUSTANG GT

[TC]

"I don't drive the old '69 Mach hard very often and it doesn't have any seal seepage at all. It only sees maybe 2000 miles each year also as I drive it occasionally to shows and weekends. It's basically a stock 4bbl motor."

-Old tech, not exotic or $$$
-No DOHC, turbo, blower, etc.
-Only 2K mi/yr
-Driven easily
-No leaks

My personal choice would be the least expensive, name brand, conventional API-SL or SM one could find, 5w-30 or 10w-30 for Illinois, and 10w-40 for hotter climates. Anything more expensive than that is overkill.

[ March 16, 2005, 11:26 PM: Message edited by: TC ]

 

[BlazerLT]

5w20 was not introduced because of better lubrication, it was introduced so Ford could meet EPA fuel economy requirements.

 

[Bryanccfshr]

quote:

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Originally posted by BlazerLT:
5w20 was not introduced because of better lubrication, it was introduced so Ford could meet EPA fuel economy requirements.

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The chicken or the egg argument is irrelevant. I don't care why 5w20 was introduced. I do believe it is a good lubricant and would run it without hesitation in a vehicle speced for it.

 

[sgtgeek]

Well I just found the Amsoil 0-30 info....guess in my old age my eyes are going
Looks good though! And for clarification (Thanks Medic) yes I am not advocating extended drains outside of any manufacturers warranty specs.....however GM is advocating 10,000 mile OCI's with their new program....I assume Ford is doing the same?

 

[Bobio]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Troxell:
I think there is a big difference between MC and GC. ~2.6cp vs. 3.6cp HTHS. I think GC would be too thick. The 4.6L uses aluminum bearing design which allows tighter clearances which not only make the 5w-20 safe, but best. Pennzoil 5w20 seems good too if you like them. Full synth is up to you. If over 5k drains I certainly would. Or you could just use LC with MC or Pennz. Lots of options. You could stick with the 10w30 in the Mach 1. But I would look at Specialty Formulations Classic Form since it is driven so rarely. I'd think about using Lube Control with it as well.

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I have to disagree with your comment that 5W-20 is the "best" oil for the modular motors. When Ford designed the motors and put them in cars back in 1991 Ford called for 5W-30. I would think the engineers were well aware of the bearing clearances when they specified 5W-30 when they designed the motor.

In the TSB that came out in 2001 regarding the switch to 5W-20 for many Ford vehicles, the only thing mentioned was fuel economy. Don't buy into the dealer mantra that 5W-20 is needed for the tight tolerances of the motor.

[ March 16, 2005, 12:14 PM: Message edited by: Bobio ]

 

[sgtgeek]

Yeah I agree on the 5-20 stuff bobio....I think that is driven more by EPA/CAFE than performance or wear protection...IMHO I would not hesitate to use a good 0-30 or 5-30 in any application calling for 5-20.

 

[Mr Nice]

In hot sunny climates.....I perfer 5w30 or 10w30 over 5w20 oils. For your Mustang GT , I would definately put 0w30 GC or 10w30 Mobil 1 over 5w20 dino oil. The car will get the same gas mileage with either oil.

 

[medic]

I don't wanna get into this Xw-20 vs everything else argument, but I have yet to see anybody say that they wouldn't run a Xw-30 because it is too thin. The fact is that M1 0w-30 is about as close to a 20 wt as you can get. Many dino 5w-30's will shear down to a 20 wt within a few hundred miles. A 5w-20 is more shear stable due to it's viscosity index and therefore is more likely to stay in grade. All Xw-20 oils are very close to the 30 wt area.

At the same time, GC and Amsoil are thick 30 wt oils, coming close to being a 40 wt. There are those here who have said that a 40 wt is too thick for this engine.

So, my point is: The SAE listing on the front of the bottle is extremely vague and shouldn't be treated as gospel. It is only an area that the oil falls in to, similar to me saying that I live in North America - this leaves the door wide open - I could be in Mexico City, New York City, Toronto, or Ancorage.

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

quote:

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Originally posted by Bryanccfshr:
Amen to that, Operating temperature's operating temperature. Oil temperatures Do Not Vary significantly with season or climate, they only reach full operating sooner in warmer climates do to a higher starting temp.

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You might want to get an oil temp guage and re-evaluate your statement.

quote:

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I know at least my Tacoma's oil temp is regulated by an oil to coolant exchanger.

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That's great, but not a common feature.

 

[1999nick]

quote:

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Originally posted by sgtgeek:
Yeah I agree on the 5-20 stuff bobio....I think that is driven more by EPA/CAFE than performance or wear protection...IMHO I would not hesitate to use a good 0-30 or 5-30 in any application calling for 5-20.

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Does anyone think that Honda is requiring 5w-20 for EPA reasons and thereby risking shorter engine life?

 

[mechtech]

The thermostat controls the coolant temp, NOT the oil temp.
An engine oil runs MUCH hotter in summer than winter.
After working on umpteen jillion cars in my shop, a practical example is that you can put your hand on an oil pan [after being driven], but no way is summer - you'd get burned. Same with oil changes - a big difference in oil temp, winter vs. summer.
No doubt about it.

 

[medic]

quote:

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Originally posted by mechtech:
The thermostat controls the coolant temp, NOT the oil temp.

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So, you agree that the thermostat's job is to control the coolant temp.

This common observation leads me into this question: What is the coolant's job?

I will rephrase my recent statement.

Ambient temperature has VERY LITTLE to do with oil temperature once the engine has reached operating temperature.

In a air cooled engine, the oil & engine is cooled by the air. The oil also plays a big part in cooling the engine.

In a water cooled engine, the oil and engine is cooled by the coolant. The water jackets act similar to the fins on an air cooled engine, allowing the heat from the oil to be transfered into the coolant.

Now comes the intersting part. A 20 wt oil will flow quicker, allowing it to disperse more heat, therefore preventing the heat build up that you get with thicker oils. What effect does this have?

 

[Bryanccfshr]

quote:

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Originally posted by medic:

quote:

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Originally posted by mechtech:
The thermostat controls the coolant temp, NOT the oil temp.

---

So, you agree that the thermostat's job is to control the coolant temp.

This common observation leads me into this question: What is the coolant's job?

I will rephrase my recent statement.

Ambient temperature has VERY LITTLE to do with oil temperature once the engine has reached operating temperature.

In a air cooled engine, the oil & engine is cooled by the air. The oil also plays a big part in cooling the engine.

In a water cooled engine, the oil and engine is cooled by the coolant. The water jackets act similar to the fins on an air cooled engine, allowing the heat from the oil to be transfered into the coolant.

Now comes the intersting part. A 20 wt oil will flow quicker, allowing it to disperse more heat, therefore preventing the heat build up that you get with thicker oils. What effect does this have?

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More effecient heat transfer? I think that a less viscous fluid would be more turbulent in flow and cover more surface area, smaller mollecular size of fluid components would also mean more surface contact(visuallize a square foot covered by tiny ball bearings -vs- tennis balls, which has more surface contact?).
Am I on the right track?

 

[Dr. T]

quote:

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Originally posted by 1999nick:

quote:

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Originally posted by sgtgeek:
Yeah I agree on the 5-20 stuff bobio....I think that is driven more by EPA/CAFE than performance or wear protection...IMHO I would not hesitate to use a good 0-30 or 5-30 in any application calling for 5-20.

---

Does anyone think that Honda is requiring 5w-20 for EPA reasons and thereby risking shorter engine life?

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Yes for the first one...and no for the second. As long as the engine will last up until the warranty...that's all that's needed. Seems to work just fine here in N.A. from what we've seen thusfar. After that, there's always the new car purchase....

 

[Bryanccfshr]

quote:

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Originally posted by Jason Troxell:

quote:

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Originally posted by Bryanccfshr:
Amen to that, Operating temperature's operating temperature. Oil temperatures Do Not Vary significantly with season or climate, they only reach full operating sooner in warmer climates do to a higher starting temp.

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You might want to get an oil temp guage and re-evaluate your statement.


AHH But I have thought about it researched it and had converstations with owners who have installed aguage. The consensus is the oil temp doesn't surpass the coolant temp significantly and drops to or below coolant trips below highway speeds.

quote:

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I know at least my Tacoma's oil temp is regulated by an oil to coolant exchanger.

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That's great, but not a common feature.

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That's unfortunate.

 

[Geoff]

darkdan, that was an interesting spreadsheet. Eyeballing it, the 30 weights seem to predominate with the best weighted scoring. As an objective guide, that is what I would use if it were my engine.

 

[medic]

quote:

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Originally posted by Dr. T:

quote:

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Originally posted by 1999nick:

quote:

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Originally posted by sgtgeek:
Yeah I agree on the 5-20 stuff bobio....I think that is driven more by EPA/CAFE than performance or wear protection...IMHO I would not hesitate to use a good 0-30 or 5-30 in any application calling for 5-20.

---

Does anyone think that Honda is requiring 5w-20 for EPA reasons and thereby risking shorter engine life?

---

Yes for the first one...and no for the second. As long as the engine will last up until the warranty...that's all that's needed. Seems to work just fine here in N.A. from what we've seen thusfar. After that, there's always the new car purchase....

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I doubt that the 5,000 mile OCI is in place to get you through the warrenty period. Most vehicles have a 50,000 mile warrenty. After the initial 5,000 miles, I would bet that any SM dino oil could get to the end of the warrenty with 10,000 mile or more OCI's.

 

[mf150]

quote:

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Originally posted by BlazerLT:
5w20 was not introduced because of better lubrication, it was introduced so Ford could meet EPA fuel economy requirements.

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Go on thinking that...go on being brainwashed.

 

[jorton]

69mach - If you are interested in extended OCI then full synthetic with yearly analysis is best.

This engine may take 50,000 miles to break in and you'll have some consumption during break-in.

You should stick with MC 5w-20 until consumption decreases to 1/2 quart per OCI, and then change to MC or any name brand 10w-30.

 

[69Mach]

I wonder how much of the MC 5W-20 Synthetic blend is actually synthetic vs dino?