G05 photo

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: artificialist


You could buy collectible car insurance to prevent damage to a classic car to be such a financial catastrophe.


Yeah, I've got it on my '69. But the money isn't the whole point, though. Its more the intrinsic value of a rare car vs a fairly commonplace 4-door. I don't feel guilty for putting heavy miles on it, driving it in bad weather, etc.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: Chris142
Do you have any problem with the carb draining if it sits a few days? I put a brand new Edelbrock AFB copy on my pickup and it it sits 2 days unused it will be empty.

Never had that problem with my Holley.


I've never noticed it going dry quite that fast, although a week will do it. But that's the beauty of electric fuel pumps- turn the ignition to "on" for 30 seconds to run the pump, then hit the starter and she goes

Carters do have a lot smaller float bowls, I wonder if its just that they evaporate themselves down faster than Holleys? Is there any trace of fuel around/under the carb like maybe the casting is porous? Carters can't "siphon" dry because the fuel inlets are in the tops of the float bowls. It has to be either evaporating or leaking out somewhere.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx

Sounds like a really nice set up. The dual snorkel is better than an open element for street IMO. I think the AVS is a great street carb, better than a Holley. With the heat riser blocked and an AVS I bet that 440 really moves. 'vealso heard Sanden A/C compressor were one of the best. I was just curious if you were using POE or PAG compressor oil with th R134a? Sounds like you know your classic cars.


I agree on open-element air cleaners- too loud. Sounds like a foghorn when the secondaries open. Plus the dual-snorkels have a kinda cool OEM retro look- totally non stock for this car, but then so what? So is the 440 (it was a 383 car originally).

That AC system runs PAG just like a new car because it was a new compressor and the system had been flushed, run a few years on R-134a with POE oil, and then flushed again. I'm superstitious about POE oil being safer in retrofitted systems where chlorine residue might be present, but the new double-end capped stabilized PAGs are supposed to be immune to chlorine residue. Plus I figure the flushing prior to running POE with the old compressor for a couple of years, then the flush before putting on the Sanden and PAG probably got it about as clean as possible. The other car (69 with the V-twin compressor) still has POE oil- its been about 6 years since I converted it and it still works great, but it only sees maybe 2000 miles a year.

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I have no use for Prestone any more, they don't even have Green or G-05 that I know of, just Dexclone.


I trusted Prestone for 20+ years, but when they jumped on the "one size fits all" BSwagon, I lost all respect for them and their products. Zerex has done a fine job of keeping up with the REAL requirements of different manufacturers with different products in their line, everything from old green under the "MaxLife" brand (hard to find, though) to DexCool, P-OAT, and G-05 products.

 

[mechanicx]

Yeah 440Magnum you are probably right that most carbs are top fed and can't actually siphon the carb bowl dry, but what I meant is with a mechanical fuel pump without a working check valve, the carb can give the illusion of a dry fuel bowl or can take longer to refill evaporation losses. It's probably like you said evaporation losses with the smaller side hung aluminum fuel bowls.

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum

I agree on open-element air cleaners- too loud. Sounds like a foghorn when the secondaries open. Plus the dual-snorkels have a kinda cool OEM retro look- totally non stock for this car, but then so what? So is the 440 (it was a 383 car originally).


Yeah, plus you could run cold air ducting to a snorkel air cleaner. I've seen test where a snorkel air cleaner made more low and midrange power (maybe slight ram effect than an open element and did not lose any on the top end. You got to figure unless your set up is way beyond the stock performance design the dual snorkel was good for things like lower noise and maybe even power or it would've been cheaper for the factory to just use an open element.


Quote:

That AC system runs PAG just like a new car because it was a new compressor and the system had been flushed, run a few years on R-134a with POE oil, and then flushed again. I'm superstitious about POE oil being safer in retrofitted systems where chlorine residue might be present, but the new double-end capped stabilized PAGs are supposed to be immune to chlorine residue. Plus I figure the flushing prior to running POE with the old compressor for a couple of years, then the flush before putting on the Sanden and PAG probably got it about as clean as possible. The other car (69 with the V-twin compressor) still has POE oil- its been about 6 years since I converted it and it still works great, but it only sees maybe 2000 miles a year.


The main advantage I've heard about POE over PAG is it doesn't absorb moisture like PAG, and moisture is a very bad thing in an A/C system. I thought POE was supposedly more compatible with the residue R-12. But like you said the double end capped PAG is suppose to absorb less moisture. Plus since most OEMs use PAG instead of POE for 134a, I figure it must be a better lubricant.


Quote:
I trusted Prestone for 20+ years, but when they jumped on the "one size fits all" BSwagon, I lost all respect for them and their products. Zerex has done a fine job of keeping up with the REAL requirements of different manufacturers with different products in their line, everything from old green under the "MaxLife" brand (hard to find, though) to DexCool, P-OAT, and G-05 products.


Yeah that exactly how I see it too.

 

[xxch4osxx]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I'm not sure that that is normal but maybe 440Magnum might know better. I'm sure you were really asking him anyway lol. I'm thinking you might be missing or have a bad fuel filter check valve somewhere maybe. Fuel bowl control is one knock on the Carter design though. But even the Holley can't hold a candle there to the Q-Jet. Those carbs will control fuel bowl levels at extreme off-roading angles, but they are somewhat limited in bowl capacity.
Those old Q-jet carbs are actually a very good carb if they are set up properly. Small primaries can make for good fuel milage when driving easy and huge secondaries make for good power when stomping on it. Parts are abundant as well!

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: xxch4osxx
Those old Q-jet carbs are actually a very good carb if they are set up properly. Small primaries can make for good fuel milage when driving easy and huge secondaries make for good power when stomping on it. Parts are abundant as well!


The old Rockchuker Quadrapuke is indeed an excellent carb (nickname notwithstanding). So is the Carter Thermoquad (aka Thermobog) if you set it up right. The TQ has the added advantage of keeping the fuel much cooler than other carbs, but has a couple of key seals that tend to go bad- especially with today's adulterated gasolines.

FWIW, Edelbrock did (maybe still does?) build a licensed copy of the Quadrajet in addition to its Carter AFB (Performer) and Carter AVS (Thunder Series) carbs. The only reason I didn't go that route was that it was really pricey and I already had a square-bore intake manifold ready to go.

 

[mechanicx]

Another interesting tidbit about the Q-jet is in the past GM was doing so much business that Rochester contracted out to Carter to build some of their Q-Jets. They usually say "Quadrajet by Carter". Q-Jets have very accurate fuel metering, good fuel mileage and drivability. It's one of the few if only carbs designed in the mid-60's, that made it through the emissions era till the early 90's with few changes.

I think Edelbrock was associated with Weber/Carter when they were making the aftermarket Edelbrock Q-Jet. I don't think they make them anymore. They were real expensive but I bet they were made good.

 

[440Magnum]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx

I think Edelbrock was associated with Weber/Carter when they were making the aftermarket Edelbrock Q-Jet. I don't think they make them anymore. They were real expensive but I bet they were made good.


As far as I know, Edelbrock just bought the whole production setup from Carter/Weber when Federal Mogul decided to get out of the carb biz. The Thunder Series (AVS) is just spectacularly built- its been a long time since I've bought a piece of mass produced hardware that just oozed quality the way it did when I pulled it out of the box and jetted it for my application. Barry Grant carbs are like that too, maybe even moreso, but they REALLY make you pay.

Sad but true, you're right about the Edelbrock Q-jet:
http://www.carburetion.com/Rochester.asp

Prolly gone way too far off the coolant topic here, but its been interesting.

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
The Thunder Series (AVS) is just spectacularly built- its been a long time since I've bought a piece of mass produced hardware that just oozed quality the way it did when I pulled it out of the box and jetted it for my application. Barry Grant carbs are like that too, maybe even moreso, but they REALLY make you pay.


Yeah I think Edelbrock carbs are good quality. I've heard the Demon carbs weren't very good with quality control at least at one point.

Quote:
Sad but true, you're right about the Edelbrock Q-jet:
http://www.carburetion.com/Rochester.asp


I guess it didn't sell enough. I though the Holley 4010/4011 was a good street carb too but Holley quit making it I believe. Well hopefully the Edelbrock stays around for a long while.

Quote:
Prolly gone way too far off the coolant topic here, but its been interesting.


Yeah it's been interesting, and since it was your thread so I figure you can take it where ever you want to lol.