Fram X2 oil filters

[westex39]

Here is some information I just received from Fram about their X2 oil filters. The numbers look pretty good though. Don't know anything about their internal construction. Anyone have any further information?

Thanks,

The 96% efficiency rating is the Single Pass Efficiency per SAE HS806 using 10 - 20 micron glass beads. I will admit you
have to look pretty hard on the packaging to see this reference. It's in the small print below the larger 96% Single
Pass Efficiency printing.

Thank's for contacting us on this point. I have seen some competitive packaging that states 96% Multi-pass Efficiency
"based on SAE test" and I couldn't find any other reference to what actual test was run.

Some competitors call the Weighted Average Efficiency" test in SAE HS806 the "Multi-pass" or "Mutiple-pass" test which
is misleading. This is actually the "Weighted Average Efficiency" test and measures the efficiency after all the
contaminant circulates through the filter many times over the course of a 6 to 10 hour test. In the Single Pass test
the contaminant only passes through the filter once.

The true Multi-pass test is per SAE J1858. It measures the efficiency at various particle sizes during the test. The X2
filter has a 94% efficiency at >20 microns. The numbers don't correlate exactly with the Single Pass Efficiency test
because the contaminant is different (not spherical, more like short logs of various sizes from 5 - 80 mrcron long).

Thanks again for asking for the details so you can make a more informed decision. I hope you will continue to consider
FRAM filter products.


Regards,


Gary Bilski
Manager, Filter Engineering
Honeywell Consumer Products Group

[ November 14, 2002, 10:42 AM: Message edited by: westex39 ]

 

[jason07-1zzfe]

Even if by chance they do make one good filter, I still would never consider them if only based on principal. Because of the other garbage they make.

...They are owned by Honeywell?? Wonder when that happened? That's disappointing because I thought Honeywell was a good company.

Maybe it happened recently and they will straighten them out.

 

[Patman]

Did we ever find out for sure if the X2 contains cardboard endcaps or not?

I still wouldn't buy it though, as they are pretty much the same price up here as the much better (IMO) K&N oil filter.

 

[MNgopher]

I don't know that the debate was ever settled. I cut open an X2 that is the equivalent of the Motorcraft FL-820s filter and it did indeed have metal end caps. That has been the only Fram filter I've seen with metal end caps in it. Of course, I won't be buying it for use on my vehicles since it costs $10 or more. Other filters with better reputations are availible for less...

Yes, Fram is a product of Honeywell. Allied Signal owned Fram. Allied Signal and Honeywell merged a couple of years back - thus Fram is part of Honeywell.

 

[supertrofeo]

I know that everyone here seems to think Fram is all around crappy, and I'd have to say that I agree after recently disecting one, but I was wondering if anyone has had any ACTUAL/PRACTICAL experience with the x2 or the Toughgard models?

I've considered buying them, but I've noticed that the PureOne Purolator filters are about $4-5 less and have a much better reputation. Up untill recently I've always used the regular Fram or a Quaker State filter, but now that I've found this site I see the error of my ways in thinking that all filters are created equal and I'd like to change. I just don't know what to change to.

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by MNgopher:
I don't know that the debate was ever settled. I cut open an X2 that is the equivalent of the Motorcraft FL-820s filter and it did indeed have metal end caps. ...

---

After I read this I went to the Fram web site and looked at their description and illustration of the X2. Sure enough, it does have metal end caps and they even "advertise" it. The fact that Fram would put metal end caps on what they claim to be their "top of the line" filter should speak volumes to everyone who thinks any ol' Fram filter is a "good filter." A basic component of just about every other company's entire line of filters is only found in Fram's best.

[ December 07, 2002, 01:44 AM: Message edited by: XHVI ]

 

[Pablo]

The only time I have publicly ragged on Fram is because of their crappy antidrainback valves...

What is the design in the X2?

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by Pablo:
The only time I have publicly ragged on Fram is because of their crappy antidrainback valves...

What is the design in the X2?

---

I think you mean their crappy bypass valves. Fram's anti-drainback valves are pretty much like other companies' filters, either nitrile or silcone. Their bypass valves, on the other hand, are cheap plastic rather than metal. Someone would need to cut an X2 open to see if it uses a plastic one.

 

[Pablo]

I did mean the drain back device...on the Fram cheapies, the oil can flow right back out of the filter when the engine is shut down...making for dry starts every time........

 

[cobravenom71]

Kinda new here, but I must admit that I'm shocked that Fram filters have such a bed reputation. Have they always been this way? Or is the parent company just 'whoring' out the good name and reputation that most uninformed motorist have? Very disappointing.
On the other hand, it appears to me that the Wal-mart 'Super-Tech' filters have a fairly good reputation.Is this correct? And only $1.99? Sounds pretty incredible to me.

 

[Mike_dup1]

fyi

Last I checked, the basic Fram, Quaker State and Pennzoil were identical filters in diffenent colors.

A buddy has a service station and I often grab up some of these used filters and cut them open. He was astonished at how cheaply made these are. He sells a lot of QS products but won't use any in his equipment. He uses synthetic in his 1996 Chevy truck and his 2000 H-D......

[ December 07, 2002, 01:35 PM: Message edited by: Mike ]

 

[OneQuartLow]

quote:

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Originally posted by Mike:
fyi

Last I checked, the basic Fram, Quaker State and Pennzoil were identical filters in diffenent colors.

---

Mike, They were the same filters. Fram (Honeywell/Allied) used to make all of them. Somewhere in the last couple years Pennzoil/ Quaker State started buying from Purolator (Arvin Meritor).

Not sure what this means about their quality. Did Arvin Meritor bring cardboard endcaps to Purolator's low-end? I've only noticed the cardboard PremiumPlus filters in the last couple years and AM bought Purolator in '99.

David

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Patman:
Fram used to be good about maybe 15 years ago (or more) but apparently what happened was they got the contract to sell at Walmart, and Walmart made them lower their price to them. So in order to do this, Fram had to cut corners and voila! we have crummy filters. This is a rumor, and I don't know this for fact but it makes sense to me.

---

I don't think there is anything to this. I used to use Fram filters until 1985 when I met a Baldwin filter salesman who was visiting my uncle's Farm. He filled me in on the poor quality of Fram. Being the kind of person I am, I went out and bought a new Fram, a Wix, and an AC. My uncle was intrigued by what I was going to do, so he donated a Baldwin B2 he'd bought for his Ford pickup. We cut them all open, and sure enough, the Fram had cardboard end caps and the thinest media with the least pleats of all those filters. It was obviously junk. The rest of the filters were top notch. I've never used a Fram filter since.

So, I can tell you from my own observation that almost 18 years ago Fram was selling crappy filters--and I don't think there were any Wal-Marts around then.

 

[Patman]

It's possible that in the passing down of the story I just told, that maybe instead of being Walmart, it was Kmart. They were probably around back then. Even though it's just a rumor I heard with no facts to back it up, it does make sense. In the corporate world it is all about the bottom line, and a company with a past reputation for quality can change to cheaper stuff and still sell just based on marketing alone. Even though we "in the know" have seen Frams cut open and how terrible they are, many of the motoring public haven't. And they continue to buy Fram filters by the truckloads, since they are so heavily marketed and so readily available in every single place that sells oil filters. I gotta hand it to Fram, they are successful. It truly would be nice if this new X2 filter is a quality piece, for a change.

I'd love to see someone cut one open and take pics for us! Hint hint!

 

[OneQuartLow]

It's not that they can't make acceptable filters. The X2 looks pretty good by all accounts. I just assume they chose marketing over quality to reach their numbers for the bulk of their products. From a business standpoint it makes some sense. The same worked for Slick50, ProLong & Turboflowulators... though now I'm getting mean.

David

 

[G-MAN]

quote:

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Originally posted by OneQuartLow:
It's not that they can't make acceptable filters. The X2 looks pretty good by all accounts.

---

By all accounts except price. If Fram is indeed charging ten bucks for this filter, they can keep it. What that essentially means is that you have to pay $10 for a Fram filter that has the same level of quality and workmanship as the $1.98 SuperTech.

 

[OneQuartLow]

Agreed. Buy an X2, or pay about the same for a Mobil1 or K&N? Easy decision.

 

[joee12]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Patman:
Fram used to be good about maybe 15 years ago (or more) but apparently what happened was they got the contract to sell at Walmart, and Walmart made them lower their price to them. So in order to do this, Fram had to cut corners and voila! we have crummy filters. This is a rumor, and I don't know this for fact but it makes sense to me.

Fram was simply riding on past reputation while churning out crap. Maybe they are getting better now, who knows, but it'll be a long while before I put one of their filters on my car. Even if the latest stuff is improved, it'll take years for all the crummy old stock to leave the shelves.

---

Patman, that is exactly what happened to Penn Fishing Reels. They used to be the best by far, but unfortunaltely on their less expensive lines of reels($30-$100) they cheapened them to sell at Walmart. On most fishing/boating boards, many people talk about this. -Joe

 

[Patman]

Fram used to be good about maybe 15 years ago (or more) but apparently what happened was they got the contract to sell at Walmart, and Walmart made them lower their price to them. So in order to do this, Fram had to cut corners and voila! we have crummy filters. This is a rumor, and I don't know this for fact but it makes sense to me.

Fram was simply riding on past reputation while churning out crap. Maybe they are getting better now, who knows, but it'll be a long while before I put one of their filters on my car. Even if the latest stuff is improved, it'll take years for all the crummy old stock to leave the shelves.

 

[MNgopher]

I still have my X2 that I cut open and I recently gained access to a digital camera. I will see what I can do... Filter is the equivalent of the Motorcraft FL-820s, used on modular V8's (4.6l, and 5.4l), and the V10 (6.8l).